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Original poster

To find the saying ‘you can do anything’ seriously annoying

91 replies

TheletterZ · 30/07/2019 16:30

I’m reading “Life According to Freddie Flintoff” where he says that ‘anyone can do anything within reason’. Which is very easy to say if you are healthy, physically capable, clever, white male.

I am not saying he hasn’t had to work hard to get where he is, he very clearly has, but this down plays how hard life can be for some and quite clearly no, not anyone can do anything.

OP posts:
IamWaggingBrenda · 30/07/2019 18:27

But it’s obviously easier for men, and easier for white men, and easier for (outwardly) heterosexual white men. Because everything is. Yeah, another excuse to not try, and it’s bollocks anyway. Like all white males can have it all. My grandad, born and bred in England - white, hetero male. Immigrated to Canada in the 20’s with a couple of his English cousins. They were met with signs in numerous businesses saying, “English need not apply”. So he did what was necessary to survive, moved to Northern Canada, went down into the mines, in less than great conditions. Started up his own intercity bus company, joined the RCAF. You don’t have to look very far to see that those so called “privileged white males” have also had to struggle to get ahead. Not to mention all the “privileged white males”, fathers of my friends who ran lucrative businesses and lived in large houses. The one thing they all had in common was a number tattooed on their arms from Auschwitz, Treblinka or Bergen-Belsen. Please stop lumping all white males into the same category and assuming they’ve all had it easy. Many suffered and worked incredibly hard against all odds to become so-called “privileged white males”.

TheFridgeRaider · 30/07/2019 18:27

If anyone watched the documentary on BBC2 last night on what it takes to break into the elite, it showed the awful discrimination against highly able working class kids face when applying for jobs in the city/media. A kid who has been to a state school in Dagenham but who got a first at a Russell Group uni, stands far less chance of bagging a top job than a middle class kid with a 2:2 who went to a private school. Then factor in colour and you’ve got a whole new level of discrimination. It was thoroughly depressing. In some careers it’s all about how you present your accent, your name, your confidence. I’m sure there are many people who despite being incredibly able and hardworking will just not get a crack at the whip.

That is sadly truth. Says a person with strong accent and super foreign name.

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:30

Well then you change your goal to something you can do.
That's the whole "within reason" part.

It’s a meaningless statement, then. “Anyone can do anything they can do.” Well, duh.

I don’t it means that, actually. I think the “within reason” part means Freddie doesn’t actually think he can go back in time and play Moses in The Ten Commandments, forcing Charlton Heston into the position of reluctant understudy.

I think he wants to believe it’s all about “positive mental attitude” but is not really giving enough thought to his privileges.

TheFridgeRaider · 30/07/2019 18:30

I don't get the obsession with class in UK tbh. Every country has classes, but UK is just soooo obsessed with it, thus allowing it to actually hinder progress of many. If people would care less, it would be a different country.

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:31

Yeah, another excuse to not try, and it’s bollocks anyway. Like all white males can have it all.

If that was what I had said, yes, it would be bollocks. Things generally are easier for straight white men, though, in this country. I didn’t say universally.

Titsywoo · 30/07/2019 18:32

Well he's right. Within reason you can do anything you want. It'll be hard work and take a lot of time and determination and sacrifice for lots of those things. The most successful people I know didn't come from privilaged backgrounds. My DF is hugely successful and came from poverty and had barely any education. However he worked his arse off and is one of the most determined people I know.

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:33

TheFridgeRaider

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. It’s just a fact that a certain accent and social background will often open certain doors that will often remain closed no matter how clever, talented or dedicated someone is.

Mumminmum · 30/07/2019 18:33

I know it is such BS. A lot of my co-students were from the upper classes and they really, really believed that they had been "headhunted" when their dad, granddad or uncle hired them to work in the family business. It was soooo cringe worthy. They actually talked as if their positions were something they had worked for. Fair enough, that for most of them the condition for getting the job had been that they needed to get a business degree, but most of them barely passed. We had to do a lot of group assignments and in two of the groups I was in, almost all of the others had a hangover every effing day! When they heard what kind of job I got straight after graduation ie not a mangerial job some of them thought it was because I had a calling to be a lowly paid government official. FFS! They didn't know that it was not normal to become a manager straight after graduation (and they most definitely didn't know that most of the people they were managers for probably cursed them every single day. Because it is very hard to have a untalented entitled young git as a manager)

IAskTooManyQuestions · 30/07/2019 18:34

@WorraLiberty would you like to expand that ?

Back to the OP ‘anyone can do anything within reason’ - Which is very easy to say if you are healthy, physically capable, clever, white male

Well, within reason, I can run 100m, I'm not Usain Bolt (bad example because he's not white) but I'm not particularly an athletic, white, male specimen … oh hang on Usain Bolt is a good example - because he also is none of those things, and he had absolutely no 'privilege' growing up. So Usain Bolt could have become a stereotype Jamaican beach bum but he chose to overcome those obstacles and be something.

Actually Freddie didn't go a good school, didn't get any A levels and didn't go to uni.

And coming back to 'privilege' - who has more? a black man, because he's male or a white woman, because she's white?

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:35

Well he's right. Within reason you can do anything you want.

Tell that to a person from a conflict zone, waiting on an asylum decision, living on food bank packets (if they’re lucky), suffering PTSD, with no security of accommodation, income or even the right to work, carrying a couple of medical problems and uncertain whether their family are alive or not.

It’s just not true.

Titsywoo · 30/07/2019 18:35

Like, I am fat and and not very fit. And I’m a mum and I can’t afford a personal trainer. But I’d like to run a marathon one day. Possible? Of course. But it’s not going to be as easy for me as it would be for someone already in great physical shape, no kids, doesn’t have to work, able to hire a PT and unlikely to get pregnant. I’m not moaning, but it’s a bit rich when those people turn round and say “Anyone can do it.” Not really.

Err yes you could. Who said it would be easy?

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:37

oh hang on Usain Bolt is a good example - because he also is none of those things, and he had absolutely no 'privilege' growing up.

He’s 6’5” and preternaturally physically gifted. It doesn’t matter what most of us think or attempt - we can’t do what he can do because we aren’t physically capable of it. Nobody is saying he hasn’t worked for it. It’s not possible for everyone, though.

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:38

Titsywoo

No, Titsy, I am not saying I can’t do it. Hmm

I am saying that not everyone can do it. It depends on the balance of privilege and difficulty that exists in your life. I have many privileges that mean that a marathon - difficult though it might be - isn’t out of reach for me. But can “anyone” run a marathon? No.

TheFridgeRaider · 30/07/2019 18:41

It's very obvious that not everyone can do everything 🤷 I mean like, come on. Obvs.

However, it is possible for people to set realistic goals and achieve them.

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:47

However, it is possible for people to set realistic goals and achieve them.

Which isn’t exactly what he said. But sure.

fitzbilly · 30/07/2019 18:48

I think it's true. It's about growth mindset isn't it.

You have to work hard and put in a huge amount of hours to be good at something, no one is just born good at anything.

Isn't it something like 10,000 hours of practice to become an expert at anything?

Most people just have a fixed mindset and think they can't do something because it's hard.

TheFridgeRaider · 30/07/2019 18:50

I think it is what he said.

But then again. Different minds. 2 peoplecould read "Hiya" and get a different thing from it. So I don't think we will ever agree. And that's fine 😁

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:51

And if people took the time to read the whole thing, they might note that he says that when someone says they can’t do something, he just doesn’t understand it. I think Freddie would benefit from a bit more exposure to people with genuinely complex, difficult lives.

Notmydalek · 30/07/2019 18:54

fitz mindset is vital. It was well within my capabilities to have a career in music like my DB, but it was our mindsets that resulted in only one of us going on to do it. I love music, I love playing the things I like but I wouldn’t practice for the necessary time to be good enough or to totally crack a difficult part of a piece. I just fudged my way through it tryIng to use my natural musicality to try hide the dodgy bit. Which is just about acceptable as an amateur but totally not ok for a professional. My DB could literally practice one difficult bar or section over and over for 2 or 3 hours twice a day.

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 18:57

TheFridgeRaider

Sorry, you read the words “Anyone can do anything within reason” and you actually get from it “However, it is possible for people to set realistic goals and achieve them.”?

Wow. Then I suppose it is possible for two people to read the same thing and get different things from it.

StealthPolarBear · 30/07/2019 19:05

When people say he's a flat earther do they mean he actually believes the earth is flat? Or is it a general term for someone who is a bit dim?

TheFridgeRaider · 30/07/2019 19:27

When people say he's a flat earther do they mean he actually believes the earth is flat? Or is it a general term for someone who is a bit dim?

These two usually go hand in hand

TheFridgeRaider · 30/07/2019 19:28

@herculepoirot2 for me that "within reason" means "being realistic about it"

herculepoirot2 · 30/07/2019 19:48

TheFridgeRaider

I think if he meant “being realistic about it” then “anyone can do anything, being realistic” is pretty much meaningless, and also that that doesn’t square with his statement that, when someone says they can’t do something, he has no understanding of why.

Neverender · 30/07/2019 19:50

Sorry but I agree with him.

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