AIBU to say that summer hols are a driver of inequality

[Teaandcrisps]

Myself and OH have had mixed personal fortune over the last 10 years - so from personal experience know the difference.

Summer holidays with no money is shit - especially when the weather is crap. If you can afford it however, it's great fun.

It's not just the obvious things - summer hols, trips, activities, camps, increase in food costs; it's also if you have the kind of job that can give you time off.

Given that food bank have launched the holiday hunger campaign, AIBU to say that summer holidays is an unequal construct and the 6-weeks off needs to go.

Music camp is absolutely for pretty serious musicians. You don’t just randomly send your child for a week or two when they don’t play or aren’t musical

Obviously, they have to play an instrument, but they don’t have to be ‘serious musicians’.

My dc are both good at their respective instruments (cello and clarinet) but they’re far from being prodigies, and certainly have no plans of pursuing music as a career.

The orchestra camps we send them on (such as the annual one at Uppingham School) has a higher and lower orchestra for both wind and strings, so that all children can play at their level. And there are lots of activities in the evenings (including a trip to a LaserQuest), so it’s not just about music.

They go primarily because it’s fun.

Actually the subsidised childcare for 3yos is term time only. Many nurseries will spread it over 12 months to make it easier for parents to budget.

Honestly give it a few weeks to they are back in school the homework started and your back into the daily grind and you'll be wishing they were back off.

@Teaandcrisps we pay. The ones I pay for have been
A camp run by a local nursery which was 50 for one child or 90 for 2 children for the week. The hours were 9.00- 12.45. (Which is just a little less than a school day here.

Another one my dd did was a gymnastics camp which was 65 for the week. It was from 8.45 -12 also.

She did a swim/sports camp last year which was 80 for the week and the hours were 9-3

There are many public buildings that stay open all year round and still need maintenance

Our local library was closed recently for a couple of months whilst essential repairs were made. DH’s work office was moved entirely last year-they all moved to an office halfway across the London borough so work could take place on the building. Repairs have to happen.

m not sure why you concluded i would say no child should do them because some children cant afford to? There is a recognised summer slip that impacts poor children more than wealthier ones. I was suggesting the reason igoes beyond poor families not 'reading a bedtime story'

Because I couldn't work out what else you meant.

Funding been cut for years - meaning less services. schools are struggling with less money.

The recognised summer slip also seems to have come from countries with much longer breaks it's not clear it it’s the same with just 6 weeks.

A lot of the subsidy’s schemes were council run or funded as they face funding crisis they've gone. As PPs have said where there is money changes in volunteer numbers or way funding is divided up has meant fewer groups as well.

I don’t see that more school or tinkering when school holidays are is going to change any of this.

Actually the subsidised childcare for 3yos is term time only. Many nurseries will spread it over 12 months to make it easier for parents to budget

I mean it’s worth considering given the government aiming to encourage women back into work, only to find that once their kids are in school they struggle again.

Anecdotally, when I was considering whether I wanted to be a SAHM, childcare for the summer holidays was MORE than a term at DD’s private school. That’s insane.

@BelleSausage

What we should be asking for is more paid leave, banning zero hours contracts and higher minimum wage.

Yes!! I can’t get over the difference between uk and Ireland. Min wage is 9.80 but a lot of places offer more (10-12euro)

Also we have rules here around zero hour contracts
www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/business/work/new-law-aimed-at-curbing-zero-hours-contracts-comes-into-effect-1.3812802%3fmode=amp

The last page of this post is really odd - orchestra clubs? Calling SS because you have no money to feed yourself? Race to the bottom? Extend benefits rather than re-structure existing public investment?

Returning to the point of this thread is that for some families and children, holidays are extremely tough. Holiday hunger is real, access to clubs is largely based on wealth or parental availability.

I'm so pleased for some posters who have gardens to fill up water balloons, have enough money to make trays of sandwiches for the street with lashings of ginger beer no doubt.

This is not the world for everyone and the school holiday system currently works for folks with money, and absolutely does not work for those without.

Something need to change.

It's so lovely in suburbia having no jammed roads for 6 weeks.

Leave the holidays as they are.

@Teaandcrisps

People are trying to offer different solutions to the overly simplistic ‘just cancel the holidays’.

Will cancelling the school holidays actually solve this problem or will it just mask the greater disease? Why not actually tackle to root causes rather than getting a generation of children to pay for it with their precious free time.

There have been an number of studies done on the link between loss of freetime and playtime and the rise of mental health problems in children.

Cost of living is higher in Ireland though

Something need to change.

You keep saying this. It doesn’t make it true. It’s your opinion and doesn’t mean other people feel the same.

JacquesHammer I don't get your logic. Once beyond subsidised preschool childcare why would parents struggle more? The actual subsidised hours must be the same over the year.

If it's a budgeting issue and parents maybe need to keep a little back over the term time to cover the holidays.

Something need to change

So the opportunities of most kids need to be reduced, so that they don’t have more than anyone else?

What about trying to raise the poorer children up?

You seem to be strangely in favour of a race to the bottom.

There have been an number of studies done on the link between loss of freetime and playtime and the rise of mental health problems in children.

This is a big thing imo.

A lot of children are unable to amuse themselves. They are so used to instruction and plans that given free choice they just don’t know what to do with themselves.

On the first morning of our playschemes we have a a bit of a free for all. It lets the children see what equipment and activities there are, and let’s us get an idea where the children naturally gravitate towards that week (as it changes depending on the kids - some weeks art is crammed busy and sport is quiet and other times vice versa).

More and more we are having to be hands-on because some children are just overwhelmed by the choice. We get asked “what should I do?” or “what am I allowed to do?” even though we’ve already explained that for the first hour everyone can do what they like and then we’ll sit down all together over snack time and make a plan for the week.

The difference in the last hour on the Thursday (we go on a trip on a Friday) when the same thing is repeated is phenomenal because over the week they’ve got used to more freedom. In the kids who come for two weeks that’s magnified again.

It’s also a big thing for funders (and to a lesser extent Ofsted) and we’re asked more and more to show how we are encouraging free play and relaxation, when previously it was more structured.

tea wouldn't it be just as bad or worse in October- money to heat house, dc hungrier in cold weather.

Why spoil the 6 weeks holiday for the majority

Once beyond subsidised preschool childcare why would parents struggle more? The actual subsidised hours must be the same over the year

Because of the sheer cost of childcare. As I said when I had a look into it, 6 weeks childcare cost more than a term’s school fees. There are waiting lists for years.

I think people do plan ahead, but would you think to sign up for holiday childcare when your child was three weeks old?

and parents maybe need to keep a little back over the term time to cover the holidays

And that assumes everyone has enough to “keep a little back”. Not everyone is!

I acknowledge how privileged I am to have not needed childcare, and to have enough money. It must be hellish for those struggling, especially those for whom circumstances change.

@Passthecherrycoke A’s someone who used to live in the I’m I think it’s not THAT much more to be honest
Over in uk I had council tax, water rates and less pay. Here I have no council tax, no water bill and a higher pay (for less hours at that!) and actually when I added it up a higher tax free allowance. Also in the uk we got no child benefits. Here in Ireland we get 280 per month for 2 children (which is more than you get n the uk for 2 children)

If it's a budgeting issue and parents maybe need to keep a little back over the term time to cover the holidays.

The point you seem to be missing is that parents don’t have it to keep back.

That’s what is different, and that’s what is having a massive negative impact on children.

*live in the UK

In term time, my inner city primary school offers free wrap around care (including free breakfast) for ALL pupils, as so many of our parents are working poor, working all hours. Staff provide this service in our own time.
I would love to see subsidised or free quality holiday provision for pupils on pupil premium. Heavily subsidised holiday care is common in some European countries.
I hate the first week back after the holidays and avoid the 'Let's talk about what we did in the holidays!' topic like the plague. Loads of our kids have had a shit, hungry, totally understimulated time, with parents stretched to the limit. Actually, this is true whether parents are working or not, many parents really struggle to have the children home all the time; my own DP, who has quite crippling anxiety at times, finds it trying to spend weeks on end together, with the overwhelming expectation being that we should be #making memories.

One of the best things I’ve seen locally is the introduction of one school being open to provide lunch through the holidays for children entitled to a free lunch.

They increased the uptake by inviting non-fsm families to send their children. You book a week in advance. Now that the stigma of “there’s all the fsm kids going for lunch” was removed the uptake is much higher.

DS (not entitled) and his two friends (I think one is, not sure on the other) have been several times to catch up with mates.

However, that has involved staffing costs and not every council will do, or be able to do, that.

Surley it would be better to put more servcies in for struggling families during holidays than have all chidlren in school for more of the year.

In term time, my inner city primary school offers free wrap around care (including free breakfast) for ALL pupils, as so many of our parents are working poor, working all hours. Staff provide this service in our own time.

Is this teachers or support staff? Is it purely voluntary/unpaid?

Church holiday clubs sometimes run in the summer but not all day