Pro-Lifers told to keep their distance

[longwayoff]

A court has ruled that anti-abortionists should keep 100 meters away from women attending the Ealing clinic. AIBU to say quite right too?

YABU. I believe that abortion should be legal but I am terrified by the government shutting down and moving protests. I think everyone should be able to protest where they like so long as it is not dangerous.

It absolutely is dangerous for these protests to happen outside clinics though because vulnerable women may be deterred from accessing the care they need. Some of these women will be terminating for medical reasons, because continuing the pregnancy poses a serious risk to their health. Some may resort to harming themselves in an attempt to end the pregnancy if they feel too intimidated to enter the facility. The fact is that all women, whether they are vulnerable or not and whatever their reasons, have a legal right to use these services and should be free from harassment, intimidation or threatening behaviour whilst they do so. The staff who take care of them also have a right to be protected from the assault, intimidation and harassment that they get simply for doing their job.

Cautiously, YANBU. I can't stand the tactics of the forced birthers who harass women who want/ require abortions. I'm pro-choice to the bone and these slimy fuckers make my skin crawl.

But, I don't know if I'm being overly cynical as I get older, I do have concerns about possible unintended consequences that might accompany this legislation that mandates for spaces in which their is an embargo on otherwise lawful behaviour. I'd hate to see something that, on the face of it, helps women to go about accessing health care without wading through a hate filled shit storm to provide the framework by which it is possible for the state to intervene in the space and manner of protest in other matters and fails to recognise the unique situation of this particular issue.

But YANBU.

Good.

Amazing how many people think it's any of their business to preach & dictate how other people live their lives.

It should be 500m imho.

When I was younger in the 90’s you could take some kind of morning after pill if you had an accident, but I had been with a friend to get this when we were 15 and it involved being referred by your GP to a hospital 20 miles away. You then sat in the maternity ward for anything up to 5 hours, waiting to be seen. Babies and women everywhere. A female nurse would come to see you and very sternly and horribly reluctantly give you the tablet with a lecture, then you had to come back the next day for another. My friend and I found the whole experience humiliating and also scary (I think that was the point)

I was raped when I was 15 not long after, and too skint (to travel) and afraid to tell my parents to ask for help or go back to that hospital. I unfortunately had fallen pregnant and didn’t realise for some time (no access to anything to find out). I had to tell my parents go back to that same department with the same horrible nurses and have a termination. There were no protesters there, but I cried for 2 days straight while I sat alone in a room next to maternity ward with no visitors not really knowing what was going on. I had my first ever general anaesthetic and no one was nice or kind or understanding to me the whole time.

These clinics are designed to be the best place you can be during such a traumatic and scary experience. For protesters to try to take that away from women is absolutely disgusting. We have come a long way in terms of women’s care, and I don’t for one moment support we go backwards

@Sparklesocks thanks. It would be better if they had to be further away, as 100m is still close enough to the clinic that unsuspecting people like me have to encounter them before or after treatment. It wouldn't be possible for Marie Stopes to warn you where they are camped as I suppose then they would just keep moving.

If they had offered to help me with raising the child then I would have loved to keep it. But I couldn't afford to do so alone. They are just there to bash women who are already suffering. People were crying inside the clinic, as you may expect.

Good,

How nice that the protesters have time to harass women whose lives they know didly squit about.

Meanwhile, I wonder how many of them have wives at home doing childcare.

For those asking about help provided to pregnant women and new mothers, this is one example of a Catholic charity that provides housing and assistance to women and their babies. So it's not all just protests (which I don't agree with).

lifecharity.org.uk/the-charity/history/

There's a shocking New Yorker article about the last abortion clinic in Montgomery, where women need escorts to take them past protestors (who do things like call out 'mom' and claim to know someone who'll raise their child).

The clinic escorts, who are volunteers, carry beach umbrellas to shield the women's faces, and play music so they can't hear the chants and calls. The police are also in attendance. The women's licence plates have to be covered as otherwise the protesters try to trace them. Most doctors have to be flown in from out-of-state. The protestors are still audible in the waiting room. Sometimes anti-abortion activists pose as clinic escorts and redirect women to a nearby pregnancy crisis centre.

I will never believe that anyone standing outside an abortion clinic, harassing women, is simply expressing an opinion and should be afforded some sort of tolerance. This is a deliberate attempt to infringe on someone else's rights of bodily autonomy, whether you try to physically impede or 'just' verbally coerce, threaten and humiliate them, and dissuade others from even coming.

peony2325 as nice as it is that they provide support services, I don’t think you could trust a Catholic led org who are openly anti choice to give you balanced, unbiased information and advice in this area.

@peony2325

Maybe I’m not reading properly but I could see they provide hospices for very poorly children but what other long term services?

@peony2325

Sorry, scrap that. I did misread!

I work near to Whitfield St where a Marie Stopes clinic is based, they operate with two right outside the door and a chorus across the road. They offer cheap pink and blue plastic rosaries which I find offensive both aesthetically and because my cradle Catholic mother was always offended if someone gave her a rosary as the prayers were meant to be for the person who gave it to you.

I take great joy in berating them and asking them to stop obstructing the pavements. I have no idea how you screw up the courage to walk past them into the clinic. I have written to the relevant cabinet member at Camden but no joy... I might send another missive tomorrow as this harassment should not be happening.

Is it legal to soak people with water pistols? I’m tempted to see if there are any of these protesters in my area

I wonder how many of them have wives at home doing childcare.

I have to say that of my many walk-pasts of their patch at Ealing, the majority of the protesters are older women, with a sprinkling of older men.

namechange thank you for your honesty, and as others have said, you are entitled to your opinion.
However, do you feel these 'protesters' have a right to inflict their opinions on woman attending these clinics, in such an aggressive manner?
I don't really care if anyone thinks abortion is wrong. What I find horrific, is that someone feels they have the right to basically attack vulnerable woman, who are making a decision about their bodies and their future.

Should be further. Especially.when they take photos and publically shame women

They have every right to peacefully protest outside parliament who make the laws regarding abortion.

They have no right to harass women who are accessing legal healthcare outside clinics.

Life isn’t a catholic charity...it’s not actually affiliated to any religion. They do incredible work in my home town, giving out free baby equipment and clothing, housing vulnerable women, running play groups for new parents, offering counselling for infertility and miscarriage and those who are struggling with the after effects of abortion, helping women in domestic violence or those struggling with addiction to access the services they need. It’s taken a long time to overcome assumptions and prejudices about the charity but social services and other local charities (Barnardos, Women’s Aid) now make full use of the services offer and refer vulnerable women to the charity so they can access the help they need in order to not be forced into having a termination they don’t really want because of financial reasons or because they are being abused, are homeless etc.

Live in Ealing too and have witnessed this for many years; also have told people what I think about them harassing others. I’m pleased that the latest hearing has been upheld though wish it were further away.

By the way - as a caveat to the above, I don’t believe that women should be abused going in and out of abortion clinics, forced to see graphic images etc. I’m totally against that. But two of my relatives said separately that if someone had offered to help them before their abortions, even as they were in the hospital bed that they would have changed their minds and with this debate being in the news they’ve said that the horrible protestors would have done a lot more damage to them, but someone offering practical advice and an alternative would have helped them a lot to the point where they wouldn’t have had terminations.

They suffered a lot with their mental health following the abortions and would have benefited from some truly non directive counselling and some actual help with practical matters.

I realise this isn’t the case with every woman and that lots of women have explored and exhausted all alternatives and they also move on with their lives with no after effects but just pointing out that there are some charities that actually do good work and that they are needed too.

@namechange84 what disingenuous bullshit. Earlier on in the thread you said you think that women having abortions are committing murder. Now it's all fluffy and lovely, is it?

And you never answered the question as to why you think that abortion is murdering innocent babies, but you're fine with innocent babies being murdered if their existence is the product of incest or rape?

Could you respond to that, please

@rubicon

I think you are getting me confused with another poster. The two messages just now are the first I’ve posted on this thread. The views you’ve stated are not what I believe.

@namechange84

I'm so sorry. You're right. That poster was @Namechange345678

I apologise wholeheartedly for the confusion. Sorry.

(It does explain why you sounded a lot more reasonable today... )

@Rubicon80 I’ll admit I didn’t read the full thread or I would have name changed back to avoid confusion - I name changed for another thread and I’m lazy .

Apology accepted. Hopefully the mods might delete anyway.

I can see merits on both sides of the pro life/pro choice debate. It is a sensitive debate, and I don't think it is helpful to paint pro lifers as 'scum' etc.

My sympathies for the pro life viewpoint however doesn't extend to harassing vulnerable women at their low point. My message would be leave these women alone and make your arguments sensitively in the right forum.