DH not supportive of career change

[Cheeseandapple]

I've been a teacher for 7 years and just come off mat leave and back to work for the summer term. The job is totally unrewarding, no autonomy, the way schools are run (I've worked in a few) is de-skilling very experienced teachers and I'm yet to find a school that shares my educational values. I'm no longer interested in pursuing promotion within education. I've discussed this with DH over the last few months but without knowing what I'd do instead.

I've recently started looking into retraining to become a solicitor. Just making initial enquiries into training routes, funding etc. for the past few weeks. Not mentioned anything to DH as he is so busy working and studying we barely have time to eat a meal together at the moment. Today we went on a long walk and so I took the opportunity to mention that I've started looking into this career change.

His only comment was on my pension payments and the financial pressure it puts him under (he's a very high earner). Then he walked ahead of me until the gap between us was so substantial he got home 5 mins before me and sulked.

He is a high earner and we have a large mortgage. When he has expressed unhappiness in his job I've said the most important thing is his happiness, we can downsize and be mortgage free if that is what he wants. I'd support him.

AIBU to be considering retraining and changing career rather than staying in a job I'm unhappy doing in order to keep paying into my pension, which I won't be able to draw for another 37 years and to take a pay cut for a few years until my salary increases again? Is it that uncommon?

I'd do 1 year full time or 2 year part time conversion course (could try and get part time work) then 2 year paid traineeship

Is your first degree in Law? At the moment you need to do the LPC (one year f/t two years p/t) but before that you either need a sufficiently recent qualifying law degree or a one year f/t or two years p/t conversion ( the GDL), so actually you may be needing to pay for more than you realise.

BUT:

www.law.ac.uk/postgraduate/sqe/

And with the plans to the new SQE the LPC will be going, but so will the paid traineeship quite possibly, so depending on what firms end up doing (some may insist on an LPC like course, some may still expect some form of traineeship they run themselves) it is quite difficult to plan ahead as the SRA themselves don't know what it looks like and when.

As PPs have said it's all about your approach. With a large shared mortgage you can't just say "I want to do X" (not saying that's what you've done) it needs to be a joint conversation where you ask the question "could this be possible" look at the time line and what sacrifices would need to be made. It's a very different question if you have children or if they're planned soon, I think.

I wonder if you've mentioned it just a tad too soon, if you've not even heard of the CiLex route I assume you must be in the very early stages of digging. And aren't the traineeships really competitive and can take years to get one? I think you need to do enough research so that when you ask the question you can quickly alleviate the big concerns.

Happiness is absolutely paramount but you can't be too simplistic when you already have big commitments, so I wouldn't be too hard on him with the initial shock (although storming off is quite petulant and I wouldn't be happy if my DH did that). My DH has a habit of pulling U turns like this, sometimes I've been supportive and gone through with it, other times I've had to veto especially now we are a mortgage and 2 kids down (well not veto'd but managed to talk some sense into), but it has to be a conversation.

It's probably a lot to take in for him.

I retrained to become a lawyer at 30. It did put financial pressure on us as DH was the sole earner for the time it took me to qualify.

I would let it sink in and then chat to him again. Had you mentioned retraining before to him?

It's not easy so please think carefully and talk to as many lawyers as you can. Training contracts are becoming harder and harder to obtain. Hours are long and when you break it down by hour, often the pay isn't as amazing as it first seems. As a trainee you will be expected to do the hours needed to get the job done. When I retrained, most of the other trainees were early 20s, with no family commitments so could easily work all night if they had to. These things matter when you are then up for consideration for permanent roles post qualification.

Finally traditionally it's not the most family friendly field. You will need to have a very strong childcare provision to be able to stand up to the late nights/ weekend working that may come depending on the type of law you decide to practice. Flexible working is still quite new, and certainly to a newly qualified would not be easy to come by. I work flexibly now but it's not without its pitfalls.

On the other hand it can be intellectually very rewarding, I work with an amazing team of people and have some really great clients. And i absolutely loved my conversion course and going back to college again!

Don't be too critical of him. Perhaps he hates his job too?

It's a big decision, and needs to be agreed by BOTH of you. Give him time to digest things and discuss this. It would be totally unreasonable of you to just go ahead, which is perhaps what he thinks you're doing.

The solicitor route is the only thing that I've been interested in since I started thinking about it in earnest but I'm not stuck on it.

What area/s are you interested in? There's such a massive difference between different sectors. E.g. I'm in litigation, I'm pretty senior and the pay is decent however it's often ridiculously stressful with court deadlines, I fairly regularly do 12 or 13 hour days. Compare that to acquaintance who works in private client (wealth management) and she's without the court deadlines but also without the highs of winning in court. Then criminal law, intellectually absolutely fascinating but horrendous hours and low pay. Or in house at local government, varied, flexible etc but underfunded and not much autonomy.

It's really unusual to have anything bar statutory maternity pay. Flexibility is creeping in but slowly and in the firm's I've worked in not much flexibility at more junior levels.

Second what people have said about the difficulty of finding a training contract. Only one of my peers qualified via that route and she put in 5 years as a paralegal before she got it. Everyone in my current department, bar the head of department who's been there since year dot are chartered legal execs (cilex route) rather than solicitors. The training costs a fraction of gdl, LPC etc.

I'm rambling a bit!

Basically, do research, have a decent idea of what you actually want to do.

Oh, and I finished my last two units with DD around, one when I was pregnant and anaemic and one when she was little and didn't sleep through for approximately forever! It was brutal. Worked full time and studied as well, so be realistic about how you'll be able to get everything done.

Ex because city trained and came to the conclusion that big city transactions are basically earning fees for moving imaginary money between companies for no reason other than an imaginary money profit...

City is shit hours, often for no good reason - often quiet during the day then shit hits fan at 4.30pm ... because the client was faffing.

If science degree, would consider IP or even Patent Attorney.

High street/small regional firms are better to work for but budgets are limited - unlikely to get a training contract but lots will employ eager paralegals on a pittance by dangling the TC carrot just out of reach. Pay is now very much lower than it was even 10 years ago, even at partner level.

I think rollonfriday still exists, very cynical careers resource.

I'm considering NHS admin as my next plan, having rejected teaching due to logistical impossibility with DH's job. Other options include Land Registry (legal aspects but qualifications not necessarily required) and local government...

I wouldn't get out of a secure career with a decent pension without a robust plan!

Maybe he’s having a stressful time so reacted badly. I think it’s a huge decision to effectively ask someone to be the main wage earner for the foreseeable future and possibly forever given what PP have said about most solicitor roles and pay. I’ve seen marriages break down for less. You need to be happy but so does he so you taking a cut, how could he do the same at any point so he doesn’t feel trapped. It’s all very well saying you will downsize and cut lifestyle but the reality might not be quite so appealing. I say this as former main earner (city wages) who has taken a cut because I hated it and the radical lifestyle change is hard to get used to.

Training contracts are really hard to get, as a mature grad your chances are minimal. Honestly, it's so unlikely.

The worst thing here is him stalking off in a sulk because you simply suggested a change. Is this what he’s like?!

I did all my study (GDL and LPC) part time while working full time. Do able, esp with time off during the summer. But I didn’t have kids so less tough for me at the time. You could be at the door of qualification without having given up work. It seems though that with two very young children this could be really tough, my friend and study pal did it though in your circumstances.

However as others say, it’s a nightmare to get a training contract, I didn’t and qualified via CILEx after ending up working in-house rather than as a traditional solicitor- I was a bit older, I suspect you won’t get a training contract unless you have a sure fire route through contacts.

You could consider alternative work from teaching - try to get a job as a legal secretary and see if you like the environment/solicitor role up close. That could also line you up with a training contract if the firm support you and the right environment in which to study. You can also consider CILEx which will allow you to go at a pace you choose but leaves you a little more restricted in the legal services you can offer.

A younger college at work has a boyfriend who is trying to proceed with his law career and isn’t having any luck-he applies yearly and has been rejected every year. He has been working as a paralegal for 6 years now-still trying. He works shockingly long hours as well.

What childcare provision could you have in place if your DH also worked horrible long hours!

You might stand a slightly better chance getting at least a paralegal job in education law, given your experience. However, it's a very niche field and, at the legal aid end, badly paid.

You’re DH will basically stay in a job he hates for the next 30 years so expects you to do the same.

He should want you to be happy.

A younger college at work has a boyfriend who is trying to proceed with his law career and isn’t having any luck-he applies yearly and has been rejected every year. He has been working as a paralegal for 6 years now-still trying. He works shockingly long hours as well

Did he go to a good University though? My cousin studied Law at Durham University and found it very easy to find work, he is working as a trainee solicitor.

His Law firm would never take on someone who went to Manchester University for example. It has to be one of the very top universities.

OP did you do very well at school, could you get into somewhere like Durham? The poster I’ve quoted is right, it is very competitive, there are WAY more people with the qualifications than there are jobs available. Also your age could count against you compared with recent graduates when they’re hiring.

Definitely do a lot of research first.

Sounds like the relationship needs some work if you never see each other and you are unable to discuss something really important to you.
If you are so busy, what is he working for? To me if you can afford to downsize with no mortgage I would do it immediately - more important to have time as a family whilst the children are young.

I retrained when I was 30, meant a paycut for a few years, but I was single at the time so saved by cheap accommodation. Very different with 2 kids. However - I would still strongly support the idea of retraining now if Dh or I wanted to - as long as our basic costs could be covered during the training. Life is too short to be miserable at work.

Are there perhaps other roles you could do with your existing qualifications? Even if just temporarily, as you can't for anything drastic until dc 2 is a bit older? Teaching in a different environment might be better.

This needs some thought for sure.You sound as if you have a lot on ATM TBH. Teaching is a stressful job for sure ,(Cousin and her family all teach!).But surely Law is not easy either ,as others have said here.What if you gave up teaching and Law doesnt work out ?.Maybe thats why DH is worried .Why not take a couple of years out with your family(maybe do some stand in teaching if poss, one or two days P/W)See how you feel then .

Why don’t you think about changing where you teach? Eg if you are a primary teacher would you be able to teach adult learners in college?

Sorry I don’t know much about teaching.

Yeah OP my cousin who is a trainee solicitor is working 16 year days. Do you really want that?

Erm @Hithere12 you do realise Manchester is a Russell Group university that has a very well-regarded law programme?

Did you mean Manchester Metropolitan?

Erm @Hithere12 you do realise Manchester is a Russell Group university that has a very well-regarded law programme? hmm

Oh my god. Yes I know it is. That is my POINT. Law has become so competitive that the firm my cousin works at won’t accept trainee solicitors who have graduated from even Manchester. That’s just a fact

I’m not saying it’s a bad University. I’m saying that Law has become so over subscribed as a subject that Law firms are only taking on people from Universities that are in the top 6/7 in the league tables. Do you think my cousin is lying? They haven’t taken anyone from Manchester in over 15 years because they are flooded with applications from Oxbridge/Durham.

But Manchester is ranked higher than Durham in the Times University Rankings? How odd.*

• and no I didn't go there, I was at Cambridge so have no personal stake in this

Was DH sulking or was he simply trying to process what you'd said?
You have a baby and another on the way, you are both so busy you scarcely see each other and you suddenly throw at him that you want to leave your job and take time out to retrain. That's quite a lot to take in. I suspect I'd want some time to think it over in his position. And you both need to talk about how this will work practically.

In The Guardian league table for Law specifically Durham is at number 8, Manchester is at 60

www.theguardian.com/education/ng-interactive/2018/may/29/university-league-tables-2019

For most of the league tables I’ve looked at for general subjects Manchester is at around 15, Durham is at 6. The league tables vary but for
www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings
and The Guardian Manchester comes in much lower. I’m

For Law particularly it seems to rank low. I’m not putting down the University just trying to show how competitive it is due to way too many people wanting to be solicitors compared to available jobs. So Law firms are going to choose Oxbridge/Durham students over others.

OP is it that you are desperate to become a solicitor or could you just do any office type job in the corporate world?

Your definitely approaching this from a teacher perspective where you have to train for a specific role, when for the vast majority of jobs you don’t need to hold a specific degree. You can just work for a company and work your way up.

When he has expressed unhappiness in his job I've said the most important thing is his happiness, we can downsize and be mortgage free if that is what he wants. I'd support him.

Was that before or after you told him you want to leave your job to go back to university? Because if it was before then he's probably thinking it wasn't a sincere offer.

He didn't handle things well with the storming off and sulking. That's not ok. But honestly I can see why he's got serious reservations about this. You've got one child and another on the way and he's now facing the prospect of being the only earner in the household for a number of years. He might also be worried that after sinking a substantial amount of time and money into uni you might decide that Law isn't for you afterall.