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Original poster

FGM on year 5 school curriculum

571 replies

MermaidMummy · 07/06/2019 10:27

I'm really not sure if I'm being unreasonable, so I'm interested in everyone's thoughts.
My 9-year-old's class has just started learning about puberty. We have been told that the next lesson will cover terminology such as erection, sperm and female genital mutilation.
I just don't get why they need to learn about FGM at 9 years old. Some of these kids are very "young" for their age, and mine is very sensitive (won't watch the news in case an "adult topic" crops up).
What is the rationale for teaching this in year 5? There is nobody in the class from a cultural background likely to carry out FGM, but even if there was, would a 9 year-old know that it might happen to them and inform a teacher (if that is the rationale for teaching it)? From what I have read they aren't told anything about it in advance. If it has already happened to them, what is the benefit of bringing it up in class? Couldn't it be damaging and stigmatising?

OP posts:
AbbyHammond · 07/06/2019 13:42

I'd be surprised that fgm is on the curriculum for year 5 to be honest.

I'd want to talk to the teacher and find out exactly how she intended to approach it.

woodhill · 07/06/2019 13:49

I think you right Fibke

Probably best to keep quiet. Look at the Rotherham situation. You are treading on eggshells

Fibbke · 07/06/2019 13:50

When they teach it to year 5s are they going to stress how bad and wrong it is?

icecreamsundae32 · 07/06/2019 13:51

This is a tricky one @MermaidMummy
I work with children and have to do safeguarding training and went on an FGM course 3 years ago, it was very distressing and made me feel physically ill and I had to take a break for a few minutes. A lot of others in the room felt the same and we were all adults.

I imagine that children in primary age won't be hearing horrific details but of course it will affect them and as you say they might worry about it happening to them. It does seem a shame children have to learn about this so young and it does feel more appropriate to teach it in year 7 but at the same time this practice often happens to young children, it's heartbreaking and I understand the want to protect your child from this.

IsabellaLinton · 07/06/2019 13:53

It's not their problem and they shouldn't be made to feel that its something they can do anything about. If social workers cant deal with it then why should teachers have to? Are we naive enough to think if we tell girls at 6 that its wrong that these girls will stand up to their parents?

You phrased it much better than I could.

All sorts of things are wicked and evil but we’re not taught the specifics of them at school. It’s just not necessary. And what can children do about it?

It’s the adults responsible who must be prosecuted as vigorously and publicly as possible.

IsabellaLinton · 07/06/2019 13:56

Fuck me, some people are callous

Says the disingenuous, self-serving moral relativist! Grin

Mammylamb · 07/06/2019 13:57

Unfortunately I learned about it from Marie Claire magazine at 8 years old (in dentist waiting room). Was honestly traumatized. And terrified of it happening to me (white working class catholic Glaswegian)

BertrandRussell · 07/06/2019 13:57

If children are told by people outside their families that it’s wrong they might be able to tell another adult and be saved from this particular atrocity, or be able to save their younger sisters.

Original poster
MermaidMummy · 07/06/2019 13:57

icecreamsundae32
I don't think this age group are emotionally mature enough to deal with the information. I can imagine playground taunting of children from these cultures, rather than supportivenesd and helping to identify victims.
The girls in my daughter's class are reporting feeling embarassed to change in front of the boys for p.e. since having their first lesson. I don't think they should be changing in a mixed room at all,.but that's a separate issue.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 07/06/2019 13:58

“Says the disingenuous, self-serving moral relativist! ”

Says the person with the utterly disgusting sense of humour.

CassianAndor · 07/06/2019 14:00

no, they shouldn't - single sex changing facilities over the age of 8. I believe your school is breaking the law in not having these, so I'd be kicking up a bloody fuss about that.

BertrandRussell · 07/06/2019 14:00

“I don't think this age group are emotionally mature enough to deal with the information.”

Do you think they are emotionally mature enough to deal with the idea of sexual abuse?

OurChristmasMiracle · 07/06/2019 14:01

Learning about it won’t prevent it from happening necessarily, it however will enable the child to know that is wrong and where to go for help, and could potentially therefore lead to prosecutions of people doing these procedures.

As long as it’s age appropriate I think it is a good thing.

hibbledibble · 07/06/2019 14:05

Yabu

Education is the best hope of stopping this barbaric practice. Children, and adults need to be educated.

pikapikachu · 07/06/2019 14:05

It's unusual for y5 boys and girls to change together. They are separated in y2 or y3 round here.

IsabellaLinton · 07/06/2019 14:05

@BertrandRussell

Says the person with the utterly disgusting sense of humour.

I forgot, you don’t have one. And a moral relativist too. What an miserable combination.

IsabellaLinton · 07/06/2019 14:06

Do you think they are emotionally mature enough to deal with the idea of sexual abuse?

Nope.

Original poster
MermaidMummy · 07/06/2019 14:08

CassianAndor

no, they shouldn't - single sex changing facilities over the age of 8. I believe your school is breaking the law in not having these, so I'd be kicking up a bloody fuss about that.

I didn't know this.

OP posts:
Fibbke · 07/06/2019 14:09

Do people really think a child will dob in her parents to a teacher? Do people not realise how this works? There are a lot of white saviours on this thread.

Original poster
MermaidMummy · 07/06/2019 14:12

BertrandRussell

Do you think they are emotionally mature enough to deal with the idea of sexual abuse?

Sexual abuse can happen to anyone. FGM can only happen to females and usually from very specific cultural backgrounds. Teaching kids of this age about something horrible that can happen to a minority of females could lead to bullying or taunting of any females from those cultures. Much like any topic that singles out a minority, whether or not the intention is to educate for the benefit of those females.

OP posts:
IsabellaLinton · 07/06/2019 14:13

The very first successful prosecution came about in February this year. The only one so far!

And the child was three. Rather too early for her to be educated about the danger her parents posed to her.

BertrandRussell · 07/06/2019 14:16

“ There are a lot of white saviours on this thread.“

Including Nimco Ali- whose article I linked to downthread?

Fibbke · 07/06/2019 14:18

And are we just going to be taught that its a thing that happens?or are they going to be taught that its wrong, illegal and barbaric? As educating people out of this will only happen if its made clear how wrong it is. And if we tell children aged 8 that some people from Africa commit this terrible crime, isnt this likely to create all kinds of racially motivated issues among kids who arent old enough to understand nuance? Or are we going to normalise it by not reiterating how wrong it is?

Original poster
MermaidMummy · 07/06/2019 14:20

Fibbke

And are we just going to be taught that its a thing that happens?or are they going to be taught that its wrong, illegal and barbaric? As educating people out of this will only happen if its made clear how wrong it is. And if we tell children aged 8 that some people from Africa commit this terrible crime, isnt this likely to create all kinds of racially motivated issues among kids who arent old enough to understand nuance? Or are we going to normalise it by not reiterating how wrong it is?

Exactly!

OP posts:
IsabellaLinton · 07/06/2019 14:20

From the Guardian:
”The Ugandan woman, 37, and her Ghanaian partner, 43, were both from Walthamstow, east London. While the parents were on bail, police searched the mother’s home and found evidence of witchcraft, including spells aimed at silencing professionals involved in the case. Police found spells written inside 40 frozen limes and two ox tongues with screws embedded in them with the apparent aim of keeping police, social workers and lawyers quiet.”

This issue isn’t one that all children need to learn about and be warned against. It comes from specific cultural backgrounds, why pretend all children are equally at risk when they are obviously not?