to think that Dd2 has no intention of getting a job ?

[TheOriginalNutty]

Posting here more for traffic tbh as I am pretty sure I'm not being unreasonable.
Will try to be brief but also don't want to drip feed and I can talk for England so, here goes...

Dd2 is 19. She has had mental health problems since she was 13 and has had extensive therapy for this, including 12 months of weekly DBT where I also attended the parents group to support the process.
She's been off and on medication. She used to self harm until about 3 years ago, and I am very very proud of her for managing to stop.

Currently she is on medication and sees a psychiatrist about every 3 months. I'd say compared to years ago, she is quite stable, but only if things are going her way.

When she first got ill, I was working part time and ended up having to give up my job as she couldn't be left alone at all, and was not always in school. This continued for around 2 and a half years and then after a huge row she decided to go and live with her dad. I supported this choice because to be quite honest, I needed the break and her behavior was have a negative impact on Ds.
After 18mths she returned to live with me. All of this coming and going resulted in lots of juggling rooms etc as I also have Dd1, and at one point I did sleep downstairs for 6 months so that they all had their own rooms.

Throughout all of this Dd2 was at school and then college, although her attendance wasn't great, due to illness. Then she met her boyfriend and ended up moving in with him at his parents house. I made it clear at this point that if she was to come home to live again, she'd be welcome but she would be the one sleeping downstairs.

So, fast forward 8 months and her boyfriend and his parents have a big falling out and they ask if they can stay here. I said yes, but they'd have to sleep in the dining room (open plan, no privacy etc) and this is what they did. I also said they both needed to get job. (the boyfriend had been working but had been laid off, and Dd has never had a job).
Dd's boyfriend managed to get a full time job quite quickly and Dd had a couple of interviews but nothing more. Chats with her were had, which always get heated, and promises were made, but still no job.
Then her bf decides to move back to his parents because he also has mental health problems and they felt they could help him more if he were there. This time though, dd was not welcome to join him (totally fair enough) except for weekends UNLESS she was working.

At first this created a frantic attempt at job hunting as she was miserable not being with him 24/7, but it soon calmed down and now she is back to applying for the odd job here and there. She claims universal credit, but has now been given a sick note to hand it for her mental health issues.

I often send her links to jobs, training schemes etc but half of the time she doesn't even look at them.
I know getting a job is going to be hard for her as she has low self esteem and low confidence but I feel she is just not trying. I worry about saying too much though because yes she does have mental health problems, but I really believe that being in work could help her with this and tbh not to mention it would mean she could chip in to the household, as I am a single parent and no longer get anything for her.

Dd1 btw also has mental health problems but does still work very part time, goes to college and is starting Uni in September.

I know I need to say something more to dd2 but how to do it without it causing the mother of all rows is just escaping me.

Not sure how you speak to her without a row, but it seems possible that even if she woke up tomorrow cured of all her MH worries, she is used to being mollycoddled and having a lot of allowances made for her. I'm not judging you on that by the way! I can't imagine how hard it has been, but if she'd been a totally textbook teen you prob would have strongly encouraged Saturday jobs/ more grown up behaviour and taking of responsibilities etc. I suppose telling her it's time to grow up will cause a row but is likely needed. Can you compromise on her getting a very part time job and building up the hours?

Oh I totally agree that I mollycoddled her when she first got ill. I was scared to death of upsetting her, and her cutting herself or taking an overdose, both of which she did many times anyway.

I am harder on her now than I was then and generally I don't stand for any shit from her, but it's just this sticking point. I am more than happy for her to start off very part time and build it up.
She even had the NHS offer her some work experience to build up her confidence with a view to her then doing an apprenticeship. She didn't follow it up.

Should also add that living with her dad is no longer an option, as he buggered off to another country.

I feel for you. Have you asked what job she'd like? Even if she did unpaid work experience in her chosen sector it'd pose be a way into a job? And it plants the seed

As the GP has given her a sick note do they feel she is not fit for work?

She should be able to get a referral to a specialist employment advisor via the psychiatrist. If she has EUPD or similar she's going to need more support than the Jobcentre (or you) can give her.

Tbh Baggypants, i think she just asked the GP for a note and he agreed. Don't think he really delved into it.
Wish I'd known about the specialist employment advisor as she saw her psych the other day, but wont see him until August now.

Nauseous - We have had countless discussions about it. She changes her mind from week to week. We've had Admin, Tattooist, Paramedic, Mental Health worker and pretty much most other job roles.

I do agree Mirrivan it is hard for them but I feel that her not ever having had a job is just going to make things worse not better.

I have suggested voluntary work but she turned her nose up

Is she making any financial contribution to the household or doing any chores?

If not, then you need to be taking some of her UC on principle. Maybe 3/4 and she has some jobs in the house or 1/2 plus household chores if she does some volunteering.
I'm not suggesting taking it all, although you could say that if she was just a lazy teen without health issues it would be all of it plus chores if she didn't volunteer or 3/4 plus chores if she did.

She's an adult now and needs to be helped to take on some responsibilities. You need a way for her to realise that, even with MH issues, you can't possibly mollycoddle her like a child forever.

The history sounds a bit like DD's, but she has always worked; paper round, then weekend working while at school. She did have a couple of weeks where she'd left school as she couldn't continue, had left her weekend job as they'd treated her unfairly.

After that She just walked into an agency and decided to do whatever as she needed the money and now she's got a great 'proper' job that she's been doing for 1 1/2 years, all the while suffering greatly mentally. She and I strongly believe that having a job has helped her to keep herself together. Tbf her present job has been very supportive.

I'm impressed at the support that your DD has been offered. Was it all when she was under 18? We've found that as soon as DD reached 18, she was sort of left to fend for herself. It took about 18 months for her to get a psychiatrist appointment and that seems to only have happened so quickly because she had our support and made a huge fuss!

In conclusion I agree that your DD should get a job. Imo it would really help her.

If she's had DBT then they think she has BPD, don't they? The threshold for getting DBT is pretty high and BPD is pretty serious. Having said that she does need to work as it will be good for her - but it might be best for her MH if she starts low key and part time and then works her way up. She needs a mix of support and tough love.

MumW -She has given me money when I have asked but we do need to set up a proper arrangement yes, and it needs to be more than she has previously given me.
She doesn't do any chores, or infact anything unless I ask her and then it generally causes a row. She can sit all day doing nothing.

Judgejudy - It really does sound like your daughters mental health has benefited from working. I think dd would be the same if she'd only do it.
Dd was referred to CAMHS at 13 and saw several health professionals, and had DBT and CBT. She was discharged at some point, around 17 i think, as that is what she wanted, but about 6 months later her gp referred her back. In our area CAMHS is now Forward Thinking and is for patients up to age 25.
It is odd how it varies though. Dd2 had a lot of input from CAMHS but whenever we were in crisis there was nothing. Dd1 who is 21, had a sudden mental health crisis just before Christmas and had fantastic treatment in a&e and from the crisis services, with 2 months of home treatment, but then when it came to the treatment continuing in Forward Thinking, it all fell apart.

Sorry, Pointythings, I should have said that yes she does have a diagnosis of BPD.

I have no problem at all with her starting off working just a few hours a week and building it up, or even doing voluntary work. I just can't seem to get her to start.
I try very hard to be supportive with her, and remember all that I was taught from the DBT training, and I make sure i'm validating of her feelings and her condition, but I have to be honest and say that sometimes I feel she uses it as an excuse.

Mind offer employment support.

She could also look at the princes trust as they offer confidence building etc. I think they have some free online courses as well, as do www.futurelearn.com/courses and www.open.edu/openlearn/free-courses/full-catalogue, some o which relate to getting a job. The longer she leaves taking steps towards independence the harder it will be.

And yes, she needs to be paying her way.

Thank you Wrongkindofface, I'll take a look.

I just asked her if she'd looked at the link for a job that i'd sent her on FB earlier, and it turned into a row.

How does your daughter feel about animals? I ask because I suffer from depression and anxiety, but found work as a dog groomer, which helped massively. See if she can find something in animal care, as it creates responsibility, but also is very therapeutic. Hope you get this resolved soon, and that she feels well enough to lead a more normal life. Mental health problems are awful, especially at such a young age.

Sooner or later the DWP will be sending her an appointment for a work capability assessment. If she's deemed fit for work she'll have no choice in the matter.

In the meantime she's seemingly provoking rows in order to get what she wants. I don't think your expectations seem at all unreasonable.

Iratepanda - She loves animals and I have told her about jobs and training as a groomer, and also a job in a dogs home, but she didn't apply.

The whole thing is awful and very draining tbh. I also have depression, so I do know a bit about how she feels, and I absolutely hate that she is affected by this, and would do anything to change it, but ultimately I feel she needs to help herself too for anything to change.

Ilovesooty - Yeh I have told her this, but she doesn't seem concerned.

When I tried to speak to her just, she said I only ever speak to her if it's about a job. That couldn't be further from the truth tbh. I always try and talk to her, but it's like getting blood out of a stone.

At around your daughter's age I was in a similar place mentally and really struggling with the transition to adulthood. I had a diagnosis of BPD at that age which has since been rescinded. What I actually am is autistic. It took me nearly twenty years to figure that out. And yes I am very high functioning and yes I have two degrees, a husband, a house, two kids etc but since that diagnosis everything from my past makes sense.

You may not need to wait for her psychiatrist to refer her to a specialist employment advisor, it varies depending on where you live. The job centre may be able to refer her or in some areas she can self refer. Parents often accompany clients on initial interviews. These organisations can arrange work trials and negotiate extra support in the workplace among other things. Try your local council as they often co-ordinate and fund them.

One thing to consider, your daughter is still quite young and given the mental health issues she has suffered since she was 13, she may be a little immature for the world of work. My son was much the same but suddenly at 22 he announced that he was going to Australia for a year, he had saved up the fare from his benefit and would get a job when he got there. I think it was a hard year for him, he had to work to support himself and it wasn't easy. But in the six months he has been home he has seemed really well and has worked full time. it was worrying and frustrating having him seemingly happy to live on benefit, but I'm glad we kept quiet and gave him the space to come through it.

Jamoncrumpets - Autism was once mentioned but excluded. Whether that was rightly or wrongly I have no idea.

Teribar - If I honestly felt that leaving dd to it would result in her sorting things out for herself in her own way then I would do that but I really don’t think she would.

I’ll definitely investigage the specialist employment advisor and I’m having a good look to see what the princes trust offer too.

I don't think she is able to get a job. She has tried and it sounds as if she has had too many rejections and it has affected her confidence. Tbh I understand this as when I was her age (at university full time so different, but similar) I found it incredibly difficult to find a part time job, applied everywhere and got rejected. It was so difficult and I think applying for low skilled/no skilled jobs is very soul destroying when you get continual rejections. I eventually did find low skilled part time work but it was through friends.

She has also got a sick note. So her gp doesn't think she is able to work.

I think training courses and further education into a skilled job is the best option.

And does she have any friends? Do you spend any leisure time together?

But she needs to pay her way, how else will she ever learn the value of money and the cost of living! And the value of earning money. If she doesn't see the value this she will never bother trying to get a job.

I had to move out of home when I was young so learned this naturally but as she has drifted into living as an adult at her mums it is going to be harder.

Marvello she’s only ever had 2 interviews. A lot of the time she tells me she’s applied for stuff when she hasn’t.

I totally agree that this is mainly a confidence issue and she’s scared to death of a new environment and meeting new people.
I have also said I’d be happy for her to go back to college if it led to employment but again she does nothing about it.

Her and her bf desperately want to live together and I think that if this does happen again anytime soon dd will try and get pregnant. From things she’s said before it is on obvious that she sees this as a get out of work card.

Oh sorry I forgot to answer about friends. She doesn’t have any. She had one best friend in primary school but they fell out and never made up.
She then had a best friend in the last couple of years of school and in college but again they fell out and never made up.

Since she met her bf she says she doesn’t care about having friends but actually I think it does bother her.

I do try to do things with her but again it’s often met with a no. Plus she spends all weekend at her boyfriends.

Any friends and boyfriends are always welcome here which dd knows.