Is there no depths PIP will go to...

[Home77]

Saw this today, shocking. Pip called a lady a 'lying bitch' in her appeal submission. Kind of confirms the DWP attitude really. Horrible.

Sexist as well...

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/22/dwp-document-refers-to-benefit-claimant-as-lying-bitch?CMP=share_btn_tw&fbclid=IwAR2OcNV34F2dyDS7S15k_aw9nEIMLVii6gfKNN-sskR40sPJJxC9hGuldmo

I’m not sure what people think they would do if their child or partner were disabled and they became disabled themselves?

This.

I knew a man who was his wife’s carer. She had blackouts of some sort several times a day. When he was diagnosed with terminal cancer she should have been entitled to claim a carers premium as she was doing things (and regularly hurting herself) to look after him every day.

However, they both refused as they were scared - genuinely scared - of the effect that could have on her ESA and PIP after he died. Even though PIP is meant to be about the help you need, not what help you get.

I am disabled. To claim PIP ( not the old DLA), you must need help with a variety of basic things. To claim carers allowance, you have to be caring for at least 35 hours a week.
If you are both disabled enough to be eligible for PIP, you would have to pay someone to help. And lots of people do that.

@PerkingFaintly

So it wouldn't be at all surprising to have a couple where he is physically strong but suffering from dementia and needs the almost constant presence of another person (Carer's Allowance), and she is mentally fine but has a physical issue which limits her mobility or her ability to chop veg, heft pans, do up buttons or bathe (PIP for mobility and/or personal care).

That was exactly the situation with my Great Aunt and Uncle other than neither were benefit claimants. He was sound of mind but frail, she was fit but suffered from Alzheimers. Under watchful eye from the family, they looked after each other and so were able to stay together in their own home until the uncle died.

I can’t even imagine the complexities of it, just trying to understand from my own very limited standpoint and absolutely don’t want to derail the thread.

I understood that the independent living bit of PIP was to pay for additional help required for someone with a disability so if you can’t do the tasks yourself, you can put money towards getting help in, so extra caring, a cleaner, taxis etc. I imagined a disabled person receiving independent living component whilst caring for another person receiving the same would have similar problems putting a wash on or going to the shop or making lunch or hoovering which is why I wondered how it was possible for them to claim both.

As explained above, there are situations where the other person is there in a different kind of role such as for supervision in case of a fit or say the carer could use a wheelchair but have adaptations and capacity around the house and just have different needs themselves in which case it works between them which answers my question. I read the link and was confused and somebody above cleared it up. I wasn’t having a bash, promise.

Apart from the carer's part the reason i posted was the language used really.

It disgusts me. In my previous role, I came across tens of older couples who both had disabilities but still provided care. It was not uncommon to find, for example, a man with dementia who was being cared for by a wife who had a physical disability. I’ve changed the details for confidentiality but I once worked with a couple in their 80s. The man went completely blind and his wife developed dementia. They looked after each other and did the things the other could not. They had no choice until they finally accepted they needed a bit of help but the help wasn’t there 24:7.

People with disabilities can and do care for others with disabilities. It’s actually very common.

So it wouldn't be at all surprising to have a couple where he is physically strong but suffering from dementia and needs the almost constant presence of another person (Carer's Allowance), and she is mentally fine but has a physical issue which limits her mobility or her ability to chop veg, heft pans, do up buttons or bathe (PIP for mobility and/or personal care).
Not sure you understand the reality of dementia. Lots of people with milder dementia live alone. Once you need constant supervision it is a different ball game.

And to those talking about having disabilities and illnesses and caring for others - lots of people with disabilities and chronic illnesses are not entitled to PIP. And many of them are parents or caring for others.
Christ I am in my late 50s and know lots of people my age and older who work full time, look after grandkids, and have various physical illnesses and/or disabilities. None would be entitled to PIP.

Disabilities are as unique as people.

Why is that so hard to understand?

The benefits involved are a pittance.

Nobody involved in working with vulnerable people should be using abusive language about them. This is about abuse.

The system is corrupt and has been for many years, I have an artificial arm and my other arm has severe weakness, my medical came back with a load of obvious lies, they actually claimed I walked into the medical with 2 very large bags of shopping one of each hand........NO!! I can't lift with false arm fgs! that is obvious, when I challenged them on this they refused to look at CCTV at the assessment centre at Croydon and told me to speak to that centre as far as they were concerned they were sticking by their staff.

I never bothered taking it any further as it just isn't worth the fight for me.

Still angers me 5 years later.

And my parents care for each other. My dad has mild dementia, my mum has various physical issues. Neither are entitled to benefits for this.

I'm a wheelchair user with two disabled children. One with ASD and one with ADHD.
I'm allowed to claim carers for just one. And if I didn't supervise them, who would? Should I give my PIP back?

The benefits involved are a pittance.
Carers allowance and DLA combined make a big difference to anyone who is on a lower income. It is people who are better off who can dismiss this amount of money.

YANBU. PIP has always been about punishing the disabled.

Exactly, SwimmingKaren. It would be very likely that my hypothetical couple would also have folk coming in to help.

In Blibbyblobby's family, clearly it was other family members.

In another case, it could be paid help, or a mix of family and paid help.

It needn't be a closed system of just the two people in the couple.

I know a couple who do this and get carers allowance. Very difficult to do.

One has learning disabilities but is physically fit and can, when prompted a lot, manage to do various things, the other is physically disabled.

It was horrendously hard for them to claim though because though they weren't called lying bitches they were accused of benefit fraud for claiming. I live somewhere with no representation at appeals and they won theirs, eventually, and the judge was appalled they both had their PIP and ESA stopped simply because they applied - they were reported by the person doing one of the assessments for committing fraud (ESA is paid couples rate so was stopped for both). It's quite obvious when you see/speak to them and how they work together how carers allowance can be paid without breaking any rules. However, on paper (or on a screen) it is less so.

They also get extra help as well.

At PIP renewal I'm sure it'll happen again.

I've been reported by cpns (they told me they were doing so) for being allowed high rate care because ten years prior I was capable of working in a managerial position upstairs and have degrees, and that's happened more than once. HOWEVER and I know this is rare, but DWP sided with me, literally I got a letter within a couple of weeks saying there had been a malicious report. That was it. The cpn then discharged me.

Becca- cpns?

I've physical (genetic deterioating) and mental illnesses I claimed for physical needs.

Community psychiatric nurses.

lots of people with disabilities and chronic illnesses are not entitled to PIP.

Yes, it's about thresholds. The questions focus on severity and frequency of being unable to do essential tasks, with a scale of points being awarded according to the answer.

Most your posts on this thread seem not to understand this.

Eg I've had a mild disability since childhood. It's called short-sightedness and is easily corrected with glasses. Unsurprisingly, I am not entitled to PIP for this.

If I had a very serious visual impairment, I might well be entitled to PIP – depending on how I scored against the descriptors.

Carers allowance and DLA combined make a big difference to anyone who is on a lower income.

Agreed but it should be much much more. Compared to the actual cost of living with disability, it is a pittance. CA is less than JSA, saves the state billions in equivalent care work and is completely restrictive to the carer in terms of working to try and better the financial situation.

The system is bollocks. It forces people to try to exist on a pittance, cuts them off at every opportunity, others them, bullies them and shows no appreciation for the voluntary caring workforce holding up the social system.

I will never describe any payment that forces people to do without vital medical equipment, choose between food and heat, lose their home if they have too much hospital time, kill themselves and/or their disabled relatives because they can't cope as anything other than an absolute pittance. It is not enough, it should be more and the OP shows exactly the attitude that is not only tolerated but encouraged in the Fagins of this system.

Cpns reported you? That's bad. I can' understand why they would do something like tat especially with a diagosis etc. might you do a complaint?

I've just been through PIP renewal. I've got ME/CFS, Fibromyalgia, Severe Osteoarthritis, Anxiety, Depression, PTSD, Endometriosis, I wet myself at least 3-4 times a day. My assessor lied throughout my assessment, she said she had seen me walk 22 metres unaided, normally without stopping. She must have been able to see through walls as she only stuck her head through the door, shouted my name & shot back in, if she had looked, she would have seen I was hanging on to my mum's arm, had to stop twice because the pain was taking my breath & lean on the wall & I have never walked normally as I was born with a dislocated hip, my feet turn in & my legs are bent where the arthritis is causing my knee joints to collapse. Every sentence was a lie, I had previously had a lifetime DLA award & then enhanced award when I moved up to PIP. I lost my mobility car, I'm housebound at the moment. I put in a mandatory reconsideration with the help of my welfare rights advisor & MP, I was turned down again. I put in the online application for an appeal tribunal a month ago, last week I got a phone call from the DWP, they were looking over my case before sending the papers to tribunal, they have reinstated my enhanced award. I'm going to order a new car tomorrow. 70% of tribunals are won by the claimant, if I had just accepted the original lower award, i would not be getting my car & the money owed back. Please appeal & complain, contact your MP & ask for help.

I am a wheelchair user claim pip and am a carer to my child who has autism.

Sorry, should have said that was in reply to clairemcnam.

I'm very sorry to read your father has dementia, BTW. I hope it doesn't progress too fast.

As it changes, and the amount of support he needs steps up through the levels, he may well become eligible for different benefits at different stages.

And . It's a horrible condition.

Nat-

"...I put in the online application for an appeal tribunal a month ago, last week I got a phone call from the DWP, they were looking over my case before sending the papers to tribunal, they have reinstated my enhanced award."

Exactly the same thing happened to me. couple of months ago. Think they realise they have no case. Mine is for 5 years, now thankfully. They even apologised.