Can I be forced to work part time?

[Wurkit]

Hi all

I’ve name changed for this and I’m feeling a bit upset so please don’t flame me.

I’m am returning to work in June after having dd2. I will be returning to work on the same basis as before my mat leave - working 4 compressed days. I’ve done this for quite sometime and it works reasonably well.

I was diagnosed with anxiety after my dd2 was born and I feel like it’s not getting any better or worse

I spoke to my work and asked them if I could work a day from home a week. They have the technology to do this and made a big fuss about it when the technology was rolled out. I do the sort of job that doesn’t require me to be in the office every single day and could easily wfh and get more done.

My work are refusing to let me work from home on a set day. When I ask why they say “they just don’t allow it” when pushed further on this they can’t give any further reason. This is an enormous organisation- not a small firm or family company. I know several teams across this UK who do the same job as me work from home regularly.

My boss said to me that I could work from home different days of the week and I spoke with him today to say that I could try and do this and he changed his story to “oh well I can’t promise you’d get it every week..”

I’m at my wit’s end. I can’t afford to work part time and I can’t afford to pay for childcare over the 5 days. My DH works away and I’m honestly feeling like I could have a breakdown over it.

It’s 2019 and I’m trying my best to get out and work and hold my own in a time when the company I work for is all about “flexibility and diversity” it’s total nonsense.

I just feel completely drained by it all. They’ve offered an occupational health referral but I’m completely terrified and anxious that they’ll force me into part time hours.

Could this happen?

5 days hours in 4 isn’t a popular work pattern with employers IMO.

I think you are going to have to do all you can to manage your anxiety (I struggle with this too and find commuting difficult), attend the office, and see how it pans out. in practice they may let you work from home on a similar day most weeks.

Your DP may need to make changes to his working pattern, eg to reduce travel, to do more parenting in the week, especially given your MH issue.

Lots of organisations don’t allow compressed hours whilst working from home.

It’s the wfh they are unsure about not the compressed hours.

They have said that you can wfh when possible but not necessarily every week. That seems fair

I still don't get it

why would Op need 5 days childcare if she is working 4 days compressed? And why does it matter if she is WFH the same day each week or different days - OP would need childcare either way. I assume here that the off day would be fixed though.

I think that her work are looking at the whole set up and with the new wfh request are assessing whether compressed hours works for the business.

If the compressed hours aren’t working then she will need to revert to five days.

On a side note I’m interested what childcare you have in place that allows you to do compressed hours as most nurseries are only open 8-6 which barely allows normal working hours

On a side note I’m interested what childcare you have in place that allows you to do compressed hours as most nurseries are only open 8-6 which barely allows normal working hours*

I would assume that the children's father does half the drop offs and pick ups, allowing for staggering their hours. That's how my DH and I do compressed hours.

No you can't be made to work part time but 5 days in 4 means very long days - almost 9 hours per day based on a 35hour week (We have a 40 hour week and it's just not possible to compress by a whole day). I can see how a manager would be worried that was adding to your stress op. I don't know if WFH is practical for your role but sounds like it is so I would just see if you can trial it.

I would go back to working in the office, show them that your childcare is sorted, then start taking the odd wfh day and build up to having one every week

That's probably the most sensible idea yet. It'd remove any doubts they might have about child care, show OP's own commitment to flexibility and hopefully allow a build-up to what she's seeking

The OP said in the original post that her OH works away.

But she says that her husband works away and she has to do all childcare

I would imagine that the issue is that they want you, as a full time worker, to be physically in the office at least 4 days per week.

So you can do 4 days per week compressed hours in the office, one day off

or

5 days a week, normal hours, one day from home.

But not both, as that takes you to only 3 days per week physically in the office, which they consider too little in office time, for whatever reason.

I know that lots of workplaces are reluctant to allow compressed hours from home as its easy for them to be abused.

Forgetting your childcare (as that's not work's problem), working 5 shorter days, with 1 from home would seem to be a sensible solution to relieving stress - shorter hours daily - more time to relax. Its hard to see how working from home actually would relieve stress. Assuming you are planning the same productivity, then its no different, just in a different location. Unless you have a really, really long commute, I guess. But then a long commute would strongly point to compressed working days being a cause of your stress as 10 hour days plus say 3 hours of commuting time on top is very difficult to sustain for anyone.

If I was your employer, I wouldn't automatically grant your request. I would be flexible, but I'd need to understand why working from home would relieve your stress, and I would be inclined to think that shorter days would be more effective at stress relief than working from home. I'm not sure I would be keen to double up compressed hours and working from home. One or the other - fine, but not both.

she says that her husband works away and she has to do all childcare

Which validates your question about childcare, considering most nurseries offer 8 to 6 ... unless it's a relative being paid to do it I guess?

that the OP cannot afford 5 days childcare is not the employers problem.

OP, have you checked if you would be entitled to the childcare element of tax credits/universal credit. sounds like you you are financially struggling despite two incomes so good chance you may get help that way. Have you also looked into tax free childcare?

you always say you cannot afford it. Where is your DH in this all? Clearly he can afford to work away and not look after the DC at all so I struggle to understand why you cannot afford an extra day childcare.

Some CMs offer longer hours.

And nurseries in London and the south east commuter belt.

I would think that they are worried that as soon as they have allowed you to do it they won't be able to refuse anyone else to do it and don't want it to become the norm. They're not victimising you, just concerned for the future direction of the company regarding working from home

My problem with this as a manager/employer would be that, really, simply giving you a day off each week isn't really addressing the core issue of your anxiety. It seems more like a off-hand way to deal with something that likely needs much more mediation from a professional. For me, someone simply saying "Oh, I need this. Definitely" doesn't quite cut it. I could end up with a stream of requests flooding in from anxious people all wanting to sit at home for a day. Instead, I would be inclined to as you to continue your role as you previously did and to attend occupational health/your GP for further treatment.

If at that point your GP/OH determine that a more flexible approach to work would be in your best interest then it would be something I could then confidently look at for you.

I take your point, worriedandannoyed, but it shouldn't matter in theory. It's the overall business need which has to be balanced with such requests, and just as OP can't automatically expect a concession because someone else gets one, others can't do this purely because of hers

But the theory sometimes gets forgotten with what employees expect in practice, which perhaps explains why employers can be a bit wary about these arrangements

Even London nursery tends not to do longer than 7.30-6.30. 11 hours which means with compressed hours of 9 hrs a day and commute of less than an hour she will not be able to do it as most businesses that do compressed hours require lunch break of 30 mins or hour which actually makes it ten hours a day.

As an aside, my colleague does compressed hours 8 until 6 but as far as I can see it’s a total piss take and she regularly leaves before me and comes in well after eight

I imagine they want you physically in the office 4 days a week, so either 4 compressed days in the office and one day off, or 4 days in the office and one WFH but less hours than your current compressed days. Fair enough I would say, they are flexible in the sense that they offer you both options.

OP you’ve said what benefit it will be to you, but what is the benefit to the organisation?

@SnowyAlpsandPeaks

For one, the organisation struggles to find enough desks for everyone. It’s not unusual to turn up for work and find that you have no where to work so you’re left looking for desks on different floors and in different departments.

Part of the WFH introduction was to combat this.

The type of job I have is very solitary and sometimes I require help which is generally given on an appointment basis.

I'm sorry you're so stressed OP. I think that the way your employer sees it is that you are working 5 days, compressed to 4 currently. As PP mentioned, those must be long days!

I think that they are likely concerned that you won't manage to complete those hours from home - essentially that your WFH day will be shorter than the other days because you're not in the office and therefore won't actually be sticking to the agreed flexible arrangement. Do you have a long commute?

I can understand that you are very anxious - but I'm not sure what you think WFH 1 day will achieve in terms of anxiety? You talk about work/life balance but that day will need to be spent working just as much as the others. It might be more proactive to draw up a plan of how you would intend to ensure that WFH would better your work overall. Suggest a trial period? Or alternatively, could you arrange a staggered start? Given you have a diagnosis, they might be more flexible to make your return less anxiety inducing - e.g. the first week 3 days, the second four days, the third the full 5 compressed over 4. Do you think something like that might ease you in so that you don't feel very anxious about the return to the long days straight off the bat?

What else apart from no desks? You need to given them solid reasons so they think- yes this is going to be good for us.