To ask what you think of the death penalty? (Don’t open if you don’t like talking about death and crime)

[Chancewouldbeafinethlng]

I listened to Adam Buxtons newest podcast episode and found it very interesting.
I’m not sure how I feel about it. On the one hand there are some criminals who I would not piss on if they were on fire, I think they really deserve to die. But then there is always going to be a person who’s job it is to kill that person.
Also there is the risk that someone has been falsely accused and maybe not had a fair trial. How would you ever know?

The episode touched on the method used currently for the death penalty. The woman who was talking was saying how unreliable it is and is basically torture if it doesn’t work. What other methods could be used though?

Sorry I know it’s a very morbid subject but I would be interested in hearing other people’s opinions.

But prisoners cost a fortune, and the cold hearted part of me thinks why are we paying for murders to have a roof over their head and food?

I get what you are saying OP, but I dont think the cost would change if the death penalty was re-introduced in the UK.

The average length of time on death row is 15 years in the US, so the cost for food etc remains the same.

If we consider ourselves a civilized society, doesn't that mean we are better than those who have committed heinous crimes? And that therefore we should not commit state-sanctioned killing?

A friend who did a law degree did a placement in the US working on death row cases, and said a death sentence costs more to the state than a life sentence, and that seems to be the consensus on Google as well deathpenalty.org/facts/5-myths-death-penalty/

I'm fundamentally opposed to any sentence that is irreversible, even if new evidence comes to light. Countries that still operate the death penalty also often seem to apply to individuals with mental health issues, or who commit crimes as children. It also takes so long to get to execution in the US that an individual could be a completely different person by the time they die. In the US particularly I'm also opposed to it on the basis that it is used to entice people to take plea deals for life imprisonment, which they may take even if innocent, to avoid the possibility of a death sentence

If someone killed someone I love I would want them dead.

Do I think the state should punish people because of an emotional reaction? No.

It pisses me off that we pay for them, of course it does, but what's the alternative? Death penalty, then stop putting theives in prison and start chopping their hands off, castrating sex offenders.... It's a slippery path to everyones bodily autonomy being fucked with when the state can start ordering death.

I don't agree with the death penalty under any circumstances but I would like to see proper sentences given. So, life to mean life etc.

I think this is where I stand too. Some of the sentences I see for violent crime are woeful. I think we should have much harsher sentences including full life terms for repeated violent offenders and murderers.

So we should murder people to save money? When all the prisoners are done, should we start with the terminally ill and then move onto the oldest people? Disabled people next but tough call - the mentally disabled people first or the physically disabled? The oldest ones or the youngest ones?

Then we could move on to socially unacceptable people. Minorities and the like.

Are you completely off your rocker, OP? It would be a lot cheaper to not hold trials, should we do that?

TRIGGER WARNING - graphic

11 years ago one of my good friends was kidnapped, brutalised, dismembered and left to rot for 18 months. When he was convicted for her murder (nothing else because of the condition her remains were in) and I discovered he'd already served a "life" sentence for murder, I became an ardent advocate for the death penalty.

Then I did some research, and even one innocent person being put to death by the state is one too many. It can never be 100% accurate.

I also realised that the desire for revenge harmed me far, far more than it harmed him and I refuse to give that bastard one second more of my life because he's already taken so much from her family and those of us who loved her.

I find the idea of him rotting in segregation (he's in the beast hall because he's a sex offender) for the rest of his life far more of a punishment.

No I’m not off my rocker, I’m asking for opinions while I make my own mind up. I think a mixture of the podcast mentioned and reading the green mile is making me wonder about it.

I naturally sway towards being against it for various reasons, but there are some criminals I would happily kill for the horrendous crimes they have committed on innocent people.

You'd have to be absolutely one hundred percent certain that they did it and be aware of all mitigating factors. Then it could work, but I wouldn't want to be the person handing down the sentence or carrying it out. I prefer full life terms with no possibility of parole, and I'd get them working to earn their keep. I think if a parole board frees a murderer who then kills again that it should count as gross negligence.

I hate to say it, but if you think sex offenders "rot" anywhere, you are sorely mistaken. I'm afraid that's all I can really say on the subject as I need my job!

I'm also sorry for your loss, InTheHeatOf

Ooh thanks OP, I shall be listening to this episode later on, very fascinating topic. Ok i sound morbid but i am very much interested in all my true crime, doesn't half keep me up asking myself questions.

To answer your OP, when i was younger i used to agree with it but obviously growing up i realised how barbaric that would be. I would rather the Brady types be kept alive to suffer, and also used to think
"why should they have the easy option out after what they have done?!"

Was watching those 2 death row episodes that were on ITV a couple of weeks ago, which lead to me and my mum having a debate over whether one of the prisoners should be given the lethal injection despite him not actually committing any of the murders

Again, the numbers of prisoners who are actually innocent. But for those who I couldn't waste my breath to talk about for what they have done, I'd want them to suffer and spend the rest of their lives never being free till it's all over for them

I totally changed my views on the death penalty when I met DH. Went from being very pro to very anti after many a 'heated debate.'

My take on it is innocent people have been put to death in the past. One is too many.

And frankly I think someone spending the rest of their days incarcerated craving freedom is more of a punishment than getting to exit the consequences of their evil like Bundy did.

Brady suffered more by going on hunger strike and not getting what he wanted. As did Hindley never getting parole and getting out.

The Manson girls are still locked up 50 years on and still desperately go for parole and get rejected all the time and now they are pensioners.

I like to think they are all suffering more having to live in prison with mental torture every day. Death is too much of a release from having to relive what they have done every day.

InTheHeatofLisbon that’s awful, I’m so sorry to hear that. Your post makes a lot of sense though, thanks for sharing your story.

I think its wrong in theory and doesn't work in reality.

If you look at the USA, you will see people on death row are disproportionately black, poor and much more likely to have learning difficulties. Many of them had very poor legal representation at their trials. The process with years and years of expensive appeals prolongs the agony for the victims, so I don't see how it benefits anyone. It seems random whether people achieve stays or clemency. I think the whole process is torture for everyone involved actually.

@InTheHeatofLisbon

I completely agree with your views on this x

If life in jail were harsher, I’d not be so pro-death penalty

I agree with the death penalty and wish the UK laws and prisons were stricter. I know many people who disagree with it as they see it as you being just as bad as them and I can almost agree with them....

Then I always think back to James Bulger- I wish we had the death penalty to deal with those two monsters whether it was waiting for them to turn 18 and being adults.

Sometimes it's not about vengeance or justice. There are such horrific crimes out there that the death penalty should be thought about as eradicating pure evil.

That's my view anyway, some people are born evil and there is no redemption.

I will never support the death that penalty

Some people have committed some truly evil acts (I don’t believe people are evil it’s what the choose to do) but I still do not think state sanctioned murder is the correct way to deal with them

I have no problem that some people will never know freedom again

The death penalty is a lovely, tempting, simplistic solution to a range of problems we haven’t figured out how to solve. Most criminality is a result of mental health conditions, poor upbringing, desperation, etc. Even when someone murders another person, that doesn’t mean there is no hope of that person ever truly repenting. I can’t get on board with the DP myself.

One interesting point I heard was that a jury would be less likely to pass a guilty judgement if the accused would get the death sentence. I think I’d find it too hard to find someone guilty if they faced certain death. Therefore, the guilty murderer may be very likely to get off totally scotfree.

I can’t remember whether this was just a friends opinion, or based on anything more substantial.

Then I always think back to James Bulger- I wish we had the death penalty to deal with those two monsters whether it was waiting for them to turn 18 and being adults.

Whereas I think they were clearly damaged, abandoned little boys. I am almost as sad for the children they were as I am for the child they killed.

There are not any miscarriages of justice now it’s always proved with DNA in the USA at least - even the appeals process does not exclude the DNA results they have Been proven guilty they look for lack of proper representation by the defence lawyer etc, in the appeals process they never actually plead the innocence of the perpetrator as the DNA evidence is definitive proof of guilt

Then I always think back to James Bulger- I wish we had the death penalty to deal with those two monsters whether it was waiting for them to turn 18 and being adults.

You want the death penalty for 10 year olds?

I am completely opposed to the death penalty.
It has no place in a civilised society - it is just government sanctioned murder, which makes the government imposing the sentence no better than the criminal they are killing.
It also really bothers me that someone who commits a crime so horrible that the death penalty is a possibility, then they are getting the easy way out really aren’t they? The family of their victim/victims still have to live every single day of their lives living with the details what this person has done. Why should the perpetrator escape that? They should have to live with what they’ve done too.

Sadly there are many people in the prison system that have a mental illness. Not so severe that they are housed in places like Rampton, but still they struggle to "survive" in the community. They have personality disorders and display a serious lack of boundaries which has lead to their offending. It's not always black and white, though I appreciate that doesn't help the victims or their families who are left to pick up the pieces.