To think people on middle incomes are forgotten about?

[Squeezedout]

I am so upset tonight and just need to vent. I have always worked, as has my partner. We have 2 children who we could provide for until my industry pretty much collapsed and I had to find a less well paid job.

The cost of childcare and rent (south east) is absolutely crazy and I can’t keep up. I put in an application for universal credit that said we’d be entitled to a few hundred a month so have jumped through every single hoop, taken unpaid days off work to attend a job centre (the irony!)

Only to find out now (6 weeks after the initial claim) that we are entitled to roughly £4.50 a month.

On paper maybe we have decent salaries, combined with the rent and childcare we can’t even break even each month. I know we are not alone.

It seems in this country that if you are the poorest of society, you are helped (in terms of council properties with decent rent, council tax help, 2 year funding and everyday benefits as well as lots of media attention to the problem) to ensure you have enough to live on. If you’re the richest in society, you obviously don’t need help but the squeezed middle are just completely forgotten about.

I am NOT benefit bashing at all but It really doesn’t pay to work sometimes. I’ve calculated how much better off I’d be as a single mum not working in a council house and tbh I cannot keep taking out loans and am starting to think this is the only option to keep my kids fed.

AIBU to think the ‘squeezed middle’ are completely forgotten about in this country? And that it is fucked up that I can’t feed my kids on an average wage?

I agree with you OP. This isn't a new problem though, it's been going on for quite some time now.

What’s your joint take home and how does it compare to your mortgage/childcare?

I agree though-it’s hard. We used to get child tax credit type things in the early 2000s-when everyone did, plus child benefit.

You are partly right. Middle income ‘JAM’ families are soft targets for a government driven by protection of the wealthiest.
Many are public sector workers who’ve been vilified as wasteful and over rewarded such that they’ve suffered pay freezes, pension cuts and job insecurity. Their life has definitely become harder as costs rise but salaries don’t.
The government is philosophically opposed to support for the most vulnerable though; I’m not sure the poorest do have it easy. The tabloids just like a nasty headline that feeds the tutting paranoia about immigrants using the NHS, single mothers with fifteen children and people pretend to be disabled.

What benefits do you need to receive to qualify for the 2yo funding?

It's terrible, but in the south-east, with the high cost of childcare, I think it's totally standard - especially with more than 1 dc - not to break even for those first couple of years until the free hours kick in, and even then it's tough till they start school. This is why people plan/save (often waiting till they're older to have dc, having fewer dc and spacing them out), work part-time, give up work to be a sahp, take on extra jobs, rely on family to help, or go into debt during these times. Or of course a lot move to more affordable areas. Not saying this isn't shitty, just that it surprises me that anyone expects to break even unless they're very wealthy. If it's so bad you can't hang in there till the childcare costs ease off, then moving may be the only option, and the industry being in the south-east is no help if that industry isn't financially viable for families so rethinking/retraining may make sense too. But if you can get by somehow till the dc are that bit older it does get better.

I know, I worked out that I will finish paying off debt when my youngest DC is 11. I have worked FT since they were a baby. I am just glad I have a job and house and was able to get credit when I needed it.

The thing is that the benefits system is not working as a safety net either - I pass at least three homeless people on my way to work. One has been in the same spot for months now.

I think most families are skint while paying for nursery or childminders. Once they hit school it doesn't always disappear but it's much easier.
I remember the first month we dint pay for nursery, it felt like the biggest pay rise ever.
We didn't have any spare for the first 5 years. But it's got a lot better.

It gets better once the kids are in school and you're paying less childcare. At one point I was paying £14,000 a year childcare. Yes this means you're skint. But as I said it gets better.

I am a single parent I work full time and things have improved as thankfully I can now work from home and reduce my childcare costs. After nine years of being working poor I am now financially in a better position.

We struggled in the 'middle' for years. I fell sick and got £405 a month. That was it. All the bills were the same and the rent was not assisted. It was hell, we had to decide whether to eat or pay the rent. My daughter helped me out, which I felt and still feel awful about.

Then the powers that be decided to 'massage' the unemployment figures so gave me an early pension which gave me an extra £300 a month.Still no help with rent or council tax but life was easier.

Mt partner had a minimum wage job so his earning were low with no overtime available ever. Sadly he died suddenly. Overnight I got my rent and CT paid for me and now I survive.

So unfair Two of us and zero help despite such a low wage. Just me and it's all paid.

The whole system is full of holes, this country is in an appalling state with more and more people resorting to food banks or having to give up work because they can't afford childcare. I am not for one minute saying anyone should get a free ride; ie have loads of kids and let the government pay for them, but the current way is not working and so many families are suffering. It actually reduces me to tears to read many of the stories.

@NCforthis2019 that’s not a helpful comment. Living further away means paying more in transport costs and sometimes not being able to get back in time for childcare. Increased transport costs can often cost more than the saving in rent.

I would not fancy being on UC and private renting in the south east: YABU to think poor people in your region are all getting the help you mention. I mean, you can't possibly think everyone on a very low income in the south east is in SH.

But YANBU to think there is something very wrong with the way we are organising our society. There is. Unfortunately, you probably can't afford to live in the south east unless your financial situation is about to change significantly, eg one of the kids starting school and the other getting the free 30 hours or whatever.

Is there any possibility at all of a relocation for your family? Even if it costs money initially? What is your income now and what lines of work are you both in? I bet MN could locate somewhere suitable.

I'm struggling with this. I think the welfare state is a fantastic and civilised thing. But it is a safety net to stop people falling into penury - to help ensure they have food, shelter and healthcare.

It's not there to make like easier for middle earners! If you're lucky enough to be healthy and gainfully employed, you should be paying into the system, not taking out.

we've worked since we were both 16 now 30 with a 1 year old and entitled to absolutely nothing

I'm not sure what you expect to be 'entitled to' after working for just 14 years, tbh.

It's not there to make like easier for middle earners! If you're lucky enough to be healthy and gainfully employed, you should be paying into the system, not taking out.

Well that would be the ideal, if we had a functioning system. However, we have artificially inflated the price of land and housing so much, which warps the costs of childcare as well as housing since childcare providers need premises, that it becomes impossible for some people who are decent earners on paper. The solution to this lies in fixing the system.

No ynbu my husband works all week 37.5 I look after our 19 month old during the day then go cleaning at night. I had to give up my IT career as no flexibility and all my wages would have gone to child care.
When she reaches two I want to start socializing her but nurseries are so expensive.
Yet someone I know has never worked her partner doesn't work they claim benefits and get 15 hours free child care per week.
If I could get that I could add more hours to my work to help top up the funds. It's stressful and hard.

Someone needs to get a grip on housing and childcare costs - particularly in the South East.
You get house prices/rent under control and it would massively help the squeezed middle. Childcare the same (too many women have to give up work because of childcare costs).

We are going to look back in 50 years and think we should have done something. Mainly because of all the elderly with no pensions because they spent their lives paying off rent/mortgages.

Could it just be this month you aren’t entitled?

I claimed for a while when my partner and I separated temporarily and every second month I got considerably less just because of the way my paydays fell. I can’t even remember how it worked now but it meant I had two paydays in one of their windows and was entitled to much less then it was loads more the following as I’d technically had no paydays that period.

Or you can not live in the south-east. it's not compulsory.

Unfortunately, it's inevitable that, if very many people want to live in one small area of a country, that will drive up the cost of housing, childcare etc. There's nothing 'artificial' about that - it's basic supply and demand.

The repeated use of the word 'entitled' in this thread is instructive.

Longer term could you relocate, there's a good life awaiting you outside of the south east. All of my friends and family have left London now. Too expensive

Our wages come in and what goes out on a few days later is more.

You have the luxury of knowing you are going to get money coming in on a certain day and bills are going to be paid the next.

Most people on benefits spend the day before anything is due to be paid in on tenderhooks not actually knowing if it is.

I get so confused about this

I am a lone parent. I am currently on sick leave as the pressure of it all too much.

Ds has to go to breakfast club and after school club. We leave early get back late and I still can only just pay my Bill's.

I am considering cutting my hours. But I wont be better off at all.

Council housing here is impossible to get so I took the money from my divorce bought a house. I was lucky to be able to do so. But as home owner, I would not get help towards housing.

My exh who spanked his money for the divorce on a new woman, now rents and works self employed and is loving universal credit. Because he has part of his housing paid.

I dont really understand it when people say they are better off working or that single parents get loads of help. I dont earn loads and I dont get loads of help.

I didn't go back to my job after I had my first baby as the cost of childcare was more than my wages. It didn't seem to make any sense to pay for someone else to look after my children whilst I was doing a job I didn't particularly enjoy for very little money.

My husband makes just enough to mean we don't get any help with any childcare until the standard 3 year old funding. We aren't poor by any means but we finish every month at ground zero in our bank account and things like our MOT being due this month become quite stressful because it could push us over the edge.

Things aren't desperate so I can't complain but we certainly feel a lot of pressure and our situation seems very precarious. If we can make it til both our children are 3 without any major disasters we will be OK....I do totally get what you mean though.

^You have the luxury of knowing you are going to get money coming in on a certain day and bills are going to be paid the next.

Most people on benefits spend the day before anything is due to be paid in on tenderhooks not actually knowing if it is.^

^^This. Some people have no understanding of what it is to be poor. It's these people we should be supporting via the state, not those on above-average incomes ffs.

I think people in the middle are often forgotten because the country is run by people with millions and two homes and kids in private school who think they are the middle and that everyone's fine. They understand neither the poorest nor ordinary people's lives at all.

I certainly struggled when kids were pre-school with the fact that my salary barely covered childcare but we weren't eligible for any help with the costs beyond childcare vouchers, which in London save you less than 10% a month. I was 'lucky' to be made redundant at the end of my second mat leave and get a payoff, because had I gone back the childcare for two would have been 150% of my salary. By the time I got a new job, oldest was in school thankfully.