To tell the truth straight up

[Billy02]

really need some advice and have name changed for this.
Person A has 2 children and id pregnant with third, has a partner.
A has never had a steady life, must be carrying lots of baggage and i feel so sorry for them.

A lives in squalor so I'm told. The house stinks, there are cat faeces and stuff splashed up the walls, never been cleaned off.
No carpets on the floor etc , and in need of a whole deep clean, plus some.

Anyone who sees A just gossips behind her back, none of them tell her I suppose they don't want to upset her.
She doesn't neglect her kids, she worships them, and loves them so much.

I don't live close enough to just pop over for tea, I'm told I wouldn't want to drink out of the cups anyway.
Should I go over say my bit and offer to clean the whole house, I thought maybe do it with her and show her how to do it and a reasonable standard, I'm not perfect and have a mess sometimes, but never as bad as this sounds.
Even though we aren't close I love A and want to help her rather than judge her.
All suggestions welcome.

Are you sure? Why wouldn’t they all be sick if cat faeces were spread around? Plus that’s risky for pregnant women. And all mess is unavoidable for crawling babies/exploring children. I don’t see how the children aren’t neglected but the house could be in that bad a state. What about the partner?
Why haven’t you seen her for 11 years? Never met the children?
I don’t think you’re the right person to get involved if you’re not close.

My house was like this for the first 7 years of my dcs life.

It was a combination of being in excruciating pain (walking around with a disc that had slipped and was undiagnosed for 6.5 years), not sleeping because of the pain and 2 children with ADHD who I couldn’t take my eyes off otherwise they would have made a bigger mess or throwing themselves off windowsills or climbing up the curtains.

If someone had turned up on my doorstep and told me how I needed to be taught to clean I would have told them to F*k off to the far side of F*k.

As for calling SS what would that do?

You don’t know how fragile this woman’s mental health is.
Taking her kids could push her over the edge and would you be able to live with the fall out.

She will get her head together in her own time.

Be friendly, go visit as a friend and get to know her properly. Then you can help where the help is needed.

She might just need a break from children or adjusting her finances so she can afford a cleaner once a week or once a month.

You might get there and find people are exaggerating.

I

Yes, a relative. I moved away and have always felt awful that nobody was there for her, a lot of guilt too.
As a child/teen she used to tell me and dh she wished we were her parents. It was my family members that visited, and rightly or wrongly I cried when they told me.
I do want to help her, but calling ss isn't going to happen, I want to know the best thing I can do.
Me and dh are going to visit this week, but don't have time to go regularly as an hour away, if round the corner, I'd be the pop in for tea type.

FWIW we have never had any D&V and the dc can’t remember how bad the house was.

Personally I would call SS to get them involved to help support her. I adore my kids, my house isn’t immaculate but I would never ever allow my kids to live in a house covered in cat shit.
It is neglect and it could have an impact on her kids health.

An hour is nothing, if someone you “love” is struggling.
Sure, you can’t go every day, you have your own life to lead.
But if you’re the pop in for tea type, why not arrange tea together one evening a month?
Being a regular caring, listening ear is likely to be far more useful to her than a one off deep clean.

and haven't seen A for about 11 years, then I only bumped into her.
i really do love her

If you really do love her then why haven't you made the effort to see her more often?

Oliversmumsarmy we were the same, never ill, children were always well turned out, they did eat off clean plates, just that every other plate I owned was stacked up unwashed most of the time. My girls have seen in photos what the house was like but that's not what they remember from their childhood. They remember fun and being loved and being well cared for.

OP I think if you had genuine neglect concerns from your own experience and not gossip, you could then involve someone else. But that really doesn't sound the case here.

Personally I would call SS to get them involved to help support her. I adore my kids, my house isn’t immaculate but I would never ever allow my kids to live in a house covered in cat shit

Do you honestly think SS are going to help support the mother.

Friend nearly had her dc taken by SS because her house was messy. She didn’t have any cat shit either.

If you don’t live in an immaculate house do you think you should call SS on yourself

Your not even a friend if you haven't seen for 11 years.
I'd mind my own business not go in telling her straight about anything.

I don't want to call ss I want to help her myself.
nobody has ever put her first, ever. calling ss would be the worst support anyone could ever offer.
I know I haven't worded my title properly, but I'm going to help, but need suggestions as to what to do.

I like the idea of getting close, we talk a lot privately on fb. She knows I think the word of her.
Please don't anyone think I'm being judgemental, I'm most certainly not, of course there's a reason why she's like she is. The fact that she functions as well as she does after her upbringing is a miracle.

If she brings up the state of the house with you could you suggest that you would pay for a cleaner to get on top of everything or you would help her if she wanted.

Get talking about Marie Kondo and how she has helped you declutter.

But only if she brings it up and don’t push it. Remember you don’t have to say anything the first time you meet up.

My friends live 1 hour in either direction.
We meet once a week or every two weeks. It’s not that far.

Funnily enough my dc and I have never had any d&v but the children who came from some of the most immaculate homes were off school regularly with it.

OP I wish people were more like you, wanting to help rather than all the people in here who arectelling yu to back off, you dont love her etc...
I suspect they will be the s’aime people saying that gossiping behind the back of someone/neighbours/school mum and never proposing to help is crap too....

The fact you had a close relationhsip is clear and so is the fact you genuinely want to help.
I wouod start by trying to meet up (find an excuse, maybe the incoming arrival of the new baby?) and rekindle a closer face to face relationship.
THEN go to her house and assess if the house is as bad as family says. (They might well be gossiping badly :(). And check with her what’s going in in her life. I’m thinking what sort of struggles does she have, is she in a controlling relationhsip, why is it that her DP doesn’t do any of the cleaning either, is she badly depressed etc...
THEN I would propose my help. Help to clean if it feels just too much. But maybe what she needs is other type of help such as support to go and see a GP (does she have AND?) or having access to a counsellor etc.... But the best you can do is to ensure that whatever hep you are giving her is the one she needs rather than the one you think she needs iyswim.

I hope you find a way to reach her. From your description she sounds like a lovely mum who loves her dcs but also has had a really hard start in life. She is lucky to have someone who cares about her rather than gossip behind her back like the other family members (and it seems a few of the posters on here)

why are people being so harsh? if the OP wants to help and be kind, does it really matter whether or not she 'really loves her'?

OP why don't you start by asking her out for a coffee - she may not want to bring anyone back to her place as it is. Then you can suss out the situation and just ask her outright if she needs help.

You can suggest you pop in for a couple of hours to help out 'as she's pregnant' But the offer of help and someone to talk to are probably more important here than the dirty house

OP you sound lovely and well intentioned but to swoop in and condescendingly teach her how to clean is not the way to go.

You've not seen her for eleven years and like it or not you are strangers now, you don't get intimate simply talking over FB messenger.

It's lovely that you care about her but she's not a little girl that needs rescuing anymore, she's a fully grown adult who is probably far more street savvy than you, if her upbringing was like you say.

I love the idea of you rekindling your relationship with her but you cannot and should not tell her how to live - the saying theirs not to reason why springs to mind.

It sounds as though she has had no one in her life just to accept her as she is, if you want to help her be that person. Don't try to make her fit a box that you find acceptable, you're doing that for you, not her.

I wanted to one day be in the position where life wasn't so exhausting that I could do it myself.

Generally, this is what people want/need help with - not instructions on how to clean.

Op, if you really want to be able to support, it sounds like educating yourself on trauma and in particular developmental trauma would be a good place to start. You need to understand this person's perspective rather than your own, and from what you're describing it sounds like somebody struggling with the effects of long term trauma.

Judith Herman might be your best starting point.

*Do you honestly think SS are going to help support the mother.

Friend nearly had her dc taken by SS because her house was messy. She didn’t have any cat shit either.*

This! I had ss involvement for a different reason and she came to my house and was satisfied with me as a parent and that the case wasnt going anywhere however she said my house was messy. It was awful she was judgemental and I dont even have animal shit anywhere. Just mess, think dishes not done, crumbs, clothes not put away, carpets needing replacing, pen on walls. SS isnt the type of help I would want tbh and I would rather someone I knew actually offered to help rather than running to report to ss! She said if I didnt accept the help it would be a child protection issue! my house is messy but its not squalor. I had to make a complaint to her manager to get rid of her. honestly think carefully before reporting to SS.

Thank you for all the comments, I know it's AIBU, so can take the criticism of not coming across like I love her, it's a complicated family and I have decided to support her the best I can.
I don't drive and it costs me £15 on the train, although dh has offered to take me after family have told me how bad it is.
The latest to tell me are my own children, (grown up) and they are worried, certainly not judgemental. They can't help as also an hour a way and working/ mat leave with tiny baby.
I will try and make it every month if she has the time.
We have always been on social media and private message quite a lot.
Thank you so much to those sharing their experience and I can see AIBU to swoop on her and start cleaning.
I will take note of the comments and act on the suggestions.

Probably outing myself now with this but dh has a cousin like this who I became friendly with and the first time I visited her home I lost sleep over how her babies were living. I tattled to mil (her aunt) and we both went over and blitzed her house. I had a come to god talk with her after about how she can live in filth if she chooses because she’s an adult but it’s not fair to make the kids live like that and if her hv was to see the state of the place then social services would be called in. Her house since is rarely tidy (2 under 4 so understandable) but it’s always clean. I’d offer your friend help with a big one off clean and declutter and then have a chat about how to maintain it going forward

Can you just pay for a cleaner anynomusly?

I'm not sure she'd appreciate an anonymous cleaner, perhaps wouldn't let them in.

ourmaud

That was the type of thing I was thinking of, but not cleaning until we are visiting regularly.
I didn't mean I was literally going to teach her, but hoped she'd see the standard for herself. Not that I'd say her house was minging.
She has a child in juniors who I'm sure would get on board and help her mum if encouraged.

I have a karcher steamer I won on here a couple of years ago, I was thinking that if she agreed this would be a huge asset in cleaning the walls and floors.
But first we are going to visit, I won't accidentally on purpose have it waiting in the car.

Thanks again for the responses and if anybody can think of specific suggestions I'd be very grateful. I can't let this go on any longer, not just how she is living the way she is, but why.
I wasn't there for her when she was younger as we moved 250 miles away, but as a baby I cared for her and she knows I was one of the only ones there in her early childhood.

Could you say something before you go and how you helped a friend before a birth by sending her off for a coffee and a cake and blitzing the cleaning. And that your friend was really please. Would she appreciate something similar or would she rather you just hang out?

Why would you not call social services op?
If she is in the state you described with children and another on the way you owe it to those children to get them help. They can't.

Maybe if you get talking you could suggest the orangised mom method There are 3 levels of jobs:

Level 1: Everyday Jobs

These never change and are the same every day. This is the minimum that needs to be done in order to maintain an orderly home. This is supposed to be a quick top level tidy – It should take no longer than 15 minutes.

Quick floor clean of main living areas. This obviously depends on what floors you have (carpets, tiles or wood floors). If you have hard flooring mop at least once a week.
1 load of laundry
Quick clean of bathrooms, this includes a mop of the floors at least once a week.
Make beds
Level 2: Day Specific Tasks

Each day is assigned specific jobs. These won’t change so you will always know that Thursday is kitchen day and Monday is living room day (I have been using this method for 10 years – That makes me feel old! And I know the days off by heart now). This will allow you to move your focus around the home making sure that everywhere gets dealt with every week. Spend no more than 30 minutes on these – it doesn’t matter if you don’t get everything done, you will be back in the same area on the same day next week! And remember the longer you follow the method, the cleaner your house will become it will be easier and quicker to clean!

Monday: Living room

Tuesday: Bedrooms

Wednesday: Entrance Hall and stairs

Thursday: Kitchen

Friday : Focus day – see next tier.

Level 3: Friday Focus

In order to make sure your home gets a deep clean in all areas on a regular basis there is Friday Focus.

Each Friday we concentrate on a different area of the home making sure that the jobs that need doing less frequently,such as cleaning the oven (hate that job!), get done regularly too. There is an 8 week cycle for this. Again only spend 30 minutes on this.

Week 1: Kids’ bedrooms

Week 2: Living room

Week 3: Kitchen

Week 4: Bathrooms

Week 5: Master bedroom

Week 6: Entrance Hall and Stairs

Week 7: Dining Room and any other rooms that haven’t already been covered such as study/spare bedrooms.

Week 8: Garden/Outside Space

Maybe this could help her. She could be suffering with depression. Does her other half not help with tidying the house. I found this method brilliant as I suffer anxiety and depression.

I'm not sure about the oh, I'm not sure if he helps or not.
I do know that she lives for her children and feel she will probably end up with a brood, because she has a lot of love to give.
I know she doesn't let him take care of the kids even though they have a toddler and one on the way. The eldest isn't her partners child but I know he does the school run sometimes.
he does work full time, so he isn't a drop out, I'm not sure what he's like yet, although people say he's lovely and I know he loves her from all accounts.