Advice for DD - AIBU to get involved

[medusa83]

My DD will be 13 soon. She wants to go for a meal with her friendship group.

Last year she made friends with a lovely group, however they fell out.

She is now "friends" with another group, however I'm not sure that they like her. Apparently there is a group chat which they don't want to add her to. She has specifically asked but been told that some don't want to add her. Another friend had a party and only invited people on this group chat.

Invites have only ever gone one way. She has never been invited to anything that this group do. Not that I am aware that they do much together anyway.

WWYD? She seems unaware that this group might not actually like her. I feel really sorry for her. I really struggled socially in secondary school and felt self-conscious and awful all the time...so perhaps my advice would be rubbish. She is a little bit on the spectrum FYI.

Just looking for constructive advice please.

Who is organising the meal would it be your dd? Does she hang out with anyone from the old friendship group ?

She has asked them and some can come. I'll be formalising invites tomorrow with an invite sent out to parents. She mentions her old friendship group in anecdotes about lessons but nothing aside from that.

‘A little bit on the spectrum’ ?

As in a little bit oblivious to social niceties. Super enthusiastic and focused on facts. I've worked with children on the spectrum for 15 years and can see traits in her at times. My Dad was the same. Ditto my brother. Possibly me too.

My daughter is more than a little bit on the spectrum, fully diagnosed and I’ve never felt the need to be involved in her plans.

It is hard, she has spent times being isolated, spending time alone and being fully included, she does much better 1:1 than in groups.

I think you need to take a step back tbh.

Does she have any friends outside this group she can invite? From clubs or anything other than school? It sounds as though you’re worried they won’t come and at least she’s have something to salvage if you’re right.

It might be fine though, if some have said they can come. Maybe some like her and others don’t and that group will shift over time.

As in a little bit oblivious to social niceties. Super enthusiastic and focused on facts. I've worked with children on the spectrum for 15 years and can see traits in her at times. My Dad was the same. Ditto my brother. Possibly me too.

She isn’t a little bit on the spectrum because you decide.

“I'll be formalising invites tomorrow with an invite sent out to parents”
Not sure this is something you do when they are 13?

I think I would be having a frank chat with your DD about how friends treat each other and excluding is not something you do to friends. Sorry she is going through this, it’s a tough age.

Thank you Cheeky. I think that is good advice. I was going to, and have generally left her to arrange her own affairs, but wanted to see if other parents might take a different tack. I think she might benefit from some relationships advice, although probably not from me!

My son had a very similar situation. It started off leaving him out, but escalated into name calling and nasty bullying by a couple. He insisted they were his friends but was always upset. I think he just wanted have a friendship group. In the end he realised he was better without them and joined a new group.

I think at this age they have to figure it out for themselves. Obviously if there is bullying then that needs to be reported to the school however. Your dd may just want to be in this friendship group because she doesn’t want to be alone. But you can’t force her to find new friends, she needs to figure it out herself. As for the meal, the ones who have said they can come may be genuine friends who aren’t (for whatever reason) willing to stand up for your dd. Encourage friendships that appear genuine, discourage the others and keep an eye on it would be my advice.

English- no, you are right- I meant it as an indication for her traits rather than a formal diagnosis- to give an insight into what I think her difficulties are. Her school have also agreed that these are the issues.

I would recommend this book, it's not just about bullying but also practical advice about kids friendships.

E.g. helping them recognise if their "friends" are constantly making them feel bad (not what friends do)

www.easons.com/bully-proof-kids-stella-omalley-9780717175420

Thank you for the book recommendation. I bought "the teen girl's survival guide" for her, which I think covers similar stuff, however I'll buy your book to see what they say.

Where is the meal happening Nando’s type place? Because formal invites suggest somewhere a lot fancier

Please don’t but kids books for this sort of thing. My parents brought me a couple and it didn’t work. Adults writing for teens about teens always misses the mark imo

Thank you to everyone who has offered advice.

Oh just a nandos type place- was going to send a formal email invite as some parents have requested it (they don't like arrangements between kids- would like adult input)

Ahh ok yy to keeping parents to in the loop

@still18atheart don't write off all books because a couple missed the mark for you

That book I recommended is written for parents, not teens.

No problem, DD is now 15 and much more open with me I think it’s because I let her make her own decisions even the really bad ones, she is much happier now.

I’m still a nervous wreck though!

"I think at this age they have to figure it out for themselves."

I do agree with this generally. However, I think there is a subset of dc (and adults) who are not very good at reading signals, and they are quite vulnerable to being treated unkindly. Many of us have the spidey sense that tells us to keep away from certain people when we sense they are not full of goodwill towards us! If a dc can't read that signal that is a problem for them, and in those cases I think it is useful to help dc to realise how to tell who is being a good friend and who is not - and what to do in the latter case!

So, to the specific problem - I do think birthday outings can cause a huge amount of stress. In some circles there is an expectation these days that you must do something for every teen birthday, and frankly I think life was simpler when there wasn't! Constructive advice: op, can you line up some people who will definitely be there - any cousins roughly her age, family friends etc - so that there will definitely be some attendees? Also, keep the arrangements incredibly simple and make it somewhere easy for the invitees to get to, to maximise the likely 'turn up' rate!

@englishdictionary your comments are unnecessary. It takes some of us years to get a diagnosis because of underfunding and, particularly with girls, they don't always neatly fit the diagnostic boxes. In general terms I think we all understood what she meant and it isn't for you to opine about what stage in the diagnostic process the OP is with her daughter. She has asked for constructive help - either give it, or don't comment.

OP, you are in a difficult spot. Am I right in thinking that you feel you have more insight into your daughter's social set up than she does; you don't want to interfere, but you can see it rapidly reaching a cliff edge and you don't want her birthday to accelerate that and be the occasion on which there is upsetting fallout?

Sadly, there isn't an easy answer. You say invites have only ever gone one way. If they have accepted invitations before, there is something to be said for inviting them, hoping they come and make her feel suitably special on the day, then dealing with the larger issues afterwards.

It does sound like your daughter needs to learn some of the social cues that others pick up via osmosis. School may be able to help with that. If you haven't already, it would help if you have already seen a GP about getting a formal diagnosis, as there are lots of children receiving support who are still in the system awaiting diagnosis.

That is a very incisive summary of the dilemma Genevieva! It is really difficult for a dparent who thinks certain dc are not good for their dc (in the sense of not being good friends to them), but the dc herself trustingly clings on.

The good thing is that there are certain 'clues' you can explain to dc who don't have the instinctive sense - although it's also tricky, because as parents we are quite out of touch with current norms, so may ourselves misread signals. However refusing to let someone join a groupchat certainly means that some at least of these dcs are not good friends to this dd. How to explain that kindly to the dd, without damaging her self confidence, is really difficult though.

hmm 🤔 tough one. TBH I would make her aware that if people don’t like her than that is their loss. Maybe don’t get specific in how this group feels about her just more of a general conversation. I don’t think you should veto this idea just maybe keep an open dialogue and make sure to tell her it is always a good idea to have multiple sets of friends. Having said that it may be that there is something very private on this group chat that they don’t know that your dd will keep private.

your comments are unnecessary.

Sorry but why?

I was asking because its relevant. I was going to offer some suggestions based on the DD being autistic. I don't think it's wrong to want to clarify that information. Lots of people on here say similar, in fact everyone and their auntie is 'on the spectrum' on Mumsnet and as the parent of 2 autistic DC it does piss me off when it's flippantly thrown about.

I haven't made any rude, nasty or what I consider to be unnecessary. The only reason i didn't go on to respond was that I had to go offline and am just 5 mins back.

You don't need to tell me about girls and autism. I am fully aware of how tricky things are when it comes to diagnosis.