"Average wage £29,000"

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I've had an ad on my Facebook for one of those "your baby born on this day" type posters with today's stats, which includes the average wage of £29,000. I'm aware this is the average wage according to stats, but there were loads of comments saying that was wrong, "that's more like household" etc. AIBU to ask does £29k seems that unlikely to be average in your opinion? Do bigger salaries drag it up making it look unrealistic to most?

I think I have a circle that is quite diverse, I'm from NE but live in London and work in an affluent industry but my DP and I are friends with people on £10k a year and £150k.

I don't think these statistics are representative as it depends on education level, location, skill of job. Someone might start a job on £16k and in 10 years get to £25k - this would feel like excellent progression but in my industry a 21yr old starts on £25k and would expect to be on £80k in 10 years. It's pointless to compare.

@adaline Nah, the wages and the salaries in the UK are shit. People have been conditioned to justify and accept this level of poverty. Your own phrase, “Depends where you live and what your outgoings are, no?” shows that.

Well it's true, isn't it? I earn just over 18k for full-time work and I don't struggle in the slightest. DH earns slightly less than me. We have a house with a mortgage, pets, go on holidays each year and have a decent amount in savings too. We live five minutes from the beach and 25 minutes from the Lake District. I don't think that's poverty by any means.

About 10 years ago the average full-time individual wage was £26k, average household income £40k (medians both).

Inflation has been very low for a very long time now, plus, since the 2008 recession there's been a widespread tactic of freezing wages and cutting hours to keep more people employed but at lower income (hence the anomaly of relatively low unemployment despite a crash), so wages haven't crept up very much at all. Given that, a move from £26k to almost £29k in ten years (10% in a decade) seems possible but also seems to suggest that wage inflation has picked up pace recently.

Well the LEGAL MINIMUM for a full time worker doing 40h/week on minimum wage is £16,286 gross p.a.

So 29k as an 'average' is hardly surprising is it?

Another chiming in on the mean/median issue.

That right tail is in the picture is what skews the mean. As you can see, the median - where half of households (in this case) will fall lower sits to the left of the mean, i.e. the median is lower.

So, yes, bigger salaries for the few are what are dragging the mean up. Most people are earning less than the mean.

I think it depends on your age and the area you live. £29K to me as an average for all ages across the country seems very low, but I live in an expensive area in the south where I don't know many people who earn as low an income as that, and I am in my early 30's. I can see however, in an area of low employment rate and lower income work how it may seem high to some people.

It certainly isn't an average wage for us and certainly isn't if your on minimum wage.
Partner earned 16 grand lasy year and that was before tax. That's a full time job just above minimum wage..by pence.
I dont know where they get there figures but i dont know many people who are on more than 20grand.

I don't think these statistics are representative as it depends on education level, location, skill of job.

They show the average=median.This takes into account everything you have said above.

An awful lot of people posting here are clearly in unskilled work where they earn the minimum wage or a low wage.

Teachers are not highly paid yet starting salary is £23K ish and rises to high £30sk after 6 years without taking on extra levels of management.

People who come along here and claim the salaries in their areas are less, must surely be talking of admin/clerical level jobs, shop work, care workers, all the jobs that do not require higher education or any professional training.

Be realistic!

If you are aghast at the stats here, take a look at your own training and level of education.

I would say that was about right, I live in the East Midlands and most people I know earn between £20k and 40k in a mixture of jobs, my part time admin job works out at about £10.50 an hour and I am at the low end of salary where I work.

@supermommyof4

So what kind of full time job pays £16k?
Not one where the person has to have A levels, a degree or a masters degree I guess?

It does sound average when you consider that it includes workers in factories and supermarkets as well as professional occupations.

I'm in London and the average is much higher - I know PAs on 40-50k.

Thanks Capara I was looking for a graph with that on it... makes far more sense now!

Most jobs that require qualifications / higher education will pay way more than minimum wage. Nurse, physio, social worker, teacher, accountant, financial advisor, HR consultant, bus and train driver, draftsman. Just a tiny number of professions where in full time work you would earn more than £29k after a few years in the job. If you are unqualified and do a job that doesn't require qualifications then yes you'll earn less. Those people on here saying no one in their area earns as much as £29k are wrong. Yes professionals earn more in London, but outside of London they are still on a professional salary scale.

So what kind of full time job pays £16k? Lots of perfectly ordinary ones.

Average for where I live is £18K. So lots of part time and low waged workers in this city!

@

It certainly isn't an average wage for us and certainly isn't if your on minimum wage.
Partner earned 16 grand lasy year and that was before tax. That's a full time job just above minimum wage..by pence.
I dont know where they get there figures but i dont know many people who are on more than 20grand.

‘They’ get their figures from the government, research and scientific analysis. Your house isn’t the only one used for this. My DP earns £40k, it’s not the average either. Doesn’t make the statistics incorrect. Do you really not understand there’s a lot more people in the country than you and your partner and they all earn different amounts?

Sorry that’s to @supermommyof4

You would be surprised! I live in the South East, just outside the M25, so not a very cheap area to live in. I've seen jobs advertised in this area requiring a degree & specific experience offering £17-18k pa. Plenty of call centres & the like, which offer maybe £8.50 an hour if you're lucky, who prefer younger workers because the minimum wage is lower for them. Very little for anyone else who hasn't got recent experience in very specific areas

And having a degree doesn't mean you go into a "graduate" job, most seem to end up doing telesales etc as there isn't anything else - there are more graduates every year than there are "graduate" type jobs

I don't think these statistics are representative as it depends on education level, location, skill of job.

You don't think the statistics calculated by the Office of National Statistics for the whole country are representative... Of the country? Do you understand what statistics are?

That is the median for the country. Of course the median in Scunthorpe is going to be different from the median in Kensington, even for the same job. That doesn't make the figure for the whole country not representative of that country.

Of course bigger salaries drag it up (and lower, down) that's what an average is.

I'm in London and the average is much higher - I know PAs on 40-50k

But PAs are an anonmoly. Either the job requires more skills, qualifications or experience than the job title would suggest or the pay is disproportionately high for the qualifications and job requirements. Most 'office' type staff without a lawyer/accountant type qualification will be on about half that.

Teachers, nurses and other professions do not get anywhere near that after many years of experience.

So what kind of full time job pays £16k?

Loads of them - cleaner, shelf-stacker, sales assistant in a shop, care worker, waitress....

Retail, hospitality and tourism are all sectors that are notoriously low paid. Places like the Lake District, Devon/Cornwall, the Peak District and other big touristy areas survive because thousands of local people work for minimum wage to run the cafes, the shops, the kiosks, the ice-cream stands, the restaurants...

The discussion certainly highlights the value of thinking about geographical spread and transferability from one location to another, when choosing a career path. Long-established, chartered and/or unionised professions, especially those with national pay scales, are the way to go. There are teachers, nurses, surveyors, solicitors and doctors everywhere. You might not be friends with them but they do live and work in your area.

Very few people understand what statistics are, how to carry out an accurate statistical survey or the dangers of using a sample that is too small or unrepresentative.

If you asked on here what an average salary was, you'd think it was about £80-100k, because there are a disproportionately high number of high earners.

You could probably draw all sorts of conclusions about the incomes, habits, opinions etc that are in no way representative of the population at large due to the 'only on Mumsnet' effect.

I'm in Yorkshire. It's more than I earn. And I have been working since 2003.