To think that Home Educated children should be inspected every year?

[jennymanara]

I think home education can work. I know a fair number of parents who are home educating from some who teach their kids to those who are unschoolers.
But I also think there are parents who home educate who are not up to the job and claim to be unschooling, but are in fact just educationally neglecting their children.
There should be an annual inspection of all kids being home schooled. This should check that children are actually getting some form of education, and not just left for example to play minesweeper all day, as one single mother I knew did with her teenage son.

What about the fact that most child deaths from abuse are in the under 5s? Where are the compulsory visits by health visitors every year from birth till school age? That's the only logical outcome to this so-called 'concern' about children's safety.

And where's the response to the comments about sending an official round to check your fridges and meal plans?

If you've nothing to hide, you won't object.

Most people don't have a clue about home education and how it works. They think it should look like school. I don't want someone like that inspecting my family life and saying my kids should go to school instead because they aren't sitting doing worksheets all day and aren't learning at the pace that an outside authority has decided that they should learn.

Schools are failing children and school is a huge cause of mental health problems in young people. The poster above me talks about year 3 children only having year 1 skills - why do children of age 7 or 8 need to have certain skills anyway? The only reason they need certain skills at a certain time is to keep up with the work which is happening in school. They could learn the same skills (if necessary) in a much shorter time when they are older, if they are motivated to do so. But a huge proportion of what we learn in school is pointless and forgotten as soon as the child is out of the school environment.

Home educated children have space to play, to experiment, to breathe, to create, to question, to just be. Not pushed on from one piece of knowledge to the next all the time. None of this can be measured. The reason I home educate my kids is because I want them to be happy, creative, motivated and engaged adults. Not because I want them to have certain skills at age 7 when they don't bloody need them!

Benjispruce that means nothing and merely shows an ignorance of home education. Many home educators teach formal skills much later than schools, preferring to wait until the child is ready. Many European countries do this too. It isn't wrong, just different, and many educators and even teachers think we have it wrong in this country by pressuring our children so young. Learning skills later doesn't mean the children never learn them or are in any way behind later on. Obviously, though, it could be a problem if the child gets put in school half way through this process, though such children usually catch up pretty quickly.

DD2 had many home ed friends who didn't learn to read or write until secondary age. They are all late teens now and their spelling and grammar is markedly better than many of their schooled peers. A large proportion are at university. Year 3 really does mean nothing. You will also find late starters who go on to do very well even amongst schooled children.

Whilst home schooling can work, the outcomes for HE children are worse than for children in care in terms of results.

I also agree that things are often not straightforward. My 15 year old has been home educated since the beginning of 2018. The reason for this is she has ASD and was not coping in a mainstream school, and her mental health was terrible and getting steadily worse.

I have a degree and actually do some A level tutoring, so it’s not that I was technically unable to educate her. But the complications were that firstly, for a long time she was not in the frame of mind to be learning and needed to decompress. Secondly, I’m a single parent and I have to work, so trying to fit in time to do stuff with her has not been easy. Thirdly, I have ME, and when I have a crash I am too exhausted to do anything other than the bare minimum, sometimes for months. She has been seeing a maths tutor every week (that I’ve paid for) as that’s where she struggles the most. We tried going to HE groups but she hated them as she finds social stuff really hard. So to be honest, she’s not done a lot since she left school. I applied for an EHCP, which has literally just come through, but that has taken 10 months. So now she is starting school in a specialist autism unit in September, and being retained into year 10 so that she can complete her GCSEs.

Certainly for parents of SEN kids, sometimes your hand is forced into HE whether you like it or not. It’s certainly not something I’d have chosen.

I think there needs to be a record of who is HEed and the primary motivation, particularly when so many LAs are failing in their responsibilities to provide access to education. It needs to be known who is opting to HE through choice and whose needs are not being provided for.

I don't know how you can effectively evaluate HE though. Standard curriculum ecpectations will be inappropriate either because the parents aren't wishing to engage with that model of education or it's not appropriate to the children's needs.

Learning may not be evidenced. My DCs go to school but have learned a huge amount through conversation and experiences. Due to SNs, even in school. DS1 can only verbally articulate his range of knowledge, not do it justice in writing. He's one of the kids that give teachers a headache in the face of a rigid list of targets, because his progress isn't a neat, linear pattern of progress that suits a tickbox culture. If he was HEed, it would be difficult to prove the extent of his learning.

School systems are often imperfect but they and their staff have legal obligations with regard to safeguarding concerns. A HE child may have less contact with people and organisations to observe any signs of concern which is a legitimate concern to society, but how that can be effectively managed, I don't know.

If LAs actually wanted to safeguard HE children and make sure they got a good education, there is a very simple way they could do it:

1. Build positive relationships with local HEdders (who will know other HE families far better than the LA ever will), and get a reputation for being genuinely pro-HE and committed to fairness. That would mean local HE families with concerns about someone in the community would feel they could ask the LA to investigate and feel comfortable that the outcome would be fair - at the moment too many LAs see their role as getting HE children back into school whether that's best for the children or not. It would also mean families worried about their own provision could get guidance and help, rather than judgement and pressure to put the children back into school.

2. Stop conflating HE with safeguarding. The number of malicious and false reports to SS from LAs, previous schools, neighbours, etc, based solely on the fact a family HEs is scary. It sets up an Us vs Them atmosphere. LAs have been known to send police to do a "welfare check" for no other reason than the family doesn't wish to have a LA inspection (that they legally do not have to have), which is threatening, and a complete waste of police time - that is not how welfare checks are supposed to be used.

3. Offer help - vouchers for local tutors, discounts for LA stuff like leisure centres, exam centres offered at cost, lists of local schools who will allow external candidates to sit exams.

But LAs won't do that. Many of them are totally idealogically opposed to HE, and they have a financial incentive to get children back into school - central government funds school children, LAs have to fund oversight of HE children. Monitoring won't work. It'd cost a bomb, compliance levels would be low, and what good would an hour or two with a child each year, or even every 6 months, do? LAs will just use any new powers to get more children back into schools - the schools that failed them, in many cases. If they actually wanted to improve things for HE kids, they could try any of the ideas above instead...

I m a former teacher. I left the profession because i LOATHED it. the curriculum is garbage, teacher's have no support, no funding, it's a failing system. I lost count of the amount of times I saw colleagues sitting in their cars/toilet cubicles crying at break times. And this was in primary schools. Yachiru I've seen this for myself, with bright motivated teachers giving up after a few years.
jennymanara After primary school I home-educated my ASD ds partly because the Head said he would never cope at secondary school. We reported our decision to the LEA and had 2 visits over a 5 year period. I welcomed it but they were understaffed and were unable to offer advice or assistance, they were happy to just leave us to it. After sitting his IGCSEs (all taught at home - and I am not a teacher but there are resources) he went back to state school 6th form (lovely supportive teachers) and now has a STEM subject university place in September. The issue of a HE register rears its head every few years and I am not against it but sometimes it feels like a distraction when teachers are under the cosh.

Everything above ∆∆

And who funds these inspections?

all this 'if you've got nothing to hide, you wouldn't mind'... How come in schools just before an OFSTED visit, every member of staff and their mother is in the school from dusk til dawn changing EVERYTHING. Surely if they've got nothing to hide an inspector could just turn up and be like, 'gr eat job, guys!'

It doesn't matter if HE are not following the national curriculum. If you are HE you should be able to show that your children hve learned from one year to the next.

Yachiru oh I dunno, most schools like to be in a permanent state of ofsted ready these days, even throwing in regular “Mocksteds” just for laughs.

Alternatively all children who are homeschooled could be eligible for an education grant every year and could have a couple of advice meetings to give them help or hear their plans about how they are going to spend it. Could also assess if eligible for HBEHCP (Home Based Education and Health Care Plan ).

Be nice if they had the termly option to meet or message with their link school to see what nice things they could join in with.

Edutopia 💭

Smile EachDay nah, really? That doesn't surprise me actually. The last school my kids attended, we had letters sent out a month prior to tell us they were coming and to make sure our kids were punctual, in uniform and well behaved. My kids year one teacher told me they were getting into school by seven am to prep the classrooms, and not leaving until that time at night. At the earliest. Also the 'naughty kids' were told not to come in.

How come in schools just before an OFSTED visit, every member of staff and their mother is in the school from dusk til dawn changing EVERYTHING. Surely if they've got nothing to hide an inspector could just turn up and be like, 'gr eat job, guys!
Schools are notified of an inspection at lunchtime the day before the inspectors arrive. So chance would be a fine thing.
And the vast majority of the information the inspectors need, they already have. Heads have to update that information every week, via an online system.

Inspections are nothing like they used to be years ago, when the inspectors simply went by what they saw, and schools got several weeks notice.

Whilst home schooling can work, the outcomes for HE children are worse than for children in care in terms of results.

Can you tell me where this is from? Is this at 16, or later in life? Is this based on GCSE results? (which are prohibitively expensive for home educators and involve jumping through many hoops). I just wonder what outcomes are being measured here. Does this include all the children with extra needs whose hands are forced by the education system failing them? Does it include the children "off rolled" by schools because the school thinks their behaviour is too difficult or their results are going to be non existent? If so, this is bound to make schools look better and home education look worse.

I can only speak anecdotally, but I know of my DD's friends that many looked quite poor at 16 if all you measured it by was their GCSE results at that point in time compared to schools. The barriers to GCSEs mean that many home educators spread them out over a number of years, or only take the minimum needed for the next step, or take them at college.

Now they are all late teens and early twenties, they are looking a very successful bunch indeed. Many are at university, some are in jobs which they really enjoy and always aspired to do, some have started their own businesses and are doing extremely well for themselves. All have dreams, ambitions, goals, and all are making them happen.

My own DDs gained 9 and 10 GCSEs respectively, almost exclusively As and A*s. They may have gained one or two extra at school (not least because it cost a couple of thousand in exam fees alone for us to do as many as we did).. My youngest is currently at university doing a Masters in Physics. In school she hated science. She certainly wouldn't be where she is today without home ed.

Schools only get a day’s notice - so phone call in the morning saying they’ll be in next day.

Buuuuuut...schools know the “window” where they are due - depending on the school’s circumstances it will be a particular number of months/years since the last inspection. So there is a certain amount of being ready at all times during the window - certainly in terms of paperwork and systems. 🤷🏻‍♀️

@Benjispruce - is it too bad that they only had Year 1 skills? I mean people say they are dropping the maths and English test for trainee teachers...

some kids take longer to learn the skills, why not give them a bit of leeway or put them in the year below (if they agree to it)? In some places those with summer born children find it so hard to defer school entry...Do we need such a rigid time frame?

@musicposy that’s based on GCSE results.

DifficultSituation19 where did you get the GCSE statistics from?

I have a family member who “home educated” a DC.

The family member suffers from a range of mental and physical illnesses. The DC, a young carer, was depressed and acted out at school. Child would refuse to go to school on occasions, self harmed etc and attendance fell blow acceptable levels. Initially there was lots of engagement from school and social services and then mother was threatened with prosecution for failing to ensure attendance. School then tell her she can avoid all the aggro by deciding to home ed. Despite mother being semi literate herself the DC was “home educated” for two years from 14 -16. This meant staying in bed until midday, faffing around on the internet for a few hours a day and hanging out with other marginalised young people with MH problems. End result is a child without a future.

It’s one of the biggest hidden scandals of our time.

@saraclara the school's i worked at/one's my own kid's attended, would start 'sprucing up' the school's at the first whiff of OFSTED. When other schools in the area got inspected, they'd get a heads up. Same happens to nursery inspections. More often than not, one nursery will be in correspondence with another local one and they'd share resources or even staff.

Silkie spot on

@PianoPiano it was a document my mum had from a meeting at county hall (she is a county councillor). I was under the impression that it was a nationwide statistic, but it may have just been for this county. I will check.

When other schools in the area got inspected, they'd get a heads up.

Again, that's not how it works any more. You no longer get teams of inspectors booked to cover a particular area over a period.

There's no longer a 'whiff' to be scented. My last school had no warning at all of their last few OFSTEDs. Basically you have to be OFSTED ready at all times these days. On the other hand, there are far fewer inspections of lessons, so lesslast minute panic from class teachers. A lot of it is now data driven. That's how OFSTED are keeping tabs on schools ALL the time as far as results, policies and progress are concerned.