children that are firghtened of dogs and how i find some parents are encouraging their fear

[haychee]

I have 2 medium to large dogs and i get so cross when i come accross children that just lose the plot if the dogs go near them. I can understand that they are frightened and i call the dogs away from the child instantly. But what makes me cross is the parents responses, "that dog should be on a lead" or i just get looks that could kill you dead. My arguement is, that if the child is that frightened then why would you take him or her to a place where dogs are everywhere in a dog walking area. Why do parents encourage their childrens fear by making these comments? what good does it do for the child? I actually saw one mother once who picked her child up every time the dog was anywhere close (like 4-5meters away). The child got increasingly anxious and the mother ended up having a go at me. I know and fully appreciate that some dogs are dangerous but mine arent and i think that when parents react like this infront of their children the message they are displaying is that its ok to be this frightened of dogs.

My daughter was once frightened of thunder so i purposely sat up with her watching a storm and saying things like "wow, that one was very loud" and " cor, look at that lightening isnt it beautiful". Because of this time i spent with her and the way we watched it together has dulled her fear - infact she gets quite excited if there is a storm brewing now.
Any one else feel the same or can understand where im coming from? or maybe your one of these types of parents that react like this? I would like to discuss the issue if anyone has any comments?

I do not allow my dogs to chase every child in sight but i do believe that if you are going to take a child into a park or any other area where dogs are permitted to run free then the child should be taught how to react and to approach a dog. I am not saying that all dogs are friendly or that the owners word for it can be trusted. But is does aggrevate me when i see a child with its mother and they are both flapping up and down and creating a commotion at even the sight of a dog off the lead. All this does is make the dog even more aware of their presence and to a dog, especially a young one, it looks as though these people want to play.

I wouldn't scream, in fact I try and talk soothingly to DS1 and DS2 and calm them down, and I am very scared of dogs. We don't know anyone with a dog (have just realised this!) so it is hard to get the boys accustomed to them. DS1 is now a lot better, I just wish there were more responsible owners around.

So do i lizzylou!
There should be regulations with regard to owners that must train their dogs to certain standards etc. That is why i took such offence to the mother in the op incident.

A friend of mine used me and my dogs to help with their very frightened daughter. It turns out after several months that she feared the wet noses on her skin rather than the large teeth. Interesting point i feel. She certainly would be knocked back in her progress if a dog jumped up at her though. That could easily be rectified by the right dog training if only all other dog owners took the time to do some training.

Funny, Haychee because what DS1 used to say when he saw a dog or even a cat was:
"Don't let it lick me!" not bite, but lick.

Ha! dh regularly jogs and he is more than occasionally bothered by unleashed dogs who run after him and bark, and risk tripping him up. He yells at them to get away, and more than once an irate owner has yelled back, 'he's only a puppy, for God's sake!' and 'she's just wanting to play'.

Can't see many dog owners tolerating him giving a kick, but I'll let him know what you think, haychee

When our puppy started to like to lick i would grab ahold of his tongue and not let go. I repeated this over a couple of days and now he knows not to do it. Simple as that.
Some of these bad behaviours that children do not like are so easily rectfied its frustrating to the extreme that us good owners are made to suffer for those who are not so good.

Not a vicous kick, i mean more of a push and a stern "NO!". Puppies do need to learn their boundaries unfortunately for your dh.

If my dog was in the habit of running up to joggers I would be delighted if the jogger gave him a sharp kick.

Haychee,
You said
"it was said here that by looking at a dog you cannot tell whether it is well trained or well mannered, you cant tell when its just wandering around. Then you must sympathise with us responsible dog owners as we cannot tell your child is autistic either. Im not attacking you its just to point out that we do not go around with a billboard saying this dog is well trained or this child is autistic etc"

Thank you - you have made my point very well.
You cannot tell by looking.
So given that the order of significance is child first and dog second I believe that the burden of responsibility, in principle, rests with the dog owner to ensure that their dog does not approach children unrestrained.
I have a large, happy , actually slightly dippy big dog. When I walk him in a leash free area it is MY job to spot any kids and restrain him until i can tell if they would welcome the approach. They cannot be expected to identify my dog as well trainned and unthreatening. MY job !

The funny thing is that aforemention big gimpy dog thinks he is the peer of my eldest boy so has assigned himself big brother to asd son and baby girl ( aged 4).
He is very calm and still near ASD son and has actually placed himself between my boy and approaching unrestrained dog. I wonder what would be the fall out of him attacking a dog than ran at my son sufficiently to make him scream.

Just wanted to comment on the environmental points raised earlier around dog poo collection.
I recall watching a program (I think it was countryfile) where they had carried out a special report into the changing face of certain areas of natural beauty. It might have been The South Downs or something, but the point was that this area of natural beauty was home to many rare plants and animals, and that the numbers of these were in decline. One of the reasons given was that the amount of dog poo left lying around to rot was changing the composition/ph of the area and the rare plants could not thrive on it, with a knock-on effect to the animals they supported.
I think there is an environmental answer to this - and I do think we have a responsibility to remove the poo because we have deliberately bred dogs so we have many many more of them than a natural state would allow - and so there is much much more poo than that from a fox or a badger. There are dog toilets that you can bury in your garden - you can take your poo home in biodegradable bags and empty it in your dog toilet. Then nature can do it's stuff without upsetting delicate balances. (NB the aim of the dog toilet is not to get your dog squatting over it in the manner of the cat from Meet The Parents, but that you shovel it up and drop it in)

Im sure this argument has been on her before??!!

My dog is a big lad. And my dd is 2 1/2 they are best friends, he would never hurt anyone, especially a child. A big softy. He stays on the lead apart from when we are up the downs. It would be crawl to not let him have a run. I do not agree that dogs should 'always' be on leads. Just common sense at the end of the day.

My child is not scared of dogs, I would be upset if she was. I realise you cant trust all dogs but you only have to ask owner. I wor in a vets and we ask if its ok to pet.

Happy medium I think!

'Weinstein' - I cannot stop giggling at the thought of trying to get my dog to squat on a dog toilet

Tee hee. Perhaps one of you wants to patent the portable doggie-bog?

But the discussion is not about dog poop or how to ask an owner before patting a dog. Its the way that some parents make such an ordeal out of just seeing a dog off a lead in a lead free environment. Its the discussion of how parents are transferring their own fears to their children. Is that fair on the child? Is it right to teach your child to scream and run at the first sight of a dog? or any animal for that matter? Is it right to instill the knowledge that all dogs are very dangerous?

Not this again......

Come off it! No-one actually teaches their child, ''Now whenever you see a dog off it's lead you must scream and run away or else it will eat you.'' Children are afraid of dogs because they are - just like some people are scared of spiders.

No exactly. What should be taught is how to remain calm around dogs or any animal, and, that they are not toys. Some parents who have fears for whatever reason, are out there transferring their own fears upon their children, by simply they way they react.

But the fear of spiders is transmitted from other people isn't it? I don't think that babies are afraid of them. My youngest wasn't scared at all until he saw me pretending to be scared of a big plastic one that DS#1 put on my bed as a joke - I screamed and DS#2 had hysterics. Now he won't go near them .

I don't think that phobias occur naturally do they? Genuinely interested not wanting an argument. Anyone know?

is this your dog?

Peolpe who are scared of dogs may have a phobia, may have been bitten, there are lots of reasons. Most people are fine around dogs. My dh and I both had dogs as chn and have never been scared around dogs, but ds1 was very scared of dogs from about age 1 to 4. He didn't pick that up from anyone, he just was. I got really fed up of dog owners tutting at me when he showed his fear. How dare they? What business is it of theirs anyway?

i agree. sometimes fear is learnt by either a bad experience or from a trusted carer such as a parent.
However, my dd2 has had a phobia of flies for sometime now and its certainly nothing that i or dh has done its occurred by itself. How to correct it is a difficult task. Ive tried very hard with this and we had made alot of progress until she was stung by a wasp last week. Very unfortunate. Wasps we cannot avoid nor train or leash. A dog however if the owners want it to be able to run off a lead must ensure they can control it very well, by means of training - which it appears very few actually do. Because of this dogs have now become disliked by many and i think this is very sad. There is alot of love and intelligence in dogs and they are not all the same.

Ah littlelupin your back to wind me up, how wonderful!

littlelupin please read my post; By haychee on Thu 12-Jul-07 08:30:41

Wheresmy.... I have just been googling to see if anyone has actually tried to get their dog to poo on a dog poo composter, and it seems, sadly, not!
I did find out how to make a DIY composter though.
But amongst the many amusing things that cropped up, I think this is my favourite, if not just for the web address!

Oh get a grip FFS, I was JOKING