To be losing patience with estate agents

[GoBrookeYourself]

House was on the market with estate agent 1 for 5 months-Ish and then we moved to estate agents 2. Under the contract it states anyone introduced by estate agent 1 who buys our property ensures the fee goes to estate agent 1 if sold within 6 months of leaving. All well and good. Estate agent 2 has had our house on the market for 5 weeks-Ish and we accepted an offer late last week. Our viewings slowed substantially so very excited to have an offer as we have found the house we want to buy (which is selling through estate agent 1).

Now estate agent 2 contact us introducing who will be looking after the sale of the property. Estate agent 1 then contact DH to say it’s someone they’ve introduced and the fee is payable to them. DH asks them to sort it with EA2. EA1 then call me to tell me they have tried to contact EA2 and EA2 have said the buyers are different to the ones EA1 put on their list of people who viewed the house. EA1 are disagreeing and saying it’s the same people and we need to sort it out or we’ll have to pay 2 lots of fees(?)! I explain that we don’t get any information bar surnames about the people viewing the house so aren’t really in a position to say who the buyers are. EA1 ask me to call EA2 to tell them I want to pay EA1 the fee. I call EA2 to explain who says she’ll call EA1. I get an email which I see just after I’ve called EA2 from EA1, sent before I managed to call EA2, to say she’s contacted the buyer to tell them she’ll be dealing with the sale. EA2 then contact me to say they’ve contacted the seller too to say they’re dealing with it.

The whole thing is ridiculous and unprofessional- we’ve suggested splitting the fee which EA2 agreed to and EA1 refused to and we have received no fewer than 8 calls and 2 emails today arguing that the fee goes to them. Starting to get really annoyed by the situation and worried they’re going to scare the buyers off with their unprofessionalism.

Sorry for the long post, really needed a rant. Has anyone else been in this situation? Is there a chance we could get charged both lots of EA fees (which are exactly the same fee)?

Actionhasmagic that’s what I really don’t want to happen, partly out of principle (EA2 has told the buyer not to deal with EA1 so why the hell should we pay them a fee for trying to sabotage our sale) and partly because we’ve already accepted a lower offer on our house than we ideally wanted to and paying more for the other house than we ideally wanted to, so this will just be another kick in the teeth and the final straw for me. If it comes to that, I WILL pull out.

The Property Redress Scheme was set up by the Department for Local Communities & Government as a redress scheme for consumers engaged with sales and Lettings estate agents.
It's purpose is to arbitrate and rule on disputes independently of the agent.

I completely understand how frightened you are of losing the house you want to buy, but they are there to help. I've had dealings with various Countrywide franchises so am familiar with your experience.
EA1 may well end up trashing the whole thing anyway if they're not careful, or even out of spite.

Until more people avail themselves of the redress system or report to trading standards where mis-representation is the issue, estate agents like this will continue to put fees before client care and, you know, offering a valuable service, and will continue to bring down the reputation of the many decent ones that I know.

It wouldn't be fair to trouble your elderly sellers with this, so in my mind it's another reason to open a redress dispute.

They really are deplorable if they are willing to pull down the sale of an elderly couple who, in all likelihood, haven't done this in a very long time and are vulnerable. Their daughter may have spent a lot of money on her house in preparation for their arrival too.

I know you have a lot riding on this but so do your buyers and sellers. If you're well advanced the lawyers are probably going to charge full abortive costs, in other words you'll pay the same as if you did the deal, then there's the survey and search fees for you and your buyer. I reckon the whole thing will have cost everyone upwards of £5000 for nothing.

Thank you ohdeardaddyibrokeitagain, I’ve had a look at their website and will speak to them on Monday. I agree about not troubling our sellers with it, she has lost her husband and is wanting to move in with her daughter (we took a cake over as a thank you when she said she was happy to wait for us until our house had sold as she liked us which we really appreciated), and I don’t like the idea of her being stressed out by this. Obviously I could be wrong and she could be the most savvy person in the world when it comes to house buying/selling but I didn’t get that impression. She told us she’d raised her family in this house and wanted us to do the same.

Thank you for your help and who to speak to- I’ll definitely call them on Monday. Luckily (I think?), we’re not too far into the process and only had offers accepted for both buying and selling last week, so once these issues are resolved I hope the rest of it goes slowly. If it comes to us losing the house then I suppose whatever happens happens and we’ll move past it. If this does still go through, definitely not moving house EVER again!

Have a read of this:

www.tpos.co.uk/news-media-and-press-releases/case-studies/item/commission-fees-the-introduction-to-the-purchase

As has already been mentioned this situation is not completely unheard of. In a few rare instances fee disputes have gone to court.

It is my recollection that EA1 would need to have been successful in obtaining an offer from the buyer in order to have serious grounds for claiming a fee. Simply carrying out a viewing is not enough to be considered 'effective introduction.'

I'll see if I can find a recent case to link to.

(I own my own estate agency business and have come across this situation over the years)

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/lawreports/1935750/FOXTONS-LTD-v-BICKNELL-and-ANR.html

This is a fairly well known case (within the industry at least!!).

Basically saying there needs to be 'effective introduction' to the purchase, not just the property.

Mildura is correct.
Ea1 is not entitled to the fee.
A case recently set a precedent called ‘effective cause of sale’
It is no longer enough to just show a property. Ea1 did not do enough to cause the sale, they could have got an offer, or kept in touch with the buyer but they didn’t.

I would go back to ea1 and tell them that if the case went to court they would get nothing. They either accept a split or get nothing!

I wouldn’t worry about the house they are selling you, they want that to go through just as much as you.

Did EA2 have the property on at a lower amount? If they did apparently that makes it a new introduction. I think this has been tested in court but I'm not a lawyer. 😊

All the links have been really interesting. Yes, EA2 had the property on at £50 less than EA1 and then at the time of the sale the price had been reduced by another 5k.

The part about effective after viewing interaction is really interesting because as far as I know EA2 has constant interaction with the buyer after they viewed whereas EA1 tried to contact them, got feedback after the viewing then left it at that.

Our solicitor is a family friend and so (hopefully) will be able to give me some advice without charging, so I’m going to call both her and the estate agent on Monday. I’m hoping the buyer acceptable DH on LinkedIn too so we can ascertain some facts instead of it all being Chinese whispers and he said she said which is all we’ve had to go on at the moment.

I really appreciate everyone’s help, it’s sad that EAs think they can bully and intimidate and unless you know everything you just go along with what they say.

It is my recollection that EA1 would need to have been successful in obtaining an offer from the buyer in order to have serious grounds for claiming a fee. Simply carrying out a viewing is not enough to be considered 'effective introduction'

If so, that would make perfect sense - especially when, as in this case, they didn't even conduct the viewing or pursue the potential buyer for a response

It's starting to look a lot better isn't it, GoBrookeYourself? Call me mean, but in your position I'd frankly welcome anything which meant I could tell EA1 to go to hell

There's an interesting case here, where the Ombudsman decided against the EA in circumstances not unlike your own:

www.tpos.co.uk/news-media-and-press-releases/case-studies/item/commission-fees-the-introduction-to-the-purchase

Also this: uk.practicallaw.thomsonreuters.com/4-381-4357?transitionType=Default&contextData=(sc.Default)&firstPage=true&comp=pluk&bhcp=1

*@Puzzledandpissedoff *

Those are the exact 2 cases I posted links to about 5 posts above!!

Oh heck, sorry Mildura ... I really should have paid more attention

Ugh, yes, EAs are worms. But then a lot of buyers and sellers aren't much better. The lies people tell! Agree with pp that the 'other buyers' for your dream home may not exist. Buying and selling is so stressful. After my last go round, over a decade ago, I still feel like I can't face ever doing it again. Hang in there, OP. At least your seller sounds lovely.