DS's meltdowns - I'm at my wits end (posting for traffic)

[alltheteainchinajustisntenough]

Hi,

I'm here as I've got no idea where else to ask for help so I wondered if anyone had any advice on this. I've NC'd as, frankly, I'm really ashamed that I'm in this position and feel that this is happening because I've done something wrong along the way.

DS is 5 and in reception. A very lively, very happy, cheeky boy. Enormously loving, kind, adoring of his DS and of me and DH. Is very considerate, very sweet and tells us often he loves us etc.

Until the meltdowns happen......

I've just got no idea how to describe them other than absolute hell. It's like Bana turning into the Hulk. For the most part, these happen during specific 'times'; generally around tiredness, or heightened excitement, so it seems to be about regulating emotions - think school pickup (always in front of 100+ other parents so I feel like the worst parent in the world.....), when we're at home after school or at a party or a playdate etc.

This week, I've just had my fill of it. On Wednesday after school, I had to drag him through the playground kicking and screaming because we had to get to DDs swimming lesson so there was no time to play after school with his friends. This is the case every week so it was no surprise to him. It got to the point where all I could do was put him in the car, close the doors (we have an MPV style where the kids can stand up), and stand outside until he calmed down. In that time frame, he kicked the hell out of the car console (where the temp gauges are etc) to the extent it needs professional repairs (I cant strap him in as he can just undo the straps). All the time, DD and I are standing outside the car, both close to tears, just feeling like I want the world to swallow us all up.

Tonight, we were leaving school and he fell. He was a little upset so I got down, face to face (like all the help books tell you to do) and asked him if he was okay, and he punched me in the face.

When we got home, he was still 'in it' and started throwing drinks bottles and toys etc. at the wall, so I picked him up, carried him upstairs to his room away from his DS. I knelt down again, and explained I understood he was angry but this wasn't acceptable behaviour (trying very bloody hard to stick to the words EVERYTHING I read says I should say) and he says 'I'm going to punch you in your stupid face.' I said that was really unkind and really upsetting to hear, and so, of course, he kicked me in the stomach full pelt. I was genuinely winded and collapsed to the floor, and basically just burst into tears. He then just collapsed into tears screaming 'sorry Mummy, sorry, I'm so sorry' which just breaks my heart and threw himself on me in a hug and a cuddle and just sobbed for about ten minutes. Then he went and got a toy bear from his room he's had since a baby and gave it to me with a hug, and he's been clung to my side ever since.

But i'm just at my absolute wits end with all of this. These are just a couple of examples but this stuff pretty much happens every day. I have no idea how to manage it and I don't know how to cope anymore. I'm in floods of tears. I feel like every minute of my day is spent worrying about when the next explosion will be. Every party we go to (which in reception class seems to be at least twice a month) I'm terrified at what moment things will kick off. Just being at home and making dinner I'm petrified about what will happen between now and bed time.

We've tried everything going; timeouts, rewards charts, time-in, distraction etc...... I don't know what's left to do.....

My DH works away, so is only around at weekends, and these meltdowns are literally always directed at me. I've spoken to school who have said that although he can get quite visibly cross and frustrated, they've had no issues like this, and frankly, I'm too ashamed to discuss it with anyone I know IRL because I feel like such a failure.

I had PND after both births and I think I've just been getting it all wrong from the start. Despite the PND, I've always been really loving and cuddly with them both and DD doesn't react this way at all when she gets cross so I don't know what's driving it. I'm not a smacker, but when I get really frustrated I have yelled occasionally, but I try really hard not to, but I just don't know how to manage this kind of explosive behaviour, and the anger and aggression that comes with it.

I know every child has meltdowns, I do. But these just seem so much worse, and so frequent, compared to anything else I've seen or hear from other parents. I just don't know where to find advice or actually speak to someone who can give me some help to make a plan/strategy I can use consistently and make effective. I've read all the books under the sun, and I just can't seem to make a change. I'm just emotionally drained by it, as I suspect is he, and I just want to help him.

I'm also worrying that by not getting this under control I'm totally fucking up his emotions for later life by not helping him learn any self-control.....

Does anyone, have ANYTHING they could suggest? I've tried contacting a few local child behaviour therapists/psychologists and none have come back to me.

Sorry no advice but have to tried asking school or your HV for support? They should be able to point you in the right direction.

It was described to us as a stress bucket.
All day long, little things happen that fill the stress bucket up. Someone not sharing at school. Horrible lunch so he's disappointed and hungry. His favourite teacher is away.

By the end of the day his stress bucket is brimming, and then one more thing happens, and over it goes.

When you pick him up do a quick assessment of him. Have a sandwich or some grapes or a banana with you as a snack, and go into soothing mode BEFORE he falls apart. Maybe some time in front of a calming tv show. Half an hour of chilling out and the volcano may never explode.

Set expectations well ahead of time very clearly.. We are taking DD to swimming this afternoon and can't be late, and you can have a picnic tea in the car but we need to leave as soon as you come out.

He's only little and doesn't know how to process his feelings and frustrations yet so it all comes out as anger. He probably misses his Dad too..

My youngest is prone to challenging behaviour, so for me I try to avoid hunger, so snacks at the school gates and often fed before parties!

I always park as close to the school as possible and firmly hold him by the wrist or hand if agitated and let him know the plan of what is happening. I don't get down to his level, as you found out it left me vulnerable to a punch or a shove!

Sometimes a meltdown can't be avoided, in which case he is sent to his room or out in the back of car. I sit close by and completely ignore him , I don't engage there is no discussion or eye contact until he calms. Once the storm passes, I offer him a hug and talk briefly about what happened and how it made me feel and then reassure him that he is safe. He is much better as he has grown older and got more mature, but it's hard particularly when others are keen to judge x

My DD is only 2 so sorry if this is shit advice but incidents like today when he kicked you have you tried ignoring him till he's calmer? So when you took up to his room just saying something like "mummy isn't talking to you while you're so angry" and leaving him alone for 5 minutes. Like I say no direct experience but I can imagine when he's seen red he doesn't want to be reasoned with? Other than that, absolute consistency in his rewards/punishments and trying to warn him about stuff beforehand so like the swimming incident tell him in the morning before drop off that he can't play after school and why and then remind him again straight away at pick up?

You could also try the GP if you feel stuff really isn't improving or is getting worse.

Hope stuff improves for you, you sound like a good mum who is doing all the right stuff.

My DS was very similar, a young one (August baby) so whilst he is bright, struggled with the emotional aspect and has always been that bit younger than some of his peers. He is in year 1 now and improved so much. Not just in respect of school and school days but altogether.

I think it’s stress/anxiety that boils over once they are in a safer space (i.e with you). It’s really shit and much harder than toddler tantrums.

I admit to having my own meltdowns over it on several occasions.

I would go to the GP now. That sounds off the scale for a 5 year old. They can be like that sometimes but as a regular occurrence, no. It’s jot a judgement on your parenting. He sounds like he needs help beyond that of any ordinary parent. I would keep using the tactics you are but ask for a GP/HV referral.

Oh you poor thing. I don’t have any advice to offer but you sound like such a lovely mum! I hope you find a way through this difficult phase.

My advice would be always going towards something. So for getting to the car and swimming lesson, cold sweet drink, snack that takes time to eat (best is something like breadsticks and a dip, raisins in a small tube, because you have to slow down to eat it) and ascreen. Let him choose the snack or have it as a special surprise, so he WANTS to get to the car.

You've got to discuss this with the GP first and then get assessed by a professional with expertise in developmental and behavioral Peds. The behavior is causing him to be violent and injure you and can hurt his sister. Believe me I've been the target of my son in the past and he was later diagnosed with a mood disorder secondary to a stroke as a newborn. His entire routine must needs be investigated including his sleep and diet. Please don't feel judged by anyone else I hear you I've been there. A lot of people may judge you but until they've been in our shoes they have no idea what fresh hell you are in

I think Happygolucky's advice is excellent.

Pre-empt triggers when possible. If you don't know what the triggers are, I'd start keeping a log of what happens immediately before the meltdown happen. Hopefully you'll start to see some patterns.

When you start to see the signs the he is beginning to go, you probably only have a relatively short period of time to calm him down. Once he kicks off for real I wouldn't bother trying to reason with him. Biologically, he'll have lost his ability to think logically. He's flooded with adrenaline and in fight or flight mode. I would take him somewhere to calm down and if he didn't go willingly, I would pick him up and take him there. I would tell him he's cross (labelling feeling) and needs to calm down. I wouldn't try to engage in conversation and would sit quietly ignoring him. If he tries to kick you or hit you, i would leave the room and if nec

Posted too soon.

After he's calm I would talk to him about what happened. What made you so cross? And teach him ideas to calm himself down eg count to ten, breath deeply, think a happy thought. I would also teach him any skills he might be lacking. Eg, if he's cross because he wanted a biscuit and you refused because he was whing, I would show him how to ask in a "big boy voice" and do lots of practice.

DS of 5 was very similar, especially with the violent behaviour. I tried everything but I was sick of being hit and hurt. At 5 he's old enough to understand consequences. I went over with DS that hitting is wrong, everyone has a right not to be hit and there are laws in place to protect people from being hit. I explained if I hit him like he was hitting me then I would be in big trouble. I also explained that in 5 years he becomes an age where he is criminally responsible. I warned him that if he hit me again I would be taking him to the police station.

He hit me again, I drove him to the police station, I drove the car off without him strapped in, the shock of that made him sit down and put his seatbelt on immediately, and I pulled up outside the police station. He was extremely upset and rightly worried that now he was in big trouble. He promised not to hit me again. That was a few months ago now and he's not hit me, despite having meltdowns etc but not once has he gone to hit me since. I accept meltdowns and being grumpy etc but I will not put up with being hit.

Perhaps when your son is calm you really explain to him just how wrong hitting is, that he is also protected by those laws and no one should be hitting another person.
It's a horrible time though and I really feel for you.

Hugs that sounds so hard. I would see your GP. I noticed that DH works away that can’t be helping - is there any way this could change?

you are NOT a shit parent. you are a good parent doing your best. it happens more with you because you are his safe space. this is why you bursting into tears was such a shock for him. the PP who mentioned stress bucket had it exactly right, that is exactely what happens. you are not getting it all wrong and it will get better but in the meantime you are in hell (believe me i know) so go to GP and ask for referral to CAMHS. and ignore the judgy B's at the school gate who've never had to deal with it and dont have a clue.

It sounds like sensory overload. Ask your school's SENCO for advice.

Have you read " Mercury's child" saw it recommended on Mumsnet yesterday and ordered straight away through amazon. I think it's going to change our lives. The author has a website.
Agree, it sounds like yourself a lovely mummy and really feel for you. Funnily enough I was chatting to a lady in the playground earlier who is an educational psychologist and I mentioned my son ( age 8 and emotional/ behavioural difficulties) and one of the first questions she asked was "Did you have post natal depression"? I didn't so not sure of the significance but worth researching.
Good luck and be kind to yourself. I have learnt to care less about what others think

Oh and you sound like a great parent, doing everything you can and keeping him safe. There's lots of help and support out there once you get in touch with the relevant groups. Health visitor, gp and SENCO would be a good starting place.

We were in this situation with my eldest DT. Her meltdowns were extraordinary.

It’s NOT your parenting, you sound like you’re doing a great job.

It turns out my DD is intolerant of dairy. We removed that from her diet and she is a different child.

Will PM you.

I agree with a PP that identifying triggers helps. After school he's probably tired and hungry and over-stressed. Always take a snack and a drink. Have something to distract him (eg a book, a toy, a game). If parties are an issue then don't go. My DS always became anxious about parties even though he appeared outwardly excited.
Also look at his diet, there may be triggers there. Add a multi-vitamin if necessary.

My first thought would be to speak to school and the SENCO and your HV and / or GP. It sounds like he's having real issues with regulating behavior, and what you're seeing is a manifestation of that. What's his speech like?

My DS (nearly 4) went through similar for about 9 months - the tantrums were off the charts, lashing out all the time (only at me) screaming, kicking, bellowing and this was all done at home and when we were out.

Trigger points were transitions from / to places, new places, places we knew, if the routine changed ever so slightly etc and I was (still am to some extent) constantly on edge about when he'd erupt next and I'd often (still do sometimes) lock myself in the toilet crying. It became so limiting as we could literally only go to a handful of places and nowhere new, as otherwise he'd scream the place down

No amount of books, or ideas worked. Ime, the reasoning afterwards or explaining or cause and effect chats did no good and wouldn't stop it happening again. Reward charts didn't work (he had no interest and saw it as punishment) neither did bribery

I hate to be that person who suggests SN as a reason, but I wouldn't totally discount it, even if to check a box that its not that. Ds has been receiving speech and OT (we're not in the UK) services for the last year. His speech has always been inconsistent altho has got better. The inability to verbalize when he had less words or explain how he felt or what the feelings were have played a huge part in his outbursts and inability to regulate.

We had him assessed by a developmental pediatrician and found that when he got disregulated, it'd throw him off totally, and lead to huge meltdowns that were not comparable to what had actually happened and this would also trigger sensory overload. This is turn would ramp up anxiety which would then basically become a vicious circle.

He also has language processing / auditory processing issues which impact his speed and ability to understand what's going on, and is also massively fixed / rigid in his thinking (probably as its one of the ways he uses to help go through his day)

We've done a ton of work on speech, pragmatic speech skills, role playing turn taking / good / nice behavior etc and expectations with the therapists and at home. Key has been teaching him about feelings (angry, sad, happy etc) and how he can verbalize to us how he feels

We also use visual schedules / picture maps when he asks for them (usually when he's unsettled or its something new) the behavior therapist recommended benign ignorance when he kicked off (easier to do at home) which is basically ignoring the tantrums as they start - you have to catch it at the right moment tho as if its too late it ends up in a battle of wills

I will say its got easier in the last 3 months since we've ramped up the speech etc, altho its not perfect by a long shot

My son has displayed the exact same behaviour from being 3 and 4, the violence was punching kicking you named, he did and I treated him as if he was naughty but actually what it turn out to be his severe anxiety and he is finally at 9 being assessed for asd, but I felt by naming the emotions he's feeling and everything is structured to the letter, if it changes plenty of warnings and repeat warning so he is aware and can prepare himself, the after school affect was discribed to me like a bottle of fizzy pop, every little thing he didn't like or what he deem unfair at school was a shake of that bottle so then when I picked him up that bottle exploded and I got everything. As he got older the behaviour changed he'd go in flight mode and try and runaway from it all didn't matter that cars were coming up the road he'd run out, so now I have a snack with me every day and take my lead from him if I speak or if I just walk next to him, he then chose when he wants to talk and the melt downs are happening alot less and the violence happens maybe once or twice a year. It is so difficult and you do blame yourself all I can say is trust your instincts and don't be fob off.

We had this with DS, later dx with ASD. He could hold it together for most of the day but would lose it on sight of me in the playground. I could often see his face in the queue to leave looking like someone had just stamped on both his feet, I'd ask the teacher how he'd been - "oh he's been fine" So, because school said there was nothing wrong, I went on various parenting courses, I worked out he was worse on X day because it was ppa time and bad on Y day because it was PE. I'd rock up with all sorts of snacks, I'd get there an hour before school finished to get a parking space right outside, as soon as the bell went I'd get the other DC in the buggy and ready to leave. I rearranged after school activities to the beginning of the week. You have my every sympathy.

The ASD outreach support worker described it like having a bottle of fizzy pop. Everytime he was confused or upset or got told off or didn't understand something or wasn't included in playtime - it was another shake of the bottle. And at some point the lid would go and it would spray everywhere - or I'd undo the lid by my very presence at the end of the day representing a safe space.

Ive got a dc with autism and one supposedly nt (although frankly I have my doubts). The autism courses Ive been on stress conflict prevention rather than resolution. One of the things is a visual timetable with pictograms of whats happening and when, and a time timer (or a kitchen timer) for how much playtime is left. This has also helped our nt child.

Another thought: Is he getting enough sleep?

Ive heard the fizzy pop analogy before. Its a good one. The autism book i read said that throwing in a mentos is what happens when you give a command after a school day.

I would have an honest conversation with the school SENCO op, and see what they suggest. Go to your GP if the SENCO isn't helpful.