To think re-marking GCSE shouldn't be a 'no win, no fee' style gamble?

[MarvellousMonsters]

Eldest has just got GCSE results, all 7, 8, 9 so we are very happy with them. However today we got emails saying some are within 2 marks of the next grade, and we can have them re-marked. The catch is, if the grade stays the same we will have to pay £50 per paper, (if the grade goes up there's no charge) and each GCSE has 2 or 3 papers, meaning asking for re-marking is effectively gambling £200-£300 per GCSE.

A friend is a teacher at a different school and they don't charge anything for re-marking.

Is our school BU?

If I am unhappy with the standard of one of my examiners on a question, then I back read everything on that question they have marked to date and we have an in depth conversation. They then mark that question in batches of 20, with me back reading each batch, til I am happy.

@chomalungma

I can't speak from personal experience , however DC is a teacher (stem) And marks 'A ' level papers. The training was quite rigorous , involving an overnight stay at a venue followed by discussion/moderation groups after to try to ensure consistency. DC was actually employed to specifically mark papers where the candidates had the correct answer but their working did not follow the standard formula for that problem. DC was required to look at the working and decide whether it was a valid method for that question, or whether they had happened upon a correct answer by accident. Given that DC teaches a subject where the is a massive shortage of specialist teachers, I imagine the same applies to exam markers. I know that DC worked extremely long hours as a marker, whilst fitting it around their teaching responsibilities.

I know it's easy to say markers should be better trained etc, but I think it must be so easy for them to make an error, especially when you consider it comes towards the end of the academic year when they have been giving their all to try to ensure their students are fully prepared for the exams.

Subjects in question are Maths (currently 8) and Physics (currently grade 7) the maths is 3 papers, each potentially costing £48.50 (£145 total) and the Physics is 2 papers each at £37.55 (£75 total)

Ugh. Decisions decisions.

but you don't need to remark every paper : just the key ones.

I hope you know that 7, 8 and 9s are an amazing achievement in these new exams?!! And to be honest, they'll mean piddly squat, as your child moves forward and achieves other things in life in any case. They're just s small stepping stone and shouldn't be used as a measure of intelligence (which comes in many different styles, not just in a literary way). The kids have all worked flipping hard to pass these exams. And well done to every kid who sat them at all! My youngest, 12, is already on the Collins framework for higher tier GCSE maths (I know that's a bit different to the 'norm') and will undoubtedly be predicted to achieve 8 and 9s in the STEM subjects, four years from now. But he has a wonderful attitude to it. He likes a challenge and sets himself high targets but understands that a) we'll be proud of him for trying his best and b) that there is time and many routes after school that he can take to get to where he wants to be. Teachers have mentioned Cambridge to him, but he's already asking about apprenticeships, with day release, as a more viable and practical option (sensible boy!). The point is, even if he got 8s or 7s in those subjects, me, dad and our son will be saying..."JOB DONE now move on"!...

Oops, meant to say: "They're just a small stepping stone and shouldn't be used as the only measure of intelligence (which comes in many different styles, not just in a literary way). Sorry for the typo :) oh and just to add, 3 summers ago I took maths pre an Access Dip to uni. I got an A in my mocks but B in the actual GCSE re anxiety (I easy on beta blockers just for the exams and had special conditions/ quieter room etc... I wanted to resit for the A/A in the November until the course director of the science access course asked me why and told me I was putting myself under unnecessary pressure as I'd already done what I needed to! My kids and hubby were SO proud of my B grade (AQA full course done in 10 months) and the access course director taught me a BIG lesson that day! She was so right...

Ugh. Decisions decisions

If your child is doing any of these at A-level, then really there's no point remarking them as it's the A-levels that will count.

chomalungma: And if you took a Btec L3 in your chosen subject the same would apply, wouldn't it (rhetorical)? For those practical and strongly visual learners who haven't achieved 6, 7, 8 and 9s: they need to be reassured more that a lot of (sensible) employers are wising up to our literary exam system and its true value in terms of practical ability/potential over knowledge. They are just as credible in front of employers!

I strongly believe that Btec and other diplomas should be an alternative to GCSEs for all learners. They are modular for a start and are a million miles better at drawing strengths and weaknesses, unlike GCSEs. But that's a different thread for another day :)

There needs to be better marking training
Precisely what aspects would you like to see changed or maybe you know nothing about it, which is far more likely?

I may not be the training that is the problem. I think it is more the case that the markers aren't always as qualified as you would expect. A friend was a marker while being a SAHM for a few years. It was actually 20 years since she had done a degree in the subject. She hadn't been a teacher and while her previous job (before being a SAHM) was loosely related to her degree it wasn't that related. This may not be such a big deal for subjects that are reasonably easy to mark but if they do a similar thing for more subjective subjects such as English or History then the marks could be way out particularly at A level.

The process is different between private fee paying schools and state comprehensives.

When it comes to exams all children are not the same as far as exam boards are concerned. It's diabolical.

If that's true then 'yes', what a sham!

My family is completely despondent with the whole mainstream ed in any case. Sir Ken Robinson was so right, all those years ago, when he gave his TED talk 'education kills creativity'. EVERYONE: do watch it on YouTube, if you haven't already (most teachers will have seen it/know about it.).
We are living in an outdated, archaic system, resistant to change out of fear, nothing more. Government are terrified of adapting to the new world because most people in it are 'academic' and don't understand (if not fear) the super-creative minds of the more practical learners.

Food for thought... A few years ago, our creative industries we're bringing £70billion to the UK economy. Funny how we still rated those subjects down in schools and still insist on memory tests.

Just airing an opinion - GCSEs and A levels seriously need to revolutionise into something 'more now'...

Everyone: whatever your child got in their GCSEs, just be proud of them and encourage them to move on!

brassbrass I’m afraid that’s untrue. The process remains exactly the same whether you took the exam in a hospital, a PRU, a comprehensive, a grammar, a crammer, an international school or a public school.

What is different is the numbers encouraged to submit papers for review of marking, to apply for special consideration and to have assessment for dyslexia are far higher from the independent sector. That is not the fault of exam boards.
Markers and reviewers of marking have no idea which school the child they are reviewing papers attends.

brassbrass I’m afraid that’s untrue. The process remains exactly the same whether you took the exam in a hospital, a PRU, a comprehensive, a grammar, a crammer, an international school or a public school.
This!
There's enough genuine issues with exam boards, marking and moderation without stirring it up

Yes yabu.

1. your maths in your op is way off, but you appear to have realised that.

2. it's the exam board that set the fee, not the school, so this is nothing to do with the school. Schools have very tight budgets as it is, so it is unreasonable to ask them to take on this extra cost.

If you do want them remarked, then go ahead, but grades can go up as well as down.

It's also not true that only A-levels matter: competitive courses are increasingly looking at GCSEs as well, due to grade inflation.

When we looked into it (selective comprehensive) the headmaster said the private school parents didn't pay fees for re-marks and and their deadlines were different. I apologise I don't remember exact details but I do remember a heated conversation with him about the inequalities of what was on offer between private and state 🤷

What @Pumpkintopf said. Also, if the paper is 1-2 marks below a grade boundary and would mean the difference between meeting a target or not.

brassbrass
The private school parents might not pay because the school already has all their money in fees.

A couple of students in my class aren't paying for reviews because we feel as a school their papers were so out of line with expectations, but we haven't the funds to offer a free on demand service.

The other thing to consider is that often private school fees don't include exam fees so parents also have to pay for every exam entry on top of their fees. That's another reason some privates may cover the costs of reviews of marking.

'Selective comprehensive'? That's a contradiction in terms.

The only reason that deadlines might be different between private and state settings would be if the private school students had taken different qualifications, such as iGCSE. Given that many private schools pass the charge to enter students for exams onto parents I think it unlikely that they would then absorb the cost of marking reviews.

The timeline for the same exam remains consistent regardless of type of school. Schools choose whether to pass on review of marking costs; most do.

We had GCSE English Literature reviewed for DS 2 years ago. It went from a 6 to a 9 and affected the range of medical schools which would give him an interview (more points for A* than A).

For A levels, we have got the papers back for the subjects he did not achieve predicted grade and, after teachers looked at them for us, sent 3 papers to be reviewed.

We have paid for all of them as the school do not offer to pay although they do give everybody the post-results services form. They had also not given us the marks for the ones where he missed target, we had to find out the marks from the Exams Officer and decide for ourselves how to take it forwards. I don't know how many others at the school were very close but not informed.

The grades may not change, but at least we will be confident that the marks he got were an accurate reflection of how he performed on the day.

The system is very unfair as only people who can afford it have access to these services at most schools.

The Edexcel/Pearsons approach whereby schools have free access to download the scripts and check themselves whether the paper should be reviewed is excellent progress, all boards should do that, it is not technically complex and shows confidence in their own standards.

Correction - he went from a B to A* in Eng Lit and it was not because any questions had not been marked, all the marks were wrong (WJEC)

Also, to clarify, we had to pay to get the OCR papers back (£84 for 6 papers) and then pay £48/paper for the 3 we are getting reviewed. It took a week for the papers to come back (Edexcel can be downloaded instantly after results day).

That may explain it Lola thanks.

Bluebilled yes superselective comprehensives exist limited number of places are offered based on entrance exam for entry into the extension stream.

No need to roll your eyes at me, @brassbrass. It would be a lot clearer if you referred to such schools by their usual and correct description of ‘partially selective’ or ‘bilateral’ rather than by a fundamental contradiction.

I don't need to actually that's what it's called here