To ask you to stop flying

[Walkingthere]

We are facing a climate disaster. Our children will have to live through it. And yet I overheard two women today discussing how many holidays abroad they had been on this year. Both over 60 years of age. Obviously it will not directly impact on them.
This is also very common in my social group, people jetting off 4-5 times a year. Mini-breaks, weekends away, European trips, long haul, hen do's, weddings, birthdays. It's unbelievable how much people are burying their heads in the sand.

We need to stop flying. Urgently. Now. My family have not flown in over 5 years. We used to travel a lot, before we realised the consequences. I am putting this here, to make people think, we all need to urgently reduce (ideally stop) flying now.

I agree it's really the billionaires and the large corporations who need to be brought into line

I'm always baffled by the 'big corporations are to blame for climate change' nonsense.

A proportional fraction of Big Corporation's footprint is transferred to its consumers with each purchase, ultimately leaving them with none and the consumer with 100%.

Jesus. I know the OP might be a bit heavy-handed but some of these comments are sickening. People do not seem to realise what's coming at us in the next 10, 20, 30 years.

www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change-global-warming-end-human-civilisation-research-a8943531.html?utm_source=reddit.com
"‘High likelihood of human civilisation coming to end’ by 2050, report finds"

environmentjournal.online/articles/climate-change-taking-its-toll-on-human-health-report-finds/
"Climate change is already posing major risks to people’s health with the problem only set to get worse if urgent action is not taken to reduce emissions."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-48337629
"The long-held view has been that the world's seas would rise by a maximum of just under a metre by 2100. This new study, based on expert opinions, projects that the real level may be around double that figure. This could lead to the displacement of hundreds of millions of people, the authors say."

Plus, this:

the aviation industry provides employment

...wins for biggest load of shite on this thread. At least I can have sympathy with the "my family live a long plane ride away" argument, but come on. When we're facing a full on global catastrophe, the aviation industry's employment record pales into insignificance.

@M3lon I like my family so I NEED to be there for events like this, considering we lost some members quite early on.
I am doing my bits elsewhere. I won't sacrifice family time.

I haven't flown anywhere in nearly 20 years. I win!

Honestly, everyone should be giving up meat before flights. Eating significant less meat and dairy is the single biggest thing you can do to reduce your environmental impact - far more than taking fewer flights.

I'm always baffled by the 'big corporations are to blame for climate change' nonsense. A proportional fraction of Big Corporation's footprint is transferred to its consumers with each purchase, ultimately leaving them with none and the consumer with 100%.

Yes! Ultimately all "big corporations" are doing whatever they're doing for consumers. We all need to, collectively, stop dodging responsibility.

Glad to see you here @AlaskanOilBaron, you were bloody fantastic on the last climate change-related thread I was on.

Jesus. I know the OP might be a bit heavy-handed but some of these comments are sickening. People do not seem to realise what's coming at us in the next 10, 20, 30 years.

OP is getting shite because she is obviously working on a third kid and telling people to stop flying.

3rd kid vs flying - no contest, the former is the carbon bomb.

isabella there may be some middle ground between flying half way around the world to attend a wedding and never going anywhere or seeing anyone.

How about, see local friends and family in person (preferably by train) and do skype with friends and family in other countries?

Go to weddings that are local, don't go to wedding on the other side of the planet.

It honestly doesn't seem that difficult to me.

I have friends and family near home and abroad. I stay in contact with them in different ways depending on how far they are.

The only truly difficult ones are the ones in Australia...because even getting skype together is an with them.

The Duke of Cambridge has warned the clock is ticking towards a tipping point when our impact on the environment will be irreversible.

Speaking at the Tusk Conservation Awards at Banqueting House in London, William said “nature matters to us all” and we have an obligation to reduce the extent to which we “plunder” the planet’s resources.

He highlighted the recent Inter-Governmental Panel on Climate Change, warning that it was the “loudest warning bell yet” from the scientific community that we must act now.

The duke added: “The clock is ticking towards a tipping point when the impact of what we are doing will become dangerously irreversible.

“We have a responsibility and obligation to the next generation to drastically reduce the extent to which we plunder the world’s natural resources.”

Glad to see you here @AlaskanOilBaron, you were bloody fantastic on the last climate change-related thread I was on.

I'm so flattered. Thank you so much.

aphid that's not true. Plant based diet is a smaller contribution than a single transatlantic flight.

OP people do not have a problem with what you are saying. Their problem is with your attitude and the way you're saying it.

You can't go round anonymously telling people to cut out important parts of their life without knowing anyone's personal circumstances and expect everyone to agree with you and obey. Or be surprised when people get defensive.

Especially when there are most likely things that you could do in your own life to make your own carbon footprint smaller. That saying about removing the beam from your own eye first springs to mind.

Honestly, everyone should be giving up meat before flights. Eating significant less meat and dairy is the single biggest thing you can do to reduce your environmental impact - far more than taking fewer flights.

Very true! Although I expect a lot of the people scoffing at giving up (or severely cutting down on) flying will have the exact same attitude to giving up animal products...

M3lon

Again...what will you tell your grandkids?

What will I tell my grandkids?
Unless by some miracle I am able to have children not a fucking lot.

You see this piece of emotional blackmail has no effect on me.

But what will you tell your kids and grandkids when you refuse to attend their weddings.

How will you explain that your electric car is actually worse for the environment than a fossil fuel car? (what with the manufacturing issues and the batteries and the waste?)

the childish game is pretending that you won't do this things that you expect of others, when we all know that as soon as your circumstances change you will be going to their wedding, visiting them where ever they are in the world, paying for them to have their 'emergency phone' just in cased they aren't home from school on time.

So no kids, no pets. one car, don't fly, and reduce, reuse, recycle.

And you would like me to give up physically seeing my parents?

what a entitled person saint you are.

No, sorry. In fact I'll go further, I'm not willing to do anything other than recycle more and make mindful decisions or one use plastic and the like, make things last a bit longer etc. I'm already vegan so I'm in fuck You territory on that score already

To be honest I don't see anything dramatic happening in the uk in my or my children's lifetime circa 80 years. It is up to each individual my children included how they'd like to move forward children wise. Maybe when they are ready in 15 or 20 years we'll know more and they can make their choice according.

I'm certainly not going to stop enjoying my life because "experts" who are having a much better time of it and always will want me to "save the planet"

Yeah of course, DH and I are just going to cut contact with our families completely. 🤨

M3ion

“If you are driving alone in a vehicle that gets 40 mpg or less – somewhat close to Professor Sivak’s average car trip in the U.S. including commuting, shopping, etc. – flying may be more efficient,” Rutherford and Kwan note. “If you have one or more additional passengers, driving is typically more efficient unless you are in a large vehicle.” And if you are driving a hybrid with a bunch of passengers, they contend, you are “four to five times as efficient as a plane over a similar distance.” In that scenario, they say, you even beat taking a Greyhound."

Reminder - my car is fully electric - not hybrid

Driving is only more carbon efficient if your car is always full and your carpool (which the vast majority of people do not) and if you're traveling a short distance.

Over long distances, a plane beats a car for efficiency every time.

Air travel also only accounts for just over 2% of global CO2 emissions, although factoring in other gases brings it to between 2 and 5%.

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.dw.com/en/to-fly-or-not-to-fly-the-environmental-cost-of-air-travel/a-42090155

Giving up your car or not having another child will save way more in terms of greenhouse gases than giving up flights will.

So will you be giving up your cars, OP?

I'm not saying we don't need to make changes, but flights are actually quite a small drop in the ocean. And we can all make a much better impact by not having children or cars, so YABU to focus on flights.

You do what you think is best.

Leave others to make their own decisions.

Flying anywhere for anyone's wedding is never going to be a basic human need.

Oxygen, light, food, water and (possibly) shelter are basic human needs.

Eating pringles above the Atlantic while watching Mary Poppins Returns and fluffing your fascinator for a wedding just isn't a basic human need.

My grandmother is dying. She raised me - almost a second mother to me. She Hasn’t got long left to live - give or take a few months and when she does go - I will be flying to her to say my final goodbyes as she’s in a different continent. Is that ok with you @Walkingthere ?

OP is getting shite because she is obviously working on a third kid and telling people to stop flying.

I didn't see that. Yes, continuing to have children is about the worst choice you could make, environmentally. I always thought I wanted one child - I'm reconsidering that now, the more I read about the world we might live in (or not live in?) within my potential child's lifespan, or even my own. Horrifying.

YABU. I won't stop flying. I fly rarely. A return flight once a year or every two years. I don't drive. I use public transport. I rarely shop and never buy tat. One return flight a year so that I can see and appreciate the world is important to me. I bet my carbon footprint is lower than most Westerners'.

Do you all realise that people actually don't fly JUST for the family wedding when family lives abroad?
Everyone I know combines it with the annual visit. So if you normally fly in April and wedding is in August, you will fly in August. Not April and August.
I do like how everyone keeps quiet about the funeral tho😁 No argument there, ey?

I really wish we could neutralise the discussion of childbearing and accept that there's no way to recycle or hand-me-down or UK-holiday your way out of the epic decision to produce children, particularly beyond 2.