I am terrified of the climate emergency but more terrified by how ambivalent others seem to be about it!

[CopperPatch]

Just that really, I see people sharing things on social media, commenting on threads, talking about climate change etc but actually changing their lives very, very little - or finding ways to justify not taking action.... it is not scaremongering, it is not a fear project, our planet will no longer sustain human life because of us but so, so many people seem to not care, or only care on a surface level - great click bait but changing their lives in any way seems a step to far. Yes we need wide-scale political and economic shifts but we also need every day action from every day people - and that is EVERYONE'S responsibility!!!! AIBU to expect more of everyone?!

It appears no one read the link I've shared. I urge you to. You can argue and quibble over how to do more with less, it doesn't matter. The tipping points have been reached, extinction is all but guaranteed. Enjoy the time you have left now. Saying this as a parent of two young children, I cry daily. I have been researching this in depth for the last 6 months and I have a strong scientific background. There is no future, we have 30 or 40 years left. The politicians will never tell you this. You can call me alarmist, but you'll remember this post in the years to come. Get out of the city, learn to grow food, have a stockpile of supplies. It won't ensure your survival (none of us will make it), but it could make the end less unpleasant. Being emotionally and psychologically prepared for what's to come is very important. Be strong moms.

www.huffpost.com/entry/facing-extinction-humans-animals-plants-species_n_5d2ddc04e4b0a873f6420bd3

Get out of the city, learn to grow food, have a stockpile of supplies. It won't ensure your survival (none of us will make it), but it could make the end less unpleasant. Being emotionally and psychologically prepared for what's to come is very important. Be strong moms.

Kind of hard to do when you're on a min wage zero hours contract just scraping by. And if the end is coming, wouldn't it be 'less unpleasant' to instead source some pentobarbital from Mexico or Thailand and just drink it down and top oneself? Why did you have kids if you knew the apocalypse was nigh? Then no need to be a 'strong mum'.

FWIW, we don't live in a city. But that means we have to run a car to get to jobs, which are all shift work mostly and there is limited to no public transport and it's too far out to bloody cycle before someone brings up that load of unworkable bollocks.

This will be my only reply as I came to inform/warn and not to debate. There is plenty more info out there, studies with all the math and data you need, this linked piece was a general summary without the technicals. Feel free to disregard, belief or disbelief will not change the future that's to come.

Yup, prepping is much harder for those with less financial wherewithal, and as always they will be the first to suffer, as they already are in many places around the world. Do what you can.

A euthanasia plan is not bad to have in your back pocket imo. Things are literally never going to get better, anywhere, ever. You are now enjoying the last few 'good' years left.

I mentioned I've been researching in depth for the last 6 months. My children are 4 and 2.5 respectively. I woke up too late. I beat myself up about it daily.

I struggle with wondering if I could go back would I choose not to have them. And as much as it pains me, the answer is yes. If I could prevent the pain they are now going to endure I would have to, despite them giving me more joy and love than I ever knew was possible. They are literally the most beautiful and precious things on the planet in my eyes and they deserve so much more than what they have been given. It's my fault and I'm racked with guilt daily. The only reason I'm personally moving to a homestead 4 hours out of the city is them. I want them to have a normal life for as long as I can possibly provide it. Otherwise it's pointless. Without them I'd be living like a hedonist right now, there's literally no reason not to.

I hope that answers your questions. Start doing your own research, and not in newspapers (can't have the populace in full blown panic this early!), actual reports, scientific forums etc., you're not going to like what you find.

If I truly believe climate change will be that bad surely I shouldn’t be bringing children into the world to deal with it

I literally don’t understand this line of thinking. I understand having less children to reduce environmental impact but to worry they will endure hard times?

Literally any other period of history people (and their children!) suffered through famine, genocide, near constant warfare, plagues, societal collapse, natural disasters, etc etc that were unrelenting and took a huge death toll. Humans were nearly wiped out to a small population in our earliest history. But we still manage to keep going (until we don’t, but we’re always trying at least).

Well I'm 50 this year so, if I live that long, 30-40 years will take me to the point where I wouldn't have long left anyway! I may as well carry on drinking wine and smoking cigarettes and that may take me out of it before the worst happens! I mean if we're all going to die at that point anyway, hardly seems worth taking steps to prolong my life.

A euthanasia plan is not bad to have in your back pocket imo

Wow, you need to calm down, your kids will not be well served by these hysterics.

Rampant capitalism has caused these problems. It relies upon throwaway societies in order to keep selling stuff which generates the money. The rich keep this system going and they'll fight to the death - literally - to protect it. The world is fucked and all that we can do is tinker with micro improvements, but the big fuck ups will continue until the planet and its systems fail and lots of people and animals die.

The only things that will save the planet are total human disappearance or tiny numbers going back to living in a stone age which we did thousands of years ago with no environmental impact.

You choose.

It's incredibly hypocritical of many MNers to be handwringing about CC when THE SINGLE biggest impact on the climate is population growth and yet it's absolutely unacceptable to criticise anyone on here for having more than 2 children.

I'm worried about CC myself but I won't listen to anyone with 3+ children whinging about it when they are to blame for the situation.

Every excuse under the sun comes out to justify having too many children... "oh but we need lots of extra children to grow up and look after the elderly, pay for pensions, blah, blah, cliche, blah..."

We, as a human race, can't afford this Ponzi scheme that you've invented to justify your breeding choices.

You've fucked the planet and you need to own it, not blame everyone else.

You won't stop people from having children as it's a strong biological urge, like sex or hunger.

@ineedaknittedhat I don't disagree at all.

The tipping points have been reached, extinction is all but guaranteed

No it isn’t 😂 you’re saying the entire planet will be inhospitable? Parts will (the Middle East/Africa) will be I agree. Millions - even Billions of humans might be wiped out but so long as there are even 10,000 Homo Sapiens left the human race will continue. Remember it took us 200,000 years to get to a billion people. Eight billion people will not be wiped out.

This is copied from another thread about the state the NHS is in..(never mind the whole bloody planet being about to collapse)...

Equipment problems also reminds me of a few years ago when I went in to have DS and spent the best part of the day in a huge high ceiling waiting room that was roasting hot as the heating system was broken but broken "on" - ie ot couldn't be turned down; the accepted "solution" apparently was to have all the windows permanently open..... confused I literally was there from 8am til gone 5 like this, it was like watching tenners being lobbed out of the window.

This is why we're fucked.

To be fair the discussion regarding children in relation to CC is fairly new.

I'm not for shaming of individuals for things they are allowed to do. Is this the new future of society shaming everyone who is a plus 1 or parents who have larger families?

Reminds me of the beginning of the book 'Ender's Game' where the protagonist receives a lot of bullying for being a third aka third child, in a society where you have to receive government approval to conceive.

If this is where society is heading a soft dictatorship by 'choice'?

It seems the answer is yes.

I struggle with wondering if I could go back would I choose not to have them. And as much as it pains me, the answer is yes. If I could prevent the pain they are now going to endure I would have to

Just relax. Seriously. I’ve watched many documentaries/talks about climate change and all the scientists talk about “in 100 years this could happen, in 200 years this could happen, in 800 years etc etc” They aren’t saying “we have 30 years then we’ll all pretty much be dead”

Things aren’t good but seriously?

It’s going to be the worst (much more so) for countries like Australia, India, Africa and ME. Northern Europe is going to feel the least effects. It’ll be shit for us in terms of mass migration that’ll stretch us but the UK isn’t nearly as vulnerable as other countries.

in a society where you have to receive government approval to conceive

You equate not getting free money for your third child you can’t afford as not having “Government approval”?

You equate not getting free money for your third child you can’t afford as not having “Government approval”?

Sorry what?

Sorry what?

You said you need Government approval to have a third child? No you don’t. You just don’t get benefits for the child.

Also to the people complaining about African over population - a family of 10 is causing less emissions than your family of 4.

Here’s a world map which shows the countries causing the most emissions

Maky, you seriously need to chill.

I see. I didn't express myself properly, sorry.

I'm not talking talking about the current goverment policy regarding tax credits or money for 3rd children.

I'm talking about shaming and blaming people who have more than 2 children and where that attitude will lead us to in the future ie, one where children end up being teased and parents ostracised and made to feel guilty for having more than two.

I referred to the Sci-fi novel 'Enders Game' by Orson Scott Card (there is also a weak movie adaptation) which is set in a fictional future society, where there is an earth wide 2 children policy due to scarce resources, and potential parents have to apply for permission to conceive and are screened for suitability before receiving approval. Ender is a third and his parents are shamed and he is bullied by society because by being a third, he is an anolomy and it is contravention of the rules that everyone else has agreed to live by.

When I first read the book I was 15 and thought 'earth wide enforced permisdion for conception, Never happen!!

Now I can see if not a direct law, a kind of shaming by societal pressure happening.

You won't stop people from having children as it's a strong biological urge, like sex or hunger.

Not stop no. But people can and do curb the strong biological urges you mention.

It would be good if having more than 2 children became less socially acceptable.

There is no future, we have 30 or 40 years left. The politicians will never tell you this. You can call me alarmist, but you'll remember this post in the years to come. Get out of the city, learn to grow food, have a stockpile of supplies.

I don’t want it to stop because the quicker humans are wiped out the quicker the planet can recover without us. If we reduce emissions just enough for the human race to survive we will carry on being cruel to animals, destroying the environment for creatures in other ways and starting wars like we have always done. The quicker we all die out the better for the planet. Obviously, selfishly I don’t want to be around nor want my kids to be around when it happens, but we all have to go at some point and as a species we are absolute arseholes.

I'm talking about shaming and blaming people who have more than 2 children and where that attitude will lead us to in the future ie, one where children end up being teased and parents ostracised and made to feel guilty for having more than two

People are already shamed for having no kids, having an only child. At least those two aren’t making the problem worse.

It would be good if having more than 2 children became less socially acceptable

Oh trust me it is. Anyone with 3 or more children can tell you how judged they feel.