Family in law/pass the baby

[Hundredsandthousands2019]

Honest opinions needed…

My partner is half Spanish and we’ve been together for 10 years. Last year we had a LO. I wouldn’t say I’ve ever had an easy relationship with his parents (particularly his mum), but since having LO things have become very difficult and tense.

Some examples being – when we told his parents we were having baby the reaction was happy but very quickly the conversation turned to child-rearing and how important it is not to shout at children/how childhood trauma lasts a lifetime etc. The importance of paternal parents access to the grandchildren was also been hinted at lots. Through pregnancy MIL didn’t show much interest in talking about LO or my wellbeing.

Since LO has been born they’ve been to visit lots of times (including staying nearby for a week 3 days after she was born). Each visit has been stressful. I may have high expectations – but it has always seemed that they are just coming to see the LO and not at all interested in me. I feel a little like an incubator! When our LO was 2mo they visited and told us how upset they were by our choice of surname for the LO (we double-barrelled and took my MIL’s maiden name as my partner’s contribution). Their most recent visit my MIL spent 20 minutes crying in the bathroom because my partner asked her (abruptly) to speak English at the table (I don’t speak Spanish).

So most recently we went to Spain to visit family. MIL and FIL were also there. It is probably a big cultural clash – but there was an expectation to play pass the baby. LO is 8mo and clingy and I’ve never been keen on passing her around. There were lots of comments from MIL and partner’s aunty insinuating they should be feeding her/putting her down for a nap (no easy task!)/changing her etc. They also crowd around LO and are very intense. There’s constant stroking/squeezing/photos being taken/being all in her face. I find it so difficult watching people be like that with her. My partner finds it really difficult and says it reminds him of when he was little and desperately trying to get away from his aunty smothering him. It’s obviously all out of love, but it’s a bit suffocating and I find it disrespectful of my LO’s space. Another example is that if one of us is holding our LO they will always be trying to take her from us. And if one of them is holding the LO it is difficult to get her back, there’s a lot of hesitation.

My partner got very annoyed one day and snapped at his mum to stop interfering with LO so much, just to let her play. To which his aunty got involved and said ‘the one time she gets to see the LO and you’re like this’. My MIL ended up leaving the room in tears and stayed in her bedroom the rest of the evening.

The next day things became very heated - they all ended up in tears, my partner was pinned against the wall and was accused of breaking the family apart. The message from his family was that we are being uptight, that the LO is everyone’s equal responsibility so they should have unlimited access, that we are guests in their home so they should be able to behave how they like, that it is done out of love so shouldn’t be a problem. They absolutely refused to see the point (please give the LO some space) and respect it.

Are we being mental? What does anyone think about any of these points? I’ve well and truly rambled - sorry

My partner had about 3 relatives crowd him into the wall, shouting hysterically, stopping him from leaving

That's even worse imo.

Don’t visit them, obviously. If ILs want to come over, they do it on your terms. End of story. That is your child, not theirs.

They arent Spanish but my ILs are the same. The minutes they see my DD they grab her and flap around her waving toy after toy in her face or kissing/cuddling her and passing her around all and sundry in the room while she gets more and more stressed until she screams. Then because she will only settle for me I'm accused of coddling her/ruining her.

In all honesty I stopped visiting. I took the opinion that my DDs happiness is more important and that they will eventually calm down and stop stressing her out.

That sounds awful OP. You're her mum and in my books, what you say should be respected. I appreciate that there may be a cultural difference but it does sound quite stressful. It's good your DP is on side with you. I think I'd try and limit contact a little.

Could you try sitting MiL down and explaining how it makes you feel, as a mother, to see if she can understand the way you're feeling? It might calm down a little as your DD gets older.

Odd that they were annoyed that you had double barrelled her surname, I thought that was what the Spanish always did with surnames

But yeah they sound way too much

Gosh that's tough! They sound very over bearing! All i can say is try to distance yourself and keep away feom their drama. Sorry i dont have real advice but i am sympathetic.

They sound a good deal more than overbearing.

I would seriously be packing and leaving.

Pinned him against the wall? Holy fuck! I don’t think the nationality is relevant, I’ve never known anything like that having lived in Spain. They need to calm the heck down. I’d say no visits over there unless staying in a hotel so you can escape and enforce rules when they see you. Your baby, your rules.

I think you're being a bit precious about the family wanting a hold of the baby when you visit, but your MIL sounds batshit and the rest of the family's behaviour towards you and your partner is unacceptable.

If it's a "their house, their rules" scenario then I just wouldn't go back to their house. I think your partner should be honest with them about this, too. And make very clear that the child is yours and your partner's - she's not somehow the "property" of the wider family. Regardless of tradition, you're raising her how you both see fit.

They can hardly be surprised - presumably at least your partner had to take leave from work to visit them - when the visit was so thoroughly unpleasant for you all, why on earth would you want to repeat the experience?

Allow them to visit (arranging their own accomodation) when it suits you and your partner.

I guess nationality/culture shouldn’t be an issue. His FIL has repeatedly told us just to grin and bear it because it’s all well-intentioned culture differences

I did start to learn Spanish early on in our relationship but life got in the way. I understand most of what’s said but can’t speak it. And I actually feel self-conscious about speaking it in front of them now because throughout pregnancy and since LO has been born there’s been pressure from DH’s family for me to learn it. We’ve had numerous subtle (and obvious) lectures about it. My partner does intend to teach LO Spanish and we’re aware of the benefits.

Thanks so much for the replies. I don’t know why there’s been so much self-doubt. Guess it’s been years worth of it!

My DP is Greek Cypriot and has a huge family, so I know exactly what you are going through. My DP has told his family off on several occasions to do with our DC and that’s all your DP can do from his side, they won’t change while they have a hole in their arse! If it’s consolation, I’ve been with my DP for 28 years, I lived in Cyprus for five years prior to having kids, and even learned to read and write Greek at night school after work twice a week so that the old witch of a MIL couldn’t talk about me behind my back in front of me without me knowing. Now, the MIL thinks I’m wonderful, so much has happened in the past few years to change her way of thinking, but I have a long memory, I can’t forget how nasty and spiteful she has been in the past (glad she lives 2000 miles away). I guess what I’m saying is at least your DP is backing you and in that culture, parents mean everything so it’s not so easy for him culturally. The pass the baby thing I remember vaguely, worse was when they would light up whilst sitting with my DC when tiny and either myself or DP would swoop in and rescue the child before they were burnt or inhaled cigarette smoke! To be fair to my dreadful MIL though, she was never that interested in my DC at all, and that suited me perfectly, she was worried about future inheritance!

I'm half Spanish also. I have a one year old, and neither my English nor my Spanish relatives have behaved in that way with my child at all. I don't know where you get this is a cultural thing. Here people make more fuss of kids, but apart from that the rest is down to personality. Your mil is a pain in the backside, Spanish , English, Chinese or from Mars. And as for manhandling your husband...what kind of wacos are you visiting? I have never seen something like that in my family. It is not normal in anyone's standards. And by the way, time you learnt Spanish, you married into this culture and have kids who are part Spanish, being bilingual is a gift not to be disdained.

The cultural thing is from my FIL, who has always explained any disagreements we’ve had with MIL or her family as due to culture. I now see from responses on here and stepping back that this has probably been used as an excuse for universal bad behaviour. The explanations usually come with a criticism that English culture (ie. me) is seen by Spanish people as cold, unfeeling and formal. Huge sweeping generalisations and I feel embarrassed now to think I could have believed everything could be explained as ‘culture’.

Another point though - why do you think it’s important that I learn Spanish? DH only speaks to his mum in Spanish and otherwise doesn’t use it day to day, which is why he’s finding it hard speaking it to LO. I’m keen for him to start though and feel happy in the knowledge I’d understand what they were saying to each other and may even learn from them. Genuinely would like to know why it’s important for me to speak it, when lots of children are raised bilingual by each parent speaking their own native language to them (Spanish is not DHs native language btw)

I get it OP and I also believe the “cultural difference” thing allows the outlaws to behave badly, nonetheless it is true, they do see us as being uptight and very formal, mine feel the same. As for the language thing, I wanted to learn the lingo so that I could understand the outlaws slagging me off whilst we were at family gatherings and suchlike, and trust me, they did it on many occasions! My DP can speak and understand Greek, but he never speaks it, even to his mother, but when she starts speaking in Greek to him, guaranteed it’ll be something she doesn’t want me or my kids to hear, the old witch! She doesn’t do it anymore since I called her out on it a few times!

BTW, my kids are not bilingual, they only know a few words of Greek, my DP just doesn’t use it unless he really has to, hasn’t really used it since he did the army over there.

Obviously don't stay at their house again. If you do go to visit Spain stay in a hotel or Airbnb and meet them out. If they come to visit you, meet them out and about, for lunch or dinner etc. As for learning Spanish, do it if YOU want to, not because they insist. It's not obligatory and your child doesn't have to be bilingual.

When we visit in-laws overseas we try to do a couple of days with them go somewhere for a few nights then another night or two with them. If they are awful stay in an Airbnb near them a couple of nights, go off for a few days and go back for a night or two. I actually find visiting in-laws overseas easier than having them here as I can get out of their home but can’t kick them out of mine. But they’re not that bad, just a culture/language issue.

It's not cultural as PIL do this and DD (1) hates it. The pressure on me to get her to perform the way they wanted her to was so bad that it contributed greatly to my PND. I was being told constantly that she should know who GPs are and that she should be doing overnights away from me at a few weeks old (we refused and their instance now makes me refuse me). DD being very unwell and in special care didnt seem to factor in. She would just melt in to tears and appear overwhelmed and quite fearful of the situation. It was only when friends visited and waited for her to settle calmly that I saw who ludicrous PIL are. When DD cries because they've crowded her, MIL will try emotional blackmail in a similar dramatic way, walking from room to room chanting 'oh wicked GM', no one likes wicked GM'. It isn't cultural at all.

Yanbu.

As your child gets older, you’ll find you have less tolerance for this type of BS and more confidence on telling people to back off. In your shoes, I would have either booked other accommodations until my flight or booked the cheapest flight back I could find. Don’t put up with their BS.

I have a Spanish MIL with similar qualities to yours so you have my sympathy. Our DD is over a year now but I was very much just the incubator and they were also furious that DD was given my surname (they refuse to acknowledge it) despite MIL (apparently) fully supporting me not changing my name on marriage because they dont do that in Spain!

In the early days I found MIL suffocating everytime I was in the room with the baby she would instruct me to "Give her to me", it came to a head over Christmas when she did it all the time including when it came to opening the presents. I walked out in the end and left them to it I was so cross. I have gone low contact since, she has a very controlling, poor me personality and I find it draining. I don't really want my DD being about her and as a normally confident independent person she really pushes a button with me and I feel like a child in her presence. Until I find a suitable mechanism for coping in her company I would rather avoid it, or keep meetings short. Its not ideal but its where we are. Good luck, I would put a certain amount of their behaviour to being spanish, but some of it is clearly not on.

I always loved it when anyone wanted to hold my babies

You need to learn to speak Spanish because your child is half Spanish and if you don't make an effort to learn it shows your child that that part of her heritage isn't important. Also, your parents in law don't speak English well so being able to communicate with them might make things a bit easier. I don't think your MIL should be forced to speak English to her son when you are there.

But i am wondering why your DH speaks Spanish to his parents if it isn't his native language?

When our LO was 2mo they visited and told us how upset they were by our choice of surname for the LO (we double-barrelled and took my MIL’s maiden name as my partner’s contribution

So not your DHS surname plus yours but your mil maiden name plus yours. To be fair, that's quite unusual.

As for the rest, yabu. It's seems to be a very british, modern, middle class and precious phenomenon that mothers dislike other relatives holding their baby. Of course if you live in different countries, they'll all want to hold her.

You also said your dh told her abruptly to speak English...no wonder she was upset.

FIL is English and MIL has lived in this country longer than she lived in Spain, so language isn’t an issue when conversing with PIL. DH grew up in UK and only ever spoke Spanish to his mum, but is fluent as a result.

I also think it’s really important that when you’re a guest at someone’s house and if everyone can speak a common language, you use the common language. Otherwise it’s excluding the person/people that don’t speak the other language. When we go to Spain I don’t have conversations with DH at the dinner table in English - it would seem really rude considering there’s people at the table who don’t speak English. Historically my MIL has used the language as a tool to exclude, eg. whole 20 min car journeys (me in the back seat) merrily talking Spanish to my DH. DH was also at fault, but I guess we were young at the time and not really clued up. In recent years my DH has explained to his mum that to promote a good relationship we should be open about what’s being said. I’m open to hearing different opinions on this also!

I’m not sure I agree that by not learning Spanish I’d be denying the importance of LO’s heritage. But I can see that if MIL thinks that way also it would look as though I’m rejecting her perhaps?!

@Zakana makes a good point, if you spoke Spanish your Mil wouldn’t be able to exclude you or bitch about you in front of you. It might make a big difference.