Advice for a friend who is a father for the first time

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I'm a 28 year old man with a 3 year old son who is my absolute world. I'm seeking advice on a sensitive matter regarding a very good mate of mine. He's 21 and has a month and a half old daughter who he worships, He was with a young woman who is 18 years old, they've split up and have been for around 6-7 months. The issue at hand is very delicate as the woman who gave birth to their child is nothing more than a stuck up snotty teenager! When my mate and "her" broke up they spoke about their daughters first and last name which was only right, now this is where the issues start to fall like dominoes, she said just because they aren't dating anymore their daughter could take his last name as it's only fair he wants to be apart of her life and that is all he wanted. He would message her on occasions regarding her well being seeing as she's the one carrying the child. They knew roughly the due date, the plans for the birth etc, now is where it starts to become a joke as it's all about "her" - my mate was on standby, cancelling plans with friends and family incase the "phone call" for him to make the short trip to the hospital came. Fast forward to the date she actually gave birth, she didn't nor any of her family who we're at the hospital, (mother, father, step father, cousins) ring my mate to notify him of her labour and that she was due to drop, I understand a womans right to privacy but to take that right away from a man attending his daughters birth or even being in the waiting room was such a low blow for him. The matters got worse as their daughter had poo'd inside of her and caused problems which resulted in their daughter being kept in hospital for two weeks. He would ask her if he could go down and see his daughter and his ex would say "no" and that he's not allowed visitation unless she's there as the midwives have told her otherwise" (complete farce and utter lies) - the next day he was anxious, he got dressed, messaged his ex and asked if she was going to the hospital to which she replied "NO" he accepted that and that was that. He then said he would message the next day and see if it was possible to go see his daughter and his ex replied with "just message me tomorrow and we will discuss it" he then did, he waited for a message but never got one back so he contacted her via FB messenger which said she was active but to no avail she was avoiding him, he then contacted her mother as she was with her at the time and she replied back with "her phones in the house and shes not seen his messages "- he disregarded that message and proceeded to the hospital anyways without her say so and asked the midvives if he was allowed to see his daughter and they we're more than happy enough to oblige, upon entering the room his ex was sat there with a smug look on her face and looked very unhappy while sat on her phone which she supposedly didn't have on her. - (she lied to him and didn't anticipate him turning up after she filled his head with lies about turning up without her being there) - now the main matter of it all is now, yesterday she went and got the birth certificate without his knowledge once more, only this time she got it done WITHOUT his name on it, he's been seeing that child 2-3 times per week, providing for her and she's took everything a father should be allowed to experience in favour of her own well being. Now that he's not on the certificate it means he has no parental responsibility, it means she can't demand CSA from him as he's not binded by the certificate in order to do so and yet she uses his daughter as a weapon and uses things like "the main thing is you know she's you're daughter, why you mad over a second name on a bit of paper" her attitude stinks and if she had common sense which she clearly lacks then she would know that he has no say so in whatever life his daughter has as she took all of that away from him. Is there any way he can get his name on to that certficate.. I know it's possible through a court order against his ex but is there any other way? Oh and she also messaged him after she told him about the certificate that the midwives influenced her not to put him on it (I deem this another lie as there's no history which would say otherwise) He's a very nice man, devoted to his daughter, loving caring and has a heart of gold, he's never been controlling, abusive nor jealous of anything she does, she was always free to do what she wanted when she wanted but she ended it as she fell out of love but it was only 3 days before that I spoke to her on the phone and she told me he meant everything to her. I also know she had a fling before my mate with her disabled brothers carer (unprofessional on his part) which her family know nothing about! Everything revolves around her as she's a narcassist, I apologise if there are spelling mistakes, it's 3:30am and I type very fast on my phone. Any replies and advice are welcome.

In an ideal situation, your "mate" wouldnt have got his 18 year old gf pregnant, and if he had, would have done the decent thing, and stayed with her. Since none of these things have happened, he needs to spend his energies on being the best dad to his daughter that he can be.

Sounds like he is having regular contact, which is excellent (and will give him and the mum a bit of time together to talk as well), but does he not work? He is a man with responsibilities now, he needs to go and get a job - ANY job - and support his child.

Both parents need to try and leave all the bitterness and acrimony in the past now, and act in the best interests of the child. Legal stuff like birth certificates etc can be sorted out later, once everyone has calmed down a bit.

Your mate needs to grow up and start acting rationally, stop the pettiness and focus on normal next steps.

(Petiness being who could be at the birth, she's the patient, he cannot force his way into a birth, no one else than the labouring woman has that right to decide. being on birth cert won't have been possible as unmarried andhe wasn't present. Who she's slept with before is irrelevant and immature that you think it is. Etc etc)

Your mate should;

• arrange financial support formally (CSA at a minimum)
• kick off getting formal visitation in place via the courts (as a newborn, baby will need to stay with mum for the future but formally getting agreement on visits is a good first step that can be reviewed as the child gets older)
• help this new mum figure things out by offering to help/get essentials in. If they argue, he could offer to drop off nappies, cooked food at the doorstep - something to show he's thinking of mum & new baby but isn't making it all about him and what he wants (Which is what comes across in your posts)

Try this site... www.gingerbread.org.uk/information/contact-arrangements/

It talks about parenting agreements and schedules of contact particularly for babies under 6 months.

Key points:

• He needs to get rid of the idea that he had any right to be at the birth or that he's been at all hard done to in the baby not having his name. He hasn't, it's a whiny twat claim, and the best thing you could do is challenge this. Men who want the right to name their children need to be married to the mother.

• Baby's mother has frankly done what I would do in not putting him on BC, and he doesn't currently have parental responsibility. But he can potentially get it. He would need to make an application to the court if he wants PR and to be involved in his child's life. You can support him in this decision and help him decide if and when that's what he wants. Think of it as obligations to the child, not his rights.

• He can be obliged to pay maintenance without being on the BC. Important that he understands this. If he wants a relationship with his child I'd suggest a voluntary arrangement is likely to be optimum.

• If they were only in a casual relationship then in his shoes I would consider a DNA test, unless perhaps the child so clearly looks like him that it's obvious. Like when Boris Becker was going to try and deny his broom cupboard baby then the photos were released!

• Don't impregnate any more women he hardly knows. This is vital. It is incredibly foolish to leave your DNA in someone unless you are in a very committed relationship with them. It's good that you bollocked him for the unprotected sex. He needs to be extremely rigorous with his contraception. Insist on condoms, always, until he's in a committed relationship. If a woman won't accept his desire to protect himself, that's a red flag and he shouldn't shag her.

• Full STI check. The child's mother could have had anything. She will have been offered screening during pregnancy, but he cannot assume she would have told him if she'd tested positive. Offer to go with him for moral support if needed. He must safeguard his health.

I can't get past the idea that your friend feels entitled to be present while this young woman is in labour.

Who knows, maybe she didn't want someone there who thinks she's a snotty teenager.

Maybe she decided she wanted the baby to have her surname. She couldn't take him as he would have kicked off and legally she couldn't put his name on BC without him there.

It is totally up to her who she had in the room when she gave birth, as it should be. It wasn't nice not to let him see his DD afterwards, but she is young and full of hormones and may well have a lot of people telling her what she should be doing. It sounds positive that he can now see his DD.

With feeding, if she was breastfeeding then he wouldn't be able to feed anyway.

He needs a DNA test, to pay CSA and continue with the little and often visitation schedule which can be built up as baby gets older.

It sounds like a charged and upsetting time and you do only have one side. Just advise him to take the steps above and hopefully things will settle down

Yes, best thing for baby is little and often. Take time for the two of them to build up a relationship, put those vital blocks in place. He shouldnt go blundering making daft and obviously not child centred requests for overnights straight away.

Also I think the mum was right to give baby her surname if they aren’t together. It’s actually difficult when your child has a different surname for things like passports, school applications, going abroad, applying for doctors etc and I know first hand! The world hasn’t caught up with the fact many people don’t get married nowadays.
I would tell him to completely drop the name thing. He can apply for parental rights if it comes to it

It's just frustrating that the whole parenting thing is the way it is and that there isn't many rights for men.

I do think that men are so used to being prioritised in most areas of life that they really do struggle when it comes to the world of birthing mothers and new borns; where they correctly have not much of a say. Birthing mothers and new borns isn't really anything to do with "parenting", it's about getting a woman and her baby safely through a dangerous and painful process. Men have plenty or "rights" when it comes to parenting but few when it comes to birthing and that is absolutely as if should be.

I get it. He's upset that things she told him she'd do, she's ended up not doing.
But he also has to look at things from her perspective.
She said his name could go on the certificate. At the time, she probably meant this. It is entirely correct to assume she'll have been advised against this since then (by professionals). Having a different name to her child could lead to all kinds of issues if, for example, she wanted to go abroad on holiday in the future. There are often major hold ups at passport control (in case it's child abduction by a non-custodial parent) if a parent's surname differs from the child's. It may also be that she's realised she wants her child to have her name since they aren't together.

At the end of the day, he's got a healthy baby that he's getting to see. If she's really as immature as you say, he'll need to be careful she doesn't stop contact if this continues.
I'd advise him to apply to court for parental rights and also set out a formal maintenance agreement so she can't accuse him of not contributing.
Yes, he feels hard done by, but he isn't. Continuing to talk about this kind of stuff is likely to alienate her and lead to him losing all contact without court approval.

First post? MRA alert

"When his daughter was released from hospital she wasn't letting him feed her, hold her" when a baby is born the way this one was with those complications they can have issues with feeding, reflux and breathing and even occasionally heart issues. There may well have been very specific safe ways that the baby needed to be held and fed which the mother will have been shown in hospital. In addition it's very natural for a mother to feel over protective following a traumatic birth, even with a "normal" birth with hormones, sleep deprivation etc overprotectiveness can kick in - that's completely natural and even healthy.

Remember mum and baby have only been home 4 WEEKS, mum is still getting to grips with caring for baby herself and she has the added issue that I've heard from many teen mums and read on here that young mums can be under much greater scrutiny/criticism from everyone from their own families to health care professionals and even complete strangers - you're guilty of this yourself!

She will have had it drummed into her the right way to do things for this baby while caring for her in scbu, where everyone is hyper vigilant!

I was 28 when I had dd, she was my rainbow after 2 mc losing 3 babies, the pregnancy had been medically very dodgy and I was closely monitored as being "high risk" then the birth was long and slow and then went very wrong at the end very quickly and frighteningly so! Dd and I both nearly died for different, rare unpredictable before the birth reasons, ending in an emergency c-section.

The protectiveness I felt was overwhelming. At one point while I was with dd in scbu dd had to have an emergency procedure which short term was EXTREMELY painful and they'd no time to administer any anaesthesia, the scream I will NEVER forget, my then husband literally had to carry me 2 days post cs out of the room to stop me dragging the hcps off dd. Even though logically I knew they needed to do what they were doing - it's a visceral, instinctual reaction that really DOESN'T take account of logic.

I was SO apologetic and ashamed after but the hcps were lovely and told me it was a perfectly normal reaction that they were used to and to think no more of it.

Once home dd had some wounds due to necessary procedures and I really wasn't at all comfortable with her dad bathing her initially, as I'd been instructed to do so in a very specific way and shown how in hospital which her dad hadn't.

But he understood and helped in other ways until I felt ready for him to do that task.

So your friend needs to be PATIENT it is very early days still, the mum AND the baby are still very much adjusting to baby being outside her body (tell him to google "4th trimester" also)

I very much agree with the advice not to pester the mum, politely and briefly ask re visiting arrangements where necessary but give her space.

"He sends me screen shots of him messaging calmly and in return she would be hostile for no reason." Bear in mind he could easily edit what he's showing you. Don't assume you're getting correct info.

I have to say, I am not sure I would want an ex to be with me in labour, or on the birth certificate. A lot depends on how they split, but I would have thought she would have been (well) advised to put her own name on, and make preparations to bring up the child on her own, because I'm afraid the chances of your friend being slack and not manning up here are probably very high from her point of view.