To feel outraged at my friends re charity salaries?

[Pissedoffandbored]

Have a group chat going with a load of my girlfriends. There have been some additions to the group chat this week, some I know well and others are just acquaintances. One girl I don’t know sent a link to published salaries for charities. Girl didn’t know I work for a National Charity in a senior position and slated the amount I earn saying people don’t deserve to earn more than PM. At this point I interjected making her aware of my position and she proceeded to have a go at me. I defended my position but most of my friends agreed I earned too much since I worked for a charity.

So AIBU to be pissed off? Also, is this the general consensus or are my mates just dick heads?

*They might be as hardworking, and they may be very capable at something else, but they clearly aren't as capable of heading up a multi million pound business. Because if they were, they would be.

Very few people would choose to dig holes in the road for the gas board (which is very hard work and they are probably very capable hole diggers) if they had the skills to run the gas board.*

I'd say this analysis is too simplistic and there are lots of factors which determine where people end up, such as where they were born and sent to school, family circumstances and so on. People who get paid fortunes seem to think they're something special rather than perhaps appreciating there's an element of luck involved too. It's not just hard work. Plenty of people work and study hard and are very capable.

They might be capable and hardworking but they haven’t got her job! They might aspire to it of course and good for them.

We do need high earners. It’s now fact that 40% levied from tax payers is now more than all the 20% tax take. We need higher rate tax payers. They pay more VAT and make a bigger contribution to the welfare state and the NHS so that others can benefit. The idea that a low income state works just as well or is somehow fairer is ludicrous. If would mean devastated services paid for by individual taxes. Some basic knowledge of how the economy works would be helpful when having a go at high earners.

Some basic knowledge of how the economy works would be helpful when having a go at high earners.

I do have that thanks. We are talking about wages in the charity sector (and to an extent the arrogance of high earners.) I'm not suggesting all high earners should be abolished or that we should have a low income state. I do however think attention needs to be paid to the increasing gap between the highest and lowest earners.

@Cinammoncake totally agree!

YoungEurope
“I donate bags of clothes / household goods to a small local hospice shop”

You realise that staff in hospices are paid? How on earth could hospices be run by volunteers? The majority of hospices charities are, as you say later in your post ‘big businesses ‘. How could they not be? The gave premises, facilities, medical and care staff.

Charities supplement the welfare state. Many big charities here take in things that you might expect the state to cover. Why should the skilled people who work for charities in these fields be expected to work for less than those you support through your taxes and NI?

As for this ‘big business ‘ thing that keeps cropping up on this thread, please explain how providing, training and managing Guide Dogs could be a profitable business?

Or Women’s Aid? Where is the business profit, or even viability, please, in providing refuges and counselling, legal and financial support for terrified women and children fleeing with nothing but their clothes on their backs?

Please explain the independent business plan for Water Aid and if it looks strong, I’ll invest as a shareholder.

I do however think attention needs to be paid to the increasing gap between the highest and lowest earners. Absolutely! We were meant to leave the market to sort out what it was good at - maximising profit and the Gov were meant to redistribute the income in a more equitable manner - that was the theory...it didn't work out that way, in the UK, did it?

Well if the government has less income you sure as hell won’t get it redistributed in any effective manner.

Agree - maybe the Gov should increase taxes a bit more then!

The welfare state has only been in existence since 1948 and has grown like topsy since. We have rarely had a redistribution of income policy in this country. Harold Wilson tried 90% tax for the most well off but it failed spectacularly. Most governments have recognised that ludicrously high taxes result in less income for the government. Spending on defence, overseas aid, education, the environment and the NHS is not redistribution because policies and services are available to all. Redistribution will never work here because it’s really closer to communism. No recent government has said this is the intention and certainly no one has been voted in in this platform.

Raising tax levels does not necessarily result in a greater tax take.

it’s really closer to communism it's really not! A few % on income is not communism - not even close!

We do need high earners. It’s now fact that 40% levied from tax payers is now more than all the 20% tax take. We need higher rate tax payers. They pay more VAT and make a bigger contribution to the welfare state and the NHS so that others can benefit. The idea that a low income state works just as well or is somehow fairer is ludicrous. If would mean devastated services paid for by individual taxes. Some basic knowledge of how the economy works would be helpful when having a go at high earners.

We always get this stuff trotted out whenever someone wants to justify their salary. As well as understanding the economy we need to understand the psychological elements inherent within economic policies and the social and political theories underpinning the economy. You can alter a taxation system and bring more people into a higher-earning bracket. You can also close tax avoidance loopholes so that large multinationals pay their dues.

There is luck and privilege as well as skill and hard work involved in getting into powerful and well-paid positions. You also have to want to do it, and not everyone prioritises getting higher pay. Anyone thinking it's all down to talent needs to take a long hard look at Chris Grayling's career.

The welfare state has only been in existence since 1948 and has grown like topsy since.

I'd date it back to the 1911 National Insurance Act personally. I'm not alone in that although you could go earlier.

I don't think YABU.

Whether or not you’re overpaid would depend on what the lowest paid employee in your charity is paid ? If they’re on min wage while you’re earning over 150k then you’re overpaid.
There’s a reason why people are reducing their donations to the larger charities and your wage is one of them .

Anyone thinking it's all down to talent needs to take a long hard look at Chris Grayling's career. Failing Grayling! 😂

there are lots of factors which determine where people end up, such as where they were born and sent to school, family circumstances and so on. People who get paid fortunes seem to think they're something special rather than perhaps appreciating there's an element of luck involved too. It's not just hard work. Plenty of people work and study hard and are very capable.

And plenty of people don't, plenty of people make bad choices, and then bitch and moan that others who are far more capable, earn 10 times what they do.

No one wants to take responsibility for their own predicament anymore, far easier just to say it's unfair that others are more successful.

It’s not just charities, people get up in arms about local government and NHS chief execs or CFOs earning more than the prime minister. I think it’s often just ignorance about what’s involved in those roles and the level of responsibility. They’re paid a fraction of what they would be in the private sector and comparisons with the PM are misleading since most don’t get free housing, travel and such a generous expenses scheme.

No one wants to take responsibility for their own predicament anymore, far easier just to say it's unfair that others are more successful.

Wages at the bottom have been stagnating for years. It's easier for people on the big bucks to think it's all peoples own fault or that they are bitter or lazy rather than to acknowledge any unfairness in the system imo.

Sit in your menial job & cry.

Says someone who can't think outside the box. I worked bottom tier of a charity in a team of 5. All had phenomenal experience and 4 had postgraduate degrees. All had taken the role to accommodate family commitments and keep a foot in the workplace. Our choice but not driven by any lack of skill.

I worked bottom tier of a charity in a team of 5. All had phenomenal experience and 4 had postgraduate degrees. All had taken the role to accommodate family commitments and keep a foot in the workplace. Our choice but not driven by any lack of skill.

That's fine. You made choices. Many other people make different choices, that mean they can climb the corporate ladder and earn big bucks. Don't berate them for their efforts and choices.

Lifecraft.... you cannot seriously say that all the grossly overpaid execs in the U.K. are there because of talent....The majority of senior people running businesses and making key decisions are there because they have a brilliant skill of conning or sucking up to the right people to get up that greasy pole.... I’ve worked with only a few truly talented CEO’s, chairmen in my 30+ year career.... they had some decent talent below them.... I still don’t think the most talented need to earn exorbitant sums at the exspense of the many on less than a decent living wage...
This group also manage to use expensive loop holes to avoid paying the correct tax... another area not open to the majority but I suppose you support their right to do this too... increasing tax on the rich is not the answer .. instead we should increase pay at the lower end and businesses should not expect todistribute so much profit out to wealthy shareholders and bosses... look a ton all the fail
I get businesses .. it’s smoke and mirrors and eventually it unravels and jobs are lost.

LIfecraft ... you really look down on those of the lower end of the pay scale.... some may not have done well at school for many reasons ... you have a cold cut throat take on your fellow human beings... you sound like perfect senior management material....!
I won’t list the reasons many people don’t get the education you believe they should have grasped ...rather than moan.... I doubt you care or you wouldn’t have made such callous spiteful assumptions on the low paid who keep this country running.... these wasters are also the majority who are sent to die in wars( uneducated fools) ....canon fodder sent out by our Eton educated ministers...... not because we care about them or the countries in question but because we are in the business of selling arms along with our American (business friends) Business runs most countries and look at the world it I see creating for the future...

Ferret
I honestly don't see Life as looking down on those who earn less.
I do think Life feels annoyed at those who work in lower paid jobs and moan that because they earn so little everyone should and those that dont are just greedy with no morals are bitter/jealous. I kind of feel the same.

I am in a low paid job. Circumstance and choice put me there. If i could earn £150k trust me I would jump at the chance. However I do not have the skills or education to earn that but I dont begrudge those that do.

Footballers earn more than anyone for what?? That annoys the shit out of me but if I had their skill no way would I turn down a wage like theirs.

Gleeful, you've hit the nail on the head.

As for looking down on low earners, I came from a family of low earners and was one myself for many years. But I never felt bitter towards high earners, rather I admired them and wanted to join them.

There are many reasons why people are poor, or are on low income. Genuine bad luck for a start. But one of the reasons is that some people are unmotivated, lazy, make poor life decisions, have a poor attitude, or a poor work ethic or maybe several of those. Or a host of other self inflicted reasons.

I wish some of the handwringers on MN would acknowledge that.

I wish some of the handwringers on MN would acknowledge that.

I dont think its just MN.

Wealth and success are rarely celebrated in this country. If you are rich because of inheritance or hard work you are greedy, immoral and should give everything to charity.
If you are poor then its because you chose that life, are lazy, a criminal, benefits scroungers.
There is no middle ground.

Hence the "those who work for a charity should do it for free/a pittance because earning a good wage must mean you are a bad person.