To find this unfair

[user1496701154]

to find religious schools applications unfair. Saying you have to be practicing that religion. I can respect it but you have to be practicing. To apply I find it to be discriminationing

[Puzzledandpissedoff]

sounds like a very neutral and purely fact based article

Yes, I thought you'd say that ... though I'm not entirely clear on what's wrong about calling something discrimination when that's precisely what it is

It's only natural that the religious enjoy having their propaganda funded by the taxpayer, but perhaps a bit worrying if it turns into a sense of outright entitlement and (as seen at 13.33 about the funding) a complete misrepresentation of the facts

[thedisorganisedmum]

All the other facts and arguments you have been presented with have quite passed you buy.

you are funny, but you haven't convinced me at all. Just because you write something doesn't make you right or must make me change my mind. You don't agree with me, so whatever i say you are not going to be happy with.

I see no discrimination, I haven't see any in all the posts. It's NOT what discrimination is.

As I said earlier, we can go round in circle all day! If faith schools still exist, and find enough parents willing to apply, there must be a fair amount of people who agree with me and are happy about their existence - or at least neutral about it.

[JacquesHammer]

I see no discrimination

Ah privilege

[floribunda18]

Yes I agree it's unfair, OP, particularly when faith schools are the only option in some areas. And there is no such thing as a completely secular school in the UK anyway.

Either they shouldn't take public money or be forced to prioritise on non-faith criteria. It's archaic that they even exist.

[YogaDrone]

As so many people have said, you do not get a "choice" you get to express your preference for schools. We expressed a preference for our catchment school and the three closest non-VA schools in the borough. All were oversubscribed and we were offered the "closest school with places" which was a VA CofE school 2 miles from our home. I did not chose it but neither could we appeal for another school based on not wanting a faith school.

Luckily a school 5 miles away put on a bulge class and DS got a place in that. I would rather do the 20 mile a day round trip than have him being indoctrinated into a faith. When he is older he can chose if he would like a faith but it's not up to the school to force one on him.

VA schools are an anachronism which the LA's can't afford to get rid of because however little the diocese donate to the school it's still better than nothing. We no longer have faith based hospitals and one day, hopefully, we will no longer have faith based schools either.

[thedisorganisedmum]

JacquesHammer
not that it makes any difference, but I did chose a non-faith school for my own kids...

I still fail to see any discrimination if they had not had priority in a faith school because they didn't follow that faith.

[Backinthebox]

AstonishedFemaleImpersontor - “Nope. More like my local school refused my application to be a schoolkid although I'm a child and have no interest in religion. I’ve added the words most appropriate to this debate, rather than your hyperbolic example.

[DoneLikeAKipper]

I still fail to see any discrimination if they had not had priority in a faith school because they didn't follow that faith.

The discrimination comes in the fact that a school placement shouldn’t be based on what god you believe in or what church you’re part of. That has no bases on priorities when it comes to a child’s education. A non CoE/Catholic member shouldn’t have to look miles outside their living area for an appropriate school, they shouldn’t have to ‘put up’ with a faith school if that’s the only option or have to contemplate moving and upheaving their whole life just to find an area that is low on faith schools.

If a child cannot go to a school, something that is compulsory to do, because they don’t follow a god - who has nothing to do with compulsory education - that is discrimination. It’s not a case of wanting to go to these schools, it’s that the choices for those with different/no faith are limited when they shouldn’t be, causing problems that those of that faith do not have to face. Is it getting through yet?

[thedisorganisedmum]

it’s that the choices for those with different/no faith are limited when they shouldn’t be, causing problems that those of that faith do not have to face. Is it getting through yet?

you want to feel discriminated, that's your problem.

Instead of looking at things backward, list the secular schools and apply for them. Otherwise feel free to be discriminated because of the private school you can't attend, the boy school your daughter can't attend, the grammar school your kid can't attend.

You can't even argue that your non religious child cannot attend the faith school because they all accept non religious children AND you can remove them from the religious element (in a faith school.. because that makes sense)

Is it getting through yet now?

[DoneLikeAKipper]

Instead of looking at things backward, list the secular schools and apply for them.

As has been pointed out more than once, not everyone has that choice. Not that true secular schools are available in this country.


Otherwise feel free to be discriminated because of the private school you can't attend, the boy school your daughter can't attend, the grammar school your kid can't attend.

Those are completely different scenarios. Private schools are a complete choice, and grammar schools are supposedly meant for the more intelligent children of this country (although we all know they’re a bit of a farce as well). The schools you mention are very few and have no impact on the average child getting a school place when needed. Faith schools do.

You can't even argue that your non religious child cannot attend the faith school because they all accept non religious children AND you can remove them from the religious element (in a faith school.. because that makes sense)

But I don’t want my children going to a school that will indoctrinate them with nonsense, and why should they have to miss out on school time because of a faith they will not be part of? Why should children face a choice between isolation from their peers, or be a part of some charade? And to avoid all that, why should my children have a smaller selection of schools to apply to initially? Have to travel much further to get to?

[Puzzledandpissedoff]

I see no discrimination

And that's possibly the most worrying thing of all ...

[thedisorganisedmum]

meanwhile in the real world:

My children don't have priority for x-faith school!
I didn't know you were x-faith?
We are not. We are just discriminated against, I want priority.

[thedisorganisedmum]

.

[Pinkprincess1978]

You can still apply you will just be further down the list so may not get in depending on the catchment.

Our closest school is a former private but very poor performing school. A neighbour who lives within half a mile of the school didn't get a place because their admissions policy is so weird that most normal children (ie not looked after, not siblings and not staff and not already attending the primary) get their names pulled out of a hat. So a child on the other side of the town could get a place but a child over the road might not based on chance only! Now that is madness,

[swingofthings]

It is very clear that parents are pissed off because the existence of faith schools means that some children have a far greater choice of publicly funded schools than others
Everyone has the same number of choices so that's not a genuine argument against them. It might be that some choices mean having to have a couple of choices further away but how many parents would pick failing schools closer by when tgey could pick better ones à bit further away. Sorry but I do believe it's still come down to parents being annoyed they get one less choice of one of the better performing school.

And I'm not a supporter of them at all, I just think parents are very hypocritical when it comes to faith schos, whether by pretending they are against them when they would jump at t b e option to send their kids there if they could get a place or pretending to care about their faith and suddenly sending their kids to church in year 5 to get that signature to get them in the secondary faith school.

[DoneLikeAKipper]

@thedisorganisedmum, again not getting it. The discrimination comes in 1/3 less options for different/non faith families than for those who are CoE or Catholic. Why is that difficult for you to comprehend? Why can’t you get your head around the fact that eliminating faith schools from your application can be a huge stress for some families as to where their children could possibly attend school?

[Pemba]

Anybody else thinking that disorganisedmum is not a very good advertisement for faith schools, assuming she attended these herself?

Her thinking skills seem a bit lacking.

[TaMereAPoilDevantPrisu]

some choices mean having to have a couple of choices further away

Again, for the hard of reading in the back there, in rural areas that might not be a few streets, it might mean TENS OF MILES further away.

[DoctorNicoleWatterson]

Of course it's discriminatory. We applied for our local faith school, it gets the best results in our catchment area, Dd didn't get a place purely because we are atheists, children who lived further away but were practising Christians did get a place, many children. How is that not discriminatory?

I find it appalling that my taxes go towards paying for a school my children are not able to attend based purely on religion.

[thedisorganisedmum]

Pemba

I did write that I chose a non-faith school for my own children, we are not religious.

your reading skills seem a bit lacking
but thanks for turning a debate into a personal attack

[BigFatGiant]

That is the literal definition of discrimination. If you don’t practice x religion we won’t let you in.

[swingofthings]

I find it appalling that my taxes go towards paying for a school my children are not able to attend based purely on religion
Who says that the school would be there if it wasn't a faith school? Maybe instead, your taxes would go towards extending the other local school that doesn't perform well. The choice would be the same as it is now.

[youknowmedontyou]

Do you want your dc to spend half their day learning about Islam, Judaism or Catholicism

Utter bollocks!

[Jessgalinda]

I had a catholic education from reception till I finished 6th form.

We didn't spend half of any days learning about religion

[Acis]

For most schools religious criteria is usually at the bottom. Well below catchment criteria. If it's your closest school you should get in because catchment is usually well above faith criteria.

Not true. For the vast majority of faith schools, faith overarches all other criteria, so that, for instance, proximity criteria put children who satisfy faith requirements above those who don't. In some the admissions criteria have a faith ranking which goes, say, (1) RC children, (2) children of other recognised Christian faiths; (3) others.