Petrified of people’s lack of care to our climate

[delusionalnights]

I just wish more people would cut flying down, go vegan/vegetarian or at least cut down meat, consume and waste less, have less children etc.

I hardly ever fly despite being able to afford long distance holidays because I’m terrified of climate change. We’re in a climate crisis and it’s not getting better. We now have less than 18 months before it’s irreversible, irrelevant of the carbon emissions we cut back after those 18 months have gone as it will have reached a tipping point.

People will lose their homes. There will be mass migration. The fucking Amazon is on fire. Please everyone, do your part and I know big cooperations and companies have a much larger part to play but the change starts with average people, it’s supply and demand, we demand less products, they supply less, hence emissions lowering.

Please everyone do your bit.

Considering the amazon is being farmed for Soy and Meat I'm not sure why becoming vegetarian is going to help, especially considering the air/sea miles needed to fund a proper vegan diet.

You can be concerned about the environment, but stop this faux "petrified" nonsense and hamming it up.

Especially as you are no doubt using smart phone that uses rare earth minerals, more than likely own a car etc etc.

Until China/India et al come on board what we do in the UK wont make any difference what so ever, it's fine professing on an anonymous forum but if the UK/Europe where to implement full on environmentalist policies it would make all the talk of no deal brexit seem small fry.

@SciFiRules

Well clearly many people here agree with my ‘preachy’ attitude!

I don’t demonstrate ‘righteousness’ at the dinner bloody table. Many friends are meat eaters and only mention it when we discuss climate issues. I don’t sit down and say ‘Oh Olivia, I see you’re ordering a steak, you’re fucking the world up’

I boycott many companies which aren’t eco friendly, my teenage DD and lovely DSD go on the London student climate strikes monthly. We do our bit.

Is no one going to mention the even bigger fires in Africa?

The 90's and early 2000s saw fires in the Amazon just as bad as this year, funny enough when the slash and burn clearing technique was widely used, which is on the rise again after a lot of international effort in changing things. It burns every year, just not as badly- people seem more bothered now as it is likely to affect them in the future; but as it brings attention to the issue that is a good thing, and can push for change again. Everyone should do what they can, although a lot of the major impact will be from the top, there are a lot of us and it all adds up. Birth rates are also quite dramatically falling in the UK and a lot of the world, depsite the fact that people seem to think everyone is popping out tonnes of kids.

@delusionalnights how do they travel to the climate protests in London?

It’s simplistic to say we can turn it all around with consumer choices.

It is, but on the same level the most vocal envormentalists I have met irl recently all own pets (which food is bulked out by soy from brazil) and have a huge disconnect to their green credentials and modern technology when they want the latest phone/fit bit/alexa/smart tv etc etc.

Everyone half arses being "green", when some try and make out they are "petrified" is where it turns others that could do more, off.

Genuine question here and I’m not being goady.

Is it better for me to eat local organic meat that was in fields a few miles from home, sent to a local abattoir and then to the local butchers. Or to be eating more pulses, fruits and vegetables that have been flown across the world?

I’m doing my best but as I’ve said on a previous thread a lot of it comes down to money. I can’t afford to travel a 40 mile round trip to fill my jars and pay more for the privilege. I can’t afford to always buy the ethical and sustainable versions of things I want.

I get you OP. We have two kids, and won’t be having more because I’m terrified of what they will grow up to face.
We haven’t flown in 5 years and won’t again. Have become vegan. Buy organic, locally sourced food and grow some of our own. Recycle and compost as much as possible. Don’t use single use plastics. And we keep our waste and consumerism to a minimum. Minimise our hot water and heating use. We also protest and lobby for system change and divestment in fossil fuels.
And believe me, I loved travelling, eating meat, having long hot baths etc etc. But we just don’t do it anymore. I’m a working professional and so is DH, so have very little time, but still manage to cope with these adjustments.
The research is terrifying. I’m no longer worried about anything else but this.

Is no one going to mention the even bigger fires in Africa?

It's not a game of gotcha, why do people do this?

However it could be that a "right leaning" puppet goverment has taken control of brazil so there is a lot more focus on it, however they do have substantial fires every year and there are reports from isis that maybe point to most of the fires being on already agricultural land, it's too tricky to tell.

Every generation has a panic attack about something that kill all humans.

This generation panicking about climate
Generation before about millennium and environment (hole in ozone, pollution, extinction)
Generation before panicked about USSR and US nuclear war, then AIDS epidemic killing everyone.
Generation before about Nazis and WWII
Generation before about WWI
Generation before about famine
And so on.

It is why we love love love apocalypse movies. It is in our psyche. But reality is world will keep going.

Why are you assuming most people aren’t doing their bit? You have no idea what I do or don’t do and posting a list of steps you take dues to make you any better than me.

It is very unhelpful for posters to try to silence you OP by trying to call you a hypocrite. We are all hypocrites. We cannot help it. We live in a system dependent on fossil fuels and reliant on world debt, growth economies and consumerism. We are all implicated in this. But it is not our faults, and by trying to silence each other, we are avoiding the conversations that need to happen to give us even a chance of mitigating the disaster we are facing.
The perfect should not be the enemy of the good. We need to be able to talk about climate change, not resort to blame, and most importantly lobby and protest to bring about change.

That should say “ does not make you any better than me”

how do they travel to the climate protests in London?

Unironically the ones i know traveled by a deisel bus in the UK, in the US where I work some hopped on a plane and even made sure they had a coffee and streamed it live on their phones.

Everyone has a mental red line of what being an environmentalist is

We also need to all do what we can personally. Flying is the single activity any individual can do in terms of carbon emissions. Anyone who really wants to reduce their emissions needs to stop flying.

Single worst activity I meant

I’m also of the opinion that all this virtue signalling is more of a UK and Western Europe phenomenon. In Eastern Europe recently there was masses of single use plastic and cars / motorbikes / flights. A mention of the environment brought blank looks. I suspect there are many countries much much bigger than the UK where climate is not even an after thought, let alone at the forefront of people’s minds when ordering a meat dish.

I’m not an environmentalist because I consume same as everyone else. I don’t expect other people to be zero waste and carbon neutral because I’m not, and I understand it’s really hard.

What I do expect is for all of us to take it seriously and make choices about what we can sacrifice to improve our own individual footprint.

It’s not panic. 17 of the hottest years have been in the last 20 years.
This is happening.
97% of the worlds environmental scientists agree it’s happening.

It is very unhelpful for posters to try to silence you OP by trying to call you a hypocrite.

No it isn't, the OP has started a thread in which she is apparently "petrified"

We are all hypocrites

Glad you admit it, yet we shouldn't highlight this to the OP?

We live in a system dependent on fossil fuels and reliant on world debt, growth economies and consumerism. We are all implicated in this. But it is not our faults, and by trying to silence each other, we are avoiding the conversations that need to happen to give us even a chance of mitigating the disaster we are facing.

What, of course we are all to blame, I am sure you are one of the rare anonymous posters who would happily pay more for fruit and veg and only eat seasonal veg that wouldn't need intensive farming, I'm sure you would be happy with your phone from years ago and not chased the latest model or succumb to the latest fashion trends and still wear hand me downs from your gran.

Consumerism is a two way street, trying to put all the blame onto the "other" and effectively wanting an authoritative government as to what we should buy/enjoy etc is a complete cop out of personal responsibility.

The OP is being dramatic with being Petrified whilst using a smart phone and all the luxury of a weatern lifestyle, to try and berate others is hypocrisy 101

"I boycott many companies which aren’t eco friendly, my teenage DD and lovely DSD go on the London student climate strikes monthly. We do our bit."

Students taking an additional day of liesure will probably not influence global warming other than annoying people getting to work. Your last line "we do our bit" was exactly the preachy line I would expect worm a forthright vegan/veggie demonstrating their virtues. I'm not ignoring climate change because I choose to eat meat.

@CalmAndQuiet that’s not true, having a child is the worst single thing a person can do in terms of carbon emissions. It’s been widely publicised.

I fly long haul because that's where I had to go to get vital medical treatment for my son. I'm not going to stop. You crack on. Personally, I think it's beyond a cheek to preach to others to stop having kids after you've already procreated.

What I do expect is for all of us to take it seriously and make choices about what we can sacrifice to improve our own individual footprint.

Being environmentalist isn't a fringe issue anymore, but it will take world leaders to make the change, considering you own products made in china as you are currently online its a little over dramatic to be petrified.

Telling everyone to consider becoming vegan is the lowest rung of the ladder, espeically considering the amazon is being burnt (reportedly) for Soy and Beef it wont slow down for if we all stopped eating beef and still has massive enviromental impacts. You using a smart phone where rare earth metals are being mined so much that China is now "investing" in africa is where your "green credentials" fall down massively.

In Eastern Europe recently there was masses of single use plastic and cars / motorbikes / flights. A mention of the environment brought blank looks.

ceoworld.biz/2018/12/04/these-european-countries-are-the-best-and-worst-at-recycling-plastic-waste/
I am from what considers an Eastern Europe and we are much better in recycling. We even take glass bottles back to shops.
Emissions are higher predominantly because gas is really expensive so many use coal. Which is a problem, but change takes a long time.