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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be upset DH said no?

92 replies

ThinkingFeeling · 07/05/2019 18:56

After lots of tests and years and years trying to conceive we've been offered IVF via the NHS.

DH has very low sperm count, I have very damaged tubes and a low egg reserve. Bad quality too. Also suspected endometriosis.

DH has said he's a flat 'no' to IVF because our chances of success are so low (confirmed by specialist) and he doesn't want to go through an unnatural conception. His opinion.

That's it then. I'll never be a mum. Please, no miracle 'it happened as soon as I stopped stressing' stories...I can't take it.

AIBU to be upset he's just a flat out 'no'? Even though it's the sensible rational choice. I love him, I wouldn't want to leave him. We have an amazing marriage. I never thought we'd be infertile. Maybe I just have to come to terms with it.

OP posts:
MumUnderTheMoon · 07/05/2019 20:44

So he's a firm no for IVF and your a firm no for adoption. You just have to respect his decision as I'm sure you want him to respect yours. Is this a deal breaker for you? YANBU was o be upset but you have a dh that loves you and you love him and in spite of what's going on you seem very positive about him. Try and focus of your dh and being happy rather than a hypothetical life.

StCharlotte · 07/05/2019 20:46

We fell at the first hurdle (initial tests) in that DH confessed he couldn't deal with it if the problem was with him. I think he would have gone ahead if I'd been desperate but we decided to leave it to fate. It didn't happen but we'd prepared ourselves as well as we could for that likelihood and we're living a great life. Adoption was never a consideration for me which, ironically, DH wasn't against in principle.

But yes, this wasn't what I had in mind and DH would have been an amazing dad and the 14 children my siblings have between them sometimes make me feel sick with envy but mostly it's fine.

I think it's sad that your DH has let it get this far before backing out and I hope he at least acknowledges that.

iwantanewusername · 07/05/2019 20:48

ThinkingFeeling Flowers

It is so tough and you both have the right to say no...saying that if you can discuss it once you have had some time to think about it, maybe he will come around to it?

ExH and I went through ICSI twice (once on the NHS and one private). We also had low chances of success as he had low count, poor motility etc. We'd agreed we would do three rounds. The NHS round was not great, it should have been a sign when they needed him to give another sample :(

The second one failed miserably and was prolonged trauma for me - firstly I kind of came out of the sedation whilst they were still getting eggs...then we had to wait for a whole week (getting updates every other day) to find out we had nothing, no embryos and that was the end of the line.

I was devastated that it was done, that we were at the end of the line. I think he was too (he never really spoke about the IVF). I think for him, he felt like a failure and couldn't cope with that - regardless of what I said to reassure him otherwise.

Even though they both failed, I am glad that we did both rounds, I would have always wondered what if, if we hadn't.

Donor sperm would have been our only option and we were told this after our first round failed. I didn't want to use donor sperm, for many reasons. In the end it became a moot point tbh as we split up (FAOD not because of the infertility).

I know what you mean about not knowing who you are or supposed to be, I'm trying to figure that out now...

Mammajay · 07/05/2019 20:49

Ask him to compromise. One try and you promise to leave it if that does not work?

ThinkingFeeling · 07/05/2019 20:55

Thanks so much to the posters who understand it's not black/white, it's much appreciated to not feel so alone. And thank you to those sharing their experiences - good and less good, infertility is such a tough journey.

OP posts:
pickme · 07/05/2019 21:04

ICSI I have no idea why this has not been suggested to you, my twins where due to this treatment.
But also on another note I could only get one treatment on the NHS when we were trying and I found the money for 3 we paid for. Consultant said 1 try was always an experiment to how you react to the treatment, but second was normally a better chance. As we went into treatment 2 the day of implantation I said never again and I meant it. I had time to reflect on actually we do have a good life, we are surrounded by people who we can be part of their lives and we are "joiners" I realised we could easily fill our lives in the community, I often think of ever decreasing circles 🤣 we would have been Penny and Martin! But we where happy without children and I realised we could be happy continuing without them.

We had twins they both have autism, ADHD, Anxiety, PDA and SPD and hyper mobility and 1 had rhinitis. And the other depression and Tourette's and I wouldn't have it any other way and the fact we where always joiners means we have joined deferent groups to those we thought we would but it is fulfilling.

Basically we all have paths doesn't matter which is chosen just so long as you make the most of the journey xx

Good luck

Planetian · 07/05/2019 21:06

If he knows how much this means to you I think he’s being horribly selfish. It’s you who will have to go through most of the procedures. Hopefully it’s just a knee jerk reaction to the disappointment and he’ll calm down and change his mind.

Personally I would be very angry with him and if he continued to refuse I wouldn’t be able to get past it. I know that sounds harsh and unreasonable, but having a baby is such a huge deal and if it’s something you desperately want then living with the knowledge that you didn’t even get to try would be excruciating. YANBU to be upset OP, I would be devestated Flowers

User11011 · 07/05/2019 21:11

Did want to read and run.
I'm so sorry you and your dh are going through this. You both sound lovely and are both right.
I feel like you will find peace whatever happens next and it is still very fresh news. Give yourselves both time.

PaperHead · 07/05/2019 21:20

Much sympathy, OP. This is very hard. My very best wishes for whatever the future holds.

Ellisandra · 07/05/2019 21:25

I hope he just needs time to adjust.
I would find it really hard to forgive his unwillingness, personally.

Much as I respect objectively his right to an opinion, I would find it hard to accept his opinion was more important to him than you wanting a child (given he does actually want one too).

It isn’t easy, I’ve done it.

But there is no cost argument here, so set that aside.

In terms of the ACTUAL process, he has to wank, ONCE. (I’m assuming you’d have mentioned if he needed surgical removal). So fuck all really - the hard work is on you.

Low chance? Still a chance and see above - free, no hard work for him.

Cost to him emotionally supporting you? I think he should. Not like you’ve done 7 rounds already and the stress has all but ended your marriage.

Cost to him emotionally of it not working? Yep, that one’s valid. There comes a point where you have to draw a line. But for me, that’s not before you start. Fair enough if he said “I don’t want to do it more than x times”. But once?

Finally - and maybe this is his biggest issue - unnatural. Well frankly I’d say the desire to have a child trumps that, and he should suck it up. He’ll do plenty of “not natural” things in his life, I’m sure. Ever had a girlfriend on the pill so he didn’t have to bother about condoms?!!!

Objectively, outside my marriage I might feel everyone has their right to an opinion on “natural”. But if it stopped me doing the hard work of free IVF... it would be really hard for me to ever forgive that.

So I hope he needs some (short) time.
If not, keep with the counselling, because you may find that you do become angry with him.

Good luck xxx

NCwhatevs · 07/05/2019 22:13

OP I’m so sorry to hear about your backstory. That sounds awfully unfair!

I can relate to your distress with DH not agreeing. At first my DH was very against IVF. He has low count/motility challenges and felt deeply guilty I think. He also felt it was ‘unnatural’ and felt he wanted it to be God’s will for our children to be born to us, as we are religious.

He agreed to go along to a seminar at the clinic we were referred to and once he had time to wrap his head around it, he got onboard. The way the Dr leading it explained the process was useful for my DH to see it was still God’s will as it’s not a 1+1=2 guarantee. That was useful for him and he then (happily) changed his mind and we went ahead with it. ICSI in the end. It was worth it and he’s now very grateful.

Do you think your DH would consider becoming more educated about how it actually happens, perhaps that would help?

Hoping the best for you. Flowers

Lizzie48 · 07/05/2019 22:34

I really feel for you, OP. I’m similarly infertile, though in my case we only discovered this after our only NHS cycle when I was found to have empty follicles and no eggs. I was told after that that even with IVF, the chances of ending up with a healthy baby was less than 5%.

My DH had no problems, so there were suggestions that donated eggs might work, my DSis actually offered. It was the kindest offer ever but it was the right decision to say no, and she was actually relieved in the end, as she hadn’t previously realised that it would involve her going through IVF herself.

Egg donation wasn’t for me, so people suggesting it weren’t helping.

Adoption was right for us, but I had to get to that point myself. My DM kept pushing it, which I resented. She presented it as a simple option, she would say, ‘You will have a child, because if you don’t conceive, you’ll adopt.’

That’s not how it works, Social Services have the final say on whether you’re approved to adopt.

Now we have 2 adopted DDs of 10 and 7 who are birth sisters. We love them to bits now, but we had to come to that point ourselves.

We don’t need to be told the options we have. As my DH used to say, we know that adoption is available so we don’t need to be told about it.

It’s such a hard thing you’re going through, OP, and your DH too. The important thing is to keep talking. My DH found it hard to share his feelings and it made me think he didn’t really care when nothing could have been further from the truth. Flowers

Lizzie48 · 07/05/2019 22:53

I also would like to add, a traumatic history doesn’t bar you from being approved to adopt. I have PTSD as a result of childhood SA, as does my DSis. We’ve both adopted (she has birth DC too). Okay, the memories were repressed for years and so it didn’t come up during the adoption assessment.

But it’s now in the open because my mental health was affected due to the memories resurfacing and there’s been no suggestion that we shouldn’t have been approved to adopt.

My DSis and DBIL were approved to adopt after the memories resurfaced and there was a police investigation taking place.

So it really isn’t a bar to being approved. What they will want to know is whether you’ve done what you can to deal with the trauma you’ve been through, for example gone through therapy.

It’s absolutely fine if you don’t want to adopt; it really isn’t for everyone. But don’t let it be because you think they won’t accept you because of the trauma you went through.

LondonJax · 08/05/2019 08:42

We had ICSI twice because of unexplained infertility on my part and sperm motility issues for DH (some of his sperm swam straight, the other's thought they were on Brands Hatch and went in circles!)

We discussed IVF and adoption. We looked into adoption, really looked into it. Chatted to parents we knew had adopted. It was on the radar. But we, one evening, chatted again about IVF - it had been niggling both of us. We decided we'd give it a go. If it worked, problem solved. If it didn't then we'd decide the next route (pursue the idea of adoption...maybe. Decide to remain as we were...maybe) but we realised we had to give it a shot just to get rid of the 'what ifs'.

We never saw it as unnatural - it was just another part of the ovulation chart, positions, creams, natural remedies etc that we'd been trying over the years.

We are both pleasers, we like to make each other happy. So, to save that silly conversation of 'well, if you think one session, that's fine', 'no you'd like three, I can go with that it's fine' we wrote down a number on separate pieces of paper (how daft is that)! The number of times we were both willing to try IVF. We both wrote down 2. We knew, for our sanity, that we needed to stop at 2 tries. No matter what. I worked with a woman whose sister was on her fifth attempt. For us we just knew we had to give it two shots then walk away and decide our path.

First time round I produced no eggs at all. As someone said above, round one can often be the indicator round - how IVF works for the individual. We thought, when we had our debrief meeting that we were going to be told to think about egg donation. Another big decision to make. But our consultant said she would change the regime. She'd had her twins by IVF so she understood what we were going through. We got three precious eggs from that final round - that was it - just three. Most women get into double figures. All three fertilised. All three were implanted. One took - he's now 12 years old.

Someone on here said all your DH has to do is have a wank, which is true. But that's a difficult thing for a man to be honest. It's a bit different doing that for pleasure but I know (because he told me much later) that DH felt enormous pressure to 'perform' on both occasions. You're literally in a room with a stack of porno magazines and a cup. You press the buzzer when you've done your bit. It's exactly like 'Maybe Baby' with Hugh Laurie. It's clinical and he already knew he wasn't 'performing' properly because he had sperm that were swimming in circles as well as in a straight line! He knew that, if he didn't produce the sperm that day, that hour whilst my eggs were at their peak and we were in the clinic, everything was finished. That's enormous pressure. He said it felt awful because he knew I'd been taking drugs, injecting, testing, internal examinations and he didn't want me to go through that all for nothing just because he found the situation intimidating - which then becomes even more intimidating!

So yes, I carried the drugs regime, the tests, the discomfort but don't underestimate the pressure for the would be dad. If he gets it wrong that's the end of the dream before it even starts. Saying he just has to wank is belittling that role - it's the start of the process and if it doesn't happen, nothing happens. And you can't say 'never mind love, it happens, we'll try again a bit later' like you can in your bedroom under the covers. It's finished, that cycle has gone. The end. That can be a real issue for some men and it could be what is also bothering your DH.

I don't know where we would have gone if the second IVF had failed. I do know we were not prepared to put ourselves through it for a third time. We'd discussed that.

I suppose I've got nothing to offer other than to give you an insight into why some men baulk at the whole IVF thing. It can become the over-riding thing for them (and for the woman) and that can close their minds to the possibility of using the method. The fear of failing. I didn't, personally, have that fear. If I didn't produce eggs it wasn't down to me - it was the drug regime in my mind. But still the pressure was intense. But DH felt he would have no-one to blame but himself if he didn't produce that little cup of liquid. So goodness knows what that felt like for him.

Good luck. I hope you both manage to come to something that will work for the two of you. It's a tough position to be in and my heart goes out to you both.

wineandroses1 · 08/05/2019 08:53

Why won’t your DH give this one go? It’s free! And there’s nothing unnatural about a child born through IVF/ICSI. The chances may be slim but at the very least you would know you’d tried everything you could. It will be much harder to come to terms with not taking this last chance. I’m not sure I’d be able to get past that, I think I’d feel a deep sadness that he wasn’t prepared to walk that last mile with me Sad.

We conceived our daughter through icsi, and I asked DH this morning how hard it was for him . He said it was a journey that we went on together and whilst he found it hard his concern was mostly for me as I was taking the drugs and having the procedures, he was on the sidelines, watching, hoping, supporting.

I really hope your DH takes this last chance that’s been offered. Then at least you’ll not be left wondering what if....

MaybeDoctor · 08/05/2019 09:04

I think the other big question is age. I went into a deep hole mentally when I had the birthday that was my personal ‘cut off’ point. Before that point (after our unsuccessful IUI) it was easy for both of us to drift along thinking ‘Well, it might still happen naturally’ but he might come up against feelings of regret if you get to a point where you are out of time.

Namestheyareachangin · 08/05/2019 10:00

I think this may not be the right forum for you OP; people tend to come here with a problem to solve, which is why people will be batting 'have you tried...', 'would you consider...' at you with the best intentions.

But reading between the lines of what you've said, you don't actually contest your husband's decision (even though you would have preferred he'd made a different one) nor does it come as a surprise (as it's been fully thrashed out in counselling), you still love him and would if push comes to shove (as it has) prioritise your real life with him over a very conditional potential future where you leave him and either do IVF alone or meet someone else and try to have a child with them.

So what you've come here for (if I'm reading you right) is to grieve the loss of the hope you had for a child. Of course YANBU and I'm so sorry Flowers. The loving way you talk about your DH, even when at odds over this most fundamental of issues, makes me think you are right and you would have been lovely parents. I think there are other boards that would give you more gentle support through this and would encourage you to consider asking MNHQ to move the thread to one of them... sending a virtual hug across the ether x

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