To wonder why Croydon/Sutton get so much negativity

[Dobdebdop]

Me and dh are looking to move from our current house and our currently house hunting in these two boroughs. We are seeking to be able to go mortgage free so I can start a business.

When we brought this up to family and friends, many sounded absolutely horrified at the idea.

When viewing properties we found most of these areas to be pleasant and absolutely fine. The high streets in both are a bit shabby but Central London is less than 30 mins for shopping so we can just go there.

I dont understand why there is so much negativity to this part of South London, I don't know much about this area but my impression is that it was an absolutely fine place to live.

Born and bred in and around Croydon/Sutton, as previously stated. I moved 2 years ago at the first opportunity I got. It is not a desirable place to live or bring up children in my opinion. There is a massive gang culture in Croydon (I have family members who work in the social services for Croydon and it is dire) and Sutton is a dive. There are more desirable areas, if you can afford them, like epsom, cheam etc. but you still have to live with a deal with the anti-social behaviour of both areas. I myself lived in a 'nicer' part, and I hated having to go into the town centre, catch public transport etc.

I wouldn't move back there even if the housing was really cheap and meant we could go mortgage free.

My opinion on Croydon is that in 5-10 years time it will actually be quite expensive to buy there.

Yes there are some rough parts still but it also has the potential for parts of it to be really nice. If you look at somewhere like addiscombe, it has actually got a lot of streets with (what could be with some tlc) lovely Victorian terraces but it is minutes from east Croydon Station which has unrivalled links into London (the trains are so frequent it's like the tube and they run all through the night).

I think once the millennial hipsters get priced out of places like West Norwood and Crystal Palace they'll gravitate to places like addiscombe and the chicken shops will get replaced by trendy cafes and bars.

Then you've got the Westfield that's being built there.

I'm too old to wait for places to up and come now but if I was in my 20s again it's where I'd look to buy.

NotInterested I have lived in the LB Croydon for over 20 years and have teens. I have never come across this gang culture. There area some really lovely parts of the Borough.

Cheam is part of the LB Sutton.

There are some really less desirable parts of Epsom too.

For the same price (or less) than a house in Croydon/Sutton, you could get a house somewhere like Guildford or Woking. Guildford, for example, has a fast train that takes 30 minutes to central London and they are very frequent around commuter times. Unless there is a specific need to live in London or the surroundings, I would much rather live in either of those.

Seeline Different experiences for different people I suppose. I've had first hand experience of gangs having grown up there for over 20 years. I've also had family members witness stabbings, moped thefts etc. from the gang culture and crime there. I do not feel safe walking around Croydon at night and when I was at school, they actually banned us from going to Croydon/Streatham/Mitcham at times because there were threats of violence from gangs.

There is a massive gang culture in Croydon

Not if you live in the south of the borough.

Family and friends living away from London are having bigger difficulty with country lines tbh and drugs tbh. There is also amazing drugs ed here as a boy from our Church (and DS old school) died very sadly from taking MDMA and his parents have set up an amazing charity that is very active in schools in educating kids about drugs and choices. I was exposed tool far more drugs than they have been as was taught far less (other than Zammo in GH and just say no obv)

I never had an issue with either. They both have nice parts and rough parts. But so do Richmond and Kensington.

They are still quite white working class. But so was Fulham when I lived there 30- 40 odd years ago, and so were Clapham and Balham 20-30 years ago. Central London affluence is just spreading out to meet the affluent boroughs. I don’t think this is a good thing. I enjoyed living in an eclectic London. But it is increasingly hard to find amongst artisan bread shops and yoga studios.

Sutton has very good schools, much better than other parts of London. This is a long standing characteristic of the area and what would have attracted me to the area. Affordable family homes, good schools and easy of commute mean it won’t be long before Sutton rolls over into gentrification.

Croydon is probably a city or county in its own right now.

SoupDragon Why would you choose to live somewhere, where parts of it have a culture like that, if you didn't have to though? I understand if you have to live in London, or close to, out of necessity. I wouldn't want to live anywhere where large parts of it, the town centre etc. I wasn't comfortable to go to.

And yes I am aware that there are horrible parts to every borough/town/city. But as mentioned upthread, even the 'horrible' parts of Surrey where I live are posh in comparison to Croydon or Sutton. You don't have the same high crime rates/gangs/stabbings etc. You don't worry about your children going there. The schools don't have to deal with anywhere near the same amount of behaviour issues. The schools don't have to deal with gang culture.

It's just not somewhere I would personally choose to live, given the choice.

Sorry if I sound judgemental here but... Sutton has good schools if you are able to get into a Grammar e.g. Nonsuch, Wellington, Wilsons. Again, having experienced all of this myself, I wouldn't send my kids to any of the other schools. I went to a Sutton school, not long enough ago for it to have undergone a dramatic change, and it was horrible. Horrible kids with horrible families.

Why would you choose to live somewhere, where parts of it have a culture like that, if you didn't have to though?

I have never experienced any of it at all.

SoupDragon But you just said in response to this...

There is a massive gang culture in Croydon

Not if you live in the south of the borough.

So you must have some experience then... if not just the talk from the other side of the borough and crime statistics?

@DSHathawayGivesMeFannyGallops

Wallington is so rough they closed down the police station because and this was actually said, "the officers in Wallington felt the need for a day to day presence was a waste of resources" I have lived here my entire life and have never felt unsafe in Wallington. It's quiet and clean. If your friend had been in roundshaw which some people mistake for Wallington then yes rough, but Wallington is great. High house prices good schools. Great public transport. I get really ticked off when people bash Croydon and Sutton. Croydon can seem deprived because it is the largest borough in London! So it is going to have some rough round the edges places but generally it is good, yeah the high streets are rubbish, but show me a modern day high street that is good, retail is dying format as more people move to online shopping and click and collect. Croydon high street has been ruined by the oft promised Westfield that has failed to materialize.

Croydon and Wallington have some lovely hidden gems. We have Nonsuch palace, Henry the VIII'S hunting grounds. Bessington park which is lovely on a good sunny day. And more history than you need, like for example Croydon airport which helped win the war and launched and received some of the greatest aviation pioneers.

I'd like to know what the 'good' schools being mentioned on this thread are in Croydon and Sutton. Excluding the grammar and private schools.

I wouldn't send my children to any of them and had a beyond horrendous experience in one myself.

Sorry to hear that Notinterested1 but know people that were suicidal after experiences at. Godolphin and St Paul's so sadly shitty times can happen anywhere.

Woodcote had a great rep, Warlingham too (although strictly Surrey not Croydon), many friends happy with both Coombe Woods (run by Wally Grammar - boys) and Harris Purley. DCs are Riddlesdown after moving DC1 from more central school, both DCs v happy there and hoping DC3 gets a sibling place too next year as we are out of catchment.

@Chartreuser it's really not deceiving the Bank of England isn't classed as Roehampton, I think Roehampton is one of the largest estates in Europe from the bottom at Danebury Avenue to just before you get out to Dover house road that is all Roehampton and it's dire.

I lived and worked for a good while in central Croydon and Norwood and did a year at the college earlier on. Met some terrific people but I have to be honest and say i felt the 'vibe' was quite unpleasant, for want of a better word. I say that as a huge fan of brutalist architecture, too! Never somewhere I was particularly keen to go for a drink after work. I'm from a very un-posh northern town, so not a snob.

Purely, Caterham and other places south of Croydon town centre seemed nicer although I never got to know them well. Even the centre has great multicultural restaurants and food shops though which I loved plus it's very well connected so it's not all bad.

Perhaps I associate it with a crap period in my life as a late- teen but I couldn't wholeheartedly advise someone to move to Croydon.

Hmm we will have to beg to differ as I know two other families who firmly classed themselves as living in Roehampton (Clarence Lane and just off Roehampton Lane) in massive houses too. And DB and DS were both born in Queen Mary's which is most definitely Roehampton!

Of course you can have shitty experiences anywhere. But not every school experiences the same level of poverty, gang culture etc. as in deprived areas like Sutton and Croydon.

Every other student at my secondary school was from a 'chav' family, they behaved appallingly, there was constant swearing, smoking, truanting. The majority of students causing constant behaviour issues for the teachers. Then you had the other type of students who were from Croydon/Streatham who would be involved with gangs, meeting gang members at the school gates.

'Normal kids' from 'nice' families were very much in the minority. There were constant friendship issues, fights etc. So yes, whilst every school has its issues, including Eton, the type of families that send their children to some of the Sutton and Croydon schools (Overton Grange, Carshalton Girls etc.) would not be where I would want my DC to be. Sorry if that makes me sound like an arsehole, but I am only speaking the truth as I see it.

It doesn't make you sound like an arsehole and that's exactly why we left London after 25 years so we didn't have to send ds to high school. I hear you.

Our youngest is in the last year of sixth form so schools are not a worry.

Would you really describe Sutton as a deprived area?! Wow. The 'type of families' that live in Croydon and Sutton are, in the vast majority, normal, average, employed parents with pretty normal, average kids. It's not the hot bed of crime and depravation you are portraying.

Many friends from here went to private schools as kids (as thankfully people have not been priced out in the same way as many other areas of London) and at the time this was due to state schools being as your describe. Many do now send their own kids private but others don't as they say the school are so much better. A friend went to Haling Manor and now has a child that goes to its successor Harris Purley and says they're chalk and cheese. Although the new Coombe Wood school is definitely changing the intake demographic so will be interesting to see if the school is doing so well in a few years time

Sutton and Croydon are large boroughs which move from inner London in the north to countryside close to M25 in the south. Like most London boroughs there are some parts you'd want to live in and some parts you wouldn't.

I moved from Richmond to Sutton because Richmond is completely unaffordable. I also grew up in a neighbouring borough to Croydon so I know all three well. There is no point comparing them.

If you have a normal income and want to live in London - renting or buying - you have to compromise in some way.

(One major benefit over Richmond is NO plane noise!)

there is also Galicia, which is where now-DH and I went on our first date

DH and I went on our first date to the Porter & Sorter

Incidentally, if we ever get a summer this year, the beer garden at the Dog & Bull is amazing.

Some of the brutalist architecture is on its way out and has been demolished. I think the place has quite an exciting vibe now.

Avoid West Croydon OP and you'll be fine. (I can see where your mates are coming from though - Richmond would take some beating).