To have or not to have ...

[mikkyr]

Probably not a AIBU question but this seems like the forum where Im most likely to get a varied array of responses without bias.

So Im 40, married to by DH who is honestly the kindest, most generous person I know. He was married previously has 2 kids from his ex-wife, I have no kids.

Im on the cusp of the biggest decision of my life. Whether to have kids or not myself. Ive heard all the arguments about 'you should just know and if you dont then you shouldnt be a mother'. But for some reason that just isnt enough for me. Im a logical person and I find myself drifting all day from imagining a life with a child to living the rest of my life without a child of my own.

For perspective, my husband understands my desire to have a child of my own and supports me which ever way I decide. I know its not the most helpful way for him to support me in this but it really is my choice. He is a great man and will be a great dad. He doesnt have the best relationship with his own kids but that is largely due to his ex-wife moving miles away and everyday contact being limited because its just not logistical. His kids are teens now and I have always had a decent relationship with them, its not a maternal relationship at all and I dont feel maternally about them but we have a good time together as a family on the occasions that they visit. Its not something that has been an issue in our family, we all get along and have accepted the way things are for all of us and there is no upheaval of any sorts.

So I keep bouncing between the idea that my life now is great, my DH and I spend a lot of time together cycling and doing things that are not necessarily conducive to having a child. But then my mind does a complete flip and I think to myself that I really want a family of my own and I can possibly put those things on hold for a few years and raise a child.

I spend a lot of time watching mothers and mentally putting myself into their position and gauging how I feel. If Im watching a mom holding a tantrum throwing toddler in the supermarket I think to myself, no thanks, not for me. Then I watch another holding the hand of a giggling child and I think, ah, that would be nice. I understand that the bad times are countered by this 'love' you feel for your own child so its not possible to explain how and why mothers do what they do everyday.

Time is running out for me to make a choice and Im so frightened that when I make that choice, I wont be happy with it. So much so, that I actually feel frozen in the moment and Im not living my best life right now because Im stuck between two worlds.

It's such a personal thing that it's hard to respond to you (and that's probably why no-one has so far). And it not really the sort of thing where you can leave a review.

What I can tell you is that I had all those doubts and was never really 100% convinced so I'm definitely not an advocate of 'you just know'. But it's been amazing and I wouldn't have missed it for the world. If I could leave a review, I'd recommend!

I pretty much mirror what pippistrelle said.

It's not always easy being a parent, in fact the first few weeks after the birth I thought I was losing my mind. Pnd and anxiety. Sleep deprivation still. But I love my boy with all my heart and would do it all a million times over for him.

One thing I will say is IME I think if you decide to, once bub is here you will miss your current, more free life but you would pick your baby over that anyday.

In ten years time, are you more likely to look back and think "I wish I hadn't had my child" or "I wish I had tried to add to our family"? FWIW, I don't know anyone who regrets having a child, even though it is sometimes usually hard, unrewarding and downright exhausting.

I think making the decision to have children boils down to the basic need or want in the pit of your stomach. There’s no logic behind it or reasoning it’s just something you know you want to have in your life. It was for me anyway.

It doesn’t sound like you have that OP, you sound very sensible and rational for eg when you see the toddler having a tantrum you think no that’s not for me instead of ignoring how it would make you feel.

Having dc is hard work and it does obviously change your life, it does bring a lot of love and joy but they aren’t the only things in the world that can give you that. It sounds like you have a lovely and enjoyable life OP that will definitely alter should you have dc. A stranger on the internet can’t decide your future but I would go with your logical side and think very carefully before going ahead and having a baby.

I think logic on this topic will probably always end in no. All the cons are logical things you can understand having never done it. The pros are quite intangible and you can never really experience until you do. I think logic kind of has to be abandoned for this particular decision, is got to be a feeling.

I'm 39, with 2 daughters aged 10 & 12. My sister is 37 with no children and has been umming and ahhing for the last 3 years about whether or not to have a baby with her partner. We have talked at length about it (as I'm sure you can imagine!), but what it really came down to in the end was that she just wasn't sure, so they have decided they won't be having children.

I think that's the best choice if you're not sure - obviously you can't really change your mind once they arrive, and it's not even as if you can take a holiday from being a parent when it all gets a bit much. If you went through a particularly stressful and busy period at work, you might decide to take a break afterwards; have 2 weeks laying on the beach in the sun to relax and unwind. Once you've got children, you don't have that option. Yes, you might have amazing (and rich!) Parents, who see that your toddler has entered the 'Terrible Twos' and has been giving you the run-around for the last few months and think you could use a break, so offer to care for your DC for 2 weeks and pay for you and DH to holiday in the Maldives, but whilst you're paddling in the crystal clear waters, the heat of the sun warming your skin and a Strawberry Daiquiri in your hand - you're still a Mummy. You'll still worry if you packed their favourite teddy, worry if your Parents are following their bedtime routine, that your DC might fall off the climbing frame at the park and end up with a broken arm (or worse). Basically, 'Mum Guilt' is real, and it's with you all the time.

You can never really relax, even when you're away from them - what if they were injured and you needed to get to them in a hurry and you were at a meeting 250 miles away? Even sharing a bottle of wine with DH on a Saturday night is a risk; what if DC fell ill and needed to go to the out of hours Dr, or to A&E - someone needs to be sober enough to drive (yes, I have heard of taxis, but there's often a long wait at the weekend and we all know how MN feels about calling an ambulance in non-life-threatening situations!) You are always a Mum first, before you are anything else, because that's how our brains are wired.

Having a baby is the one choice that women make in their lives which limits nearly all the other choices she will ever make in the future.

I'm not trying to put you off, just present you with the realities of how it affects women (me and all the Mums I know, at least!) and share with you one of the main deciding factors in my sister's decision not to have a baby.

I, on the other-hand, have always wanted to have children - not that I thought about it a lot particularly, but I just assumed that I would be a Mum one day. Then, when I was 26, a couple of friends and colleagues had babies and then I did start thinking about it a lot! Here we are 12 years later with two wonderful, clever, kind, well-mannered daughters of whom we are incredibly proud. For me and DH, having them is the best thing we've ever done, and it's brought us closer together, as cliché as that all is! I'd personally recommend Motherhood - but it's not for everyone!

You know that only you and your DH can make this decision. If you're really undecided, why not push him a little more on whether he would like to go for it or not. He has first-hand experience so knows the realities of it all, so who better to ask?

Good luck in coming to a decision, I'm sure you'll make the one that's right for you.

Thanks all...
Im not looking on here for the answers but perhaps for additional things to think about.

Whats really stressing me out at the moment, is that I feel Im not living either of the best lives I could because I just cant decide between them so Im stuck in limbo. Maybe Im just bogged down with it all and need to live a child free life right now, cos thats what it actually is... Im stopping myself from planning a year in advance because of a 'what if' ... (Head in hands!)

Its so hard - Right now I think I could be happy without a kid but what happens if in 10 years I regret that decision and its too late? Everyone says you dont regret having a child once youve had them so isnt that the better option?

And I keep wondering if the fact that I cant let go of the idea that I want to be a mum is not the deep down need in your stomach that everyone talks about? How do you just put that thought aside? Some days I can and other days I cant.

I don’t think it’s actually true that people only regret if they don’t have a child but not if they do.

Every week there’s someone on MN saying they wish they’d never had their baby, they want their old life back and they feel trapped. Nobody would say that to you in RL because it’s so awful but people can say it on an anonymous Internet forum. But once they’re here that’s it they’re here.

I don't think it's true no one ever regrets a child, it's such a stigma to say anything and I think it's unlikely people using parenting boards are as likely to be in that camp anyway.

I adore my 11 year old but if I could have my time again I probably wouldn't have bothered. I know that sounds awful but I think life is so rich without kids too - travel any time of year and at drop of a hat, much more money, time, easier to progress at work as a woman (no CV gaps or suspicion over whether you can give 100% as a working mother). I really do love my daughter and wouldn't magic her non-existent, but if she ever comes to me and says "should I have kids" I won't be strongly encouraging her!

Also I've seen so many relationships crumble under the financial and logistical pressure that kids create - or marriages that still exist but seem to have hardly any time together because three kids are always in three different places, childcare is expensive (and relatives willing to babysit three are rare), and arguments due to sheer exhaustion.

I was in similar position- in the end decided to go for it and fortunately got pregnant easily. Now 34+1 with our baby at 41 and loving it.
I decided to let fate decide, if we conceived and the baby stuck then it was meant to be.

Well time might have already run out. 40 is a bit late in the day to be toing and froing, how does that make you feel?

If you're worried about that, then I think you want one and should go for it. One DC is pretty manageable IMO.

@PooWillyBumBum so I go through all your 'cons' and I respond in my head as follows:

travel any time of the year at the drop of a hat - ok, so i wont be able to do that because of schooling etc in the earlier years. But where we come from its normal for kids to go off to boarding school at 13 and that is what we would do. 13 years and Id have child and a bit more free time to myself anyway.
work progress - my husband and I run a fairly succesfull enterprise ourselves. We employ 180 people, I could easily employ someone to take my work load off my hands if I felt I wasnt coping with being a mom and my workload and we would also have a fulltime nanny / au pair. I dont have a career path, we are self employed.
more money - we are ok and a child wouldnt dent our finances much more than my husband already does on his hobbies :)

I go through all these thoughts everyday and still cant pin a decision down! Maybe the other posters are right and the fact that I cant rely on feelings or logic mean its a no for me...

But what happens when everything else has gone, the business has run its course, the holidays get stale.. .What then?

@brokenlogs there is that issue too, hence more pressure to decide. Im not one for throwing caution to the wind so fate wouldnt stand a chance, it has to be a decision and we take it from there.

What then? Your kid would've grown up and moved out by then anyway, potentially abroad, so you'd be answering that question anyway. Your what then could be learning languages, travelling again, starting a quieter business or non profit, spending more time with friends, going back to University in your 70s(!)

Unless you're mega rich I wouldn't underestimate the finances. Our local boarding school is £39,000 a year and that's post tax and without extra curriculars, etc. My daughter goes to a comparatively cheap private school as a day girl at circa £18k a year and that doesn't take into account piano lessons, riding lessons, the endless uniform, activities at weekend and saving to help for university/house deposit. It's always worth running numbers just in case!

I sound really anti-having kids. I'm not, particularly. I just think it's not the only thing that contributes to a meaningful life.

@PooWillyBumBum we are not mega rich but would definitely be able to afford it. In fact we would be better off as by the time our potential child reaches that age we would not be paying for the two kids we already do as they would be out of school.

Be as anti or pro child as you are comfortable being ... I need all the points of view I can gather. I think its refreshing that someone with a child can be objective about not having one. Most mothers gush and ooh and ahh over their motherly status and the realist in me can see that its not all its made out to be at times, and then the mother in me can also see the joy and rewards it can bring too.

I do need to add, that I was pregnant earlier this year and we unfortunately miscarried at 10 weeks. I felt joy and excitement at the prospect of being a mom as well as trepidation and nerves. Ive been told that is completely normal but perhaps the miscarriage has tainted that for me as its quite an emotionalroller coaster.

What kind of dad will your partner be? Ok he says it is your decision but his life will change significantly too. Have you talked about the roles you will play in a baby’s life. Will he share bedtimes/nappies/early morning’s at weekends or will he be off doing hobbies and expect you to do all of the baby stuff? This in itself will place pressure on your relationship as having a baby is relentless. Not sure if you have talked about this with him already but it should be a big part of your decision as may help.

OP - I sympathise with you. I was also on the fence re having kids and posted on AIBU for some guidance. I got some amazing input and advice from MNers - I think the thread was called something like "If you were on the fence about kids, how did things turn out" or something like that.

At the end of the day, I think you just have the acknowledge that you will have regrets either way, make your decision and move on. I think the "in limbo" phase is really hard and draining - I was always trying to convince myself one way or the other. When I finally made up my mind that I want to stay childfree, it was a HUGE relief! I feel like I can really move on with life now.

One of the things I found really helpful was to try picture how I want my life to be in 5, 10, 20, 30, 40... years. In my mind, there were never children present in my imaginings. I also think that a good litmus test is to ask how you would feel if a doctor told you tomorrow that you could never had kids? For me, I realised it would be a huge relief - I figure that's a fairly safe indication that kids aren't for me.

Good luck with your decision - there are some great posters on MN who I have no doubt will give you some good food for thought.

@Polomintini he would be a great dad... In fact, our kid would not suffer for lack of parental support and involvement. I have seen him spend time with his own kids and given the physical distance that he has had to endure raising kids in a different home, it breaks his heart that he hasnt been afforded the opportunity to spend as much time with them as he would have liked and they have therefore grown up not sharing his interests. He would love to have had his son grow up with his values and interests and go on a cycle adventure with him now that he can!

We have discussed the strain that raising a child would put on our union and I think we would have that covered. We are not UK based and have nannies etc available to us although I understand that it doesnt replace a parent, it does help when things get tough.

So these are all the PROS that keep me awake at night!

The CONS are that we dont have family support here. His parents have both passed on and my folks are UK based ...

@panticus thanks for the insight. I too try and imagine my life in the future and I think right now, Id be happy either way it turned out. I just dont want to have the regret of not having a child when ultimately its too late to change your mind.

Im not a fragile being (for lack of a better way of saying it). Im practical and resilient so I assure myself daily that I would be fine either way .... Just which way? :(

So you would have a baby and have a full time nanny or au pair, then they go to boarding school at 13?

@Morgan12 yes i was waiting for your kind of comments to appear.

Yes, thats just the way it is here if you can afford it. Good senior schooling is not logistical possible in the area we live in, most kids go off to private boarding from 13 or so. And nannies are a way of life here and employment for many people.

Seems strange to someone who lives in the UK and worries about child care, I understand that. I lived there for 10 years. But I live here now and its just the way it is. There are pros and there are cons to it, I am aware.

@Morgan12

Motherhood however is universal. And thats the decision Im questioning. I have given my personal set of circumstances as a reference because they help with a lot of the CONS of motherhood ie time to yourself, being stressed from burning the candle at both ends, the cost of child care etc....