Is the phrase “woman of Colour” still acceptable?

[Whatjusthappenedthere]

I’m confused, Amber Rudd caused uproar when she used the out dated and now racist term “ coloured” when referring to Diane Abott recently. I grasp why this term is now no longer used BUT yesterday on Woman’s Hour the term “women of colour “ was used in a positive way and this is acceptable.
Any one able to explain ?
I’m genuinely concerned as I brought up in a home where “passive” racism was the norm. The N word was occationally used but not in anger or violence. The local shop was called by the P word. I remember once being asked to see the head master at school in the 1980’s because I had used some racist language and I was honestly dumbfounded as I had no idea what I had said.
I work very intimately with the general public but not in an ethnically diverse area so when I do spend time with someone who is not ( and even here I’m struggling to find the right term) white, hope that’s ok , I’m really nervous of saying the wrong thing.
Can any one explain the right terms to use?
I still struggle to refer to people as Black if required as that was the one word I did here in the 80’s that was often followed by some other derogatory term.
Help. I just want to get it right.

Why on earth would anyone describe someone as being from a continent rather than a country?

Surely you say 'from Zimbabwe' or 'from Cuba'? Also, wtf is an 'unmistakable African accent'? Not sure off the top of my head how many countries there are in Africa but I've been to a few of them and they all have different accents. They also speak different bloody languages!

@JessicaCH
I really hope this isn’t a stupid question, but if you don’t mind me asking, what are your reasons for feeling that the colour of your skin defines you? Just wanting to understand!

Well, not sure how to explain it in a way you will understand... I can only say how it feels for me. The colour of my skin defines me just like my gender, personality and culture define me. In fact, you see the colour of my skin before you see my personality or culture. The colour of my skin is the cover of all that I am.

I'm a black African woman... I really really fancy that

In my field of work some ethnicities are more prone to a particular medical condition that I work to prevent. I should include this in the info I pass on but I just don’t.

Are you sure you're in the right job?

I’d be a bit surprised if anyone described me as “from Europe”.......

Handing a black child a banana- fine.
Throwing a banana at a black child while making monkey noises- not fine.

HTH

“In my field of work some ethnicities are more prone to a particular medical condition that I work to prevent. I should include this in the info I pass on but I just don’t”

Blimey. Have you been on any training recently?

I'm not keen on the phrase "woman of colour" particularly.
it's not the phrase itself, it's the acronym.
it's far too similar to a racist term, commonly used against people of Indian descent in my childhood.
perhaps they've never used the word that comes after golly as an insult in the USA and so aren't aware?

VanGoghsDog surely its commonplace to use a general area of you don't know someone's specific heritage?
I would definitely avoid referring to someone as Indian or Pakistani unless I knew for certain (the two countries having quite a tricky relationship), so in that case would describe them as Asian.
And yes, if someone looked and sounded like they were from South America and I had no idea specifically where, I would indeed describe them as South American! Brazilian, Argentinian, Puerto Rican are hardly distinguishable in a millisecond by someone who lives on the other side of the globe.
Likewise I wouldn't expect them to be able to differentiate between Irish, Scottish, Welsh or English - British would do.
And yes, I say European or Mediterranean if someone fits those descriptors.

If I don't know a black person's heritage there is no way I'd say they were 'African', that's ridiculous.

My black friends would be agog if someone described them like that. They'd say no I'm not, I'm British.

Do we ever hear ‘man of colour’? I don’t think I ever have.

@nightwitch

Golly* is not used at all. I never even heard of it until I moved to England. Found it a bit depressing that no matter where I go there is a racist reference for anyone who isn’t white.

I really don't think I would ever describe someone as South American either to be honest.

If I knew they were from a South American country but not which one, I'd probably say 'from somewhere in South America'. But honestly, if I knew that, I can't think why I wouldn't know they were, say, Brazilian or whatever. I've never had anyone tell me they are South American, they tend to tell you the country. It's not like you could tell someone was South American anyway, they could be Central American, or even Spanish!

As someone with a poor memory, I'd say South American. I'd also say Northern European or Mediterranean. I'd also say 'one of the African countries'. I'd have to know someone for a long time before I'd reliably remember where they are from. Accents can be very similar- Swiss, Austrian, German, possibly Dutch and some Scandi countries.

Nationality not relevant in this context, it's ethnicity, could be European, African, Asian etc or black, white, Irish Jewish heritage, mixed...

Well this is as clear as mud and cometinmoominvalley you sound like you like looking down on folks don't you

Bertrand Russel and Van gough.
I refer to their genetics rather than their origins. Same thing , around about way of saying it. But no, I have not been on any training with regard to how to use the “correct language” hence trying to get a bit of advice on here. But I have already completed over 100 hours of CPD since my cycle renewed in August last year and I only need to do 150 in 5 years to retain my registration. It’s not a subject that is offered as part of my profession and I’ve never come across any modules or seminars in 20 odd years directed to my profession ( I don’t work in the NHS) .
But if any one knows of one I would be happy to attend. Goodness know with my jumbled up child hood learning experience and that it’s definitely a mind field I think I should.
I can’t bring myself to tell people they more than likely have more sever xyz because they are black ( chinease / polyneasian etc). Feels incredibly clumsy language.

I felt sorry to Amber - I get what she was trying to say - Diane gets crap and abuse because she is a woman, she has has a relationship with JC and she is black. She was trying to empathise with her and the wording came out wrong. If she hasn’t mentioned it (and kept it to being a woman) there would have been complaints too.

And I’ve asked a few times where someone is from if I suspect they may have a genetic tendency toward a particular disease as a way of introducing the idea to them .More often than not the answer is somewhere in UK so I look even more of a twit.

I'm a black woman originally from Zimbabwe. I tend not to say I'm from Africa because that's a continent and really doesn't tell you much about me, so I feel it's quite useless information.
I have friends from the same home town as me who have different feelings about being called different things so I think it's a really difficult one. I've had negative experiences with the word coloured and therefore dislike it. However, if someone called me coloured with no ill intent, I would not be offended. If it's someone I will be interacting with again, I would tell them I prefer to be called black. If it's not, I'd let it go. Woman of colour has a more positive message to me than coloured, based on my own experiences, so I don't mind that term.
But someone else may have had different experiences to me and may feel the opposite, so I think it's a very personal thing that depends on each individual.

Caucasian means white. It's been used for ever, in statistics, police ethnic identity signifiers,mdata collection.

Sometimes ask where someone's family are from, or what their gpgeritage is, often if sharing mine.

Heritage.phone got dislexia

@VforVienetta - Likewise I wouldn't expect them to be able to differentiate between Irish, Scottish, Welsh or English - British would do.

As an Irish person, British would most definitely not do.

doireallyneedto well of course it would be incorrect, and you could choose to take offence, but would you really expect a Peruvian you met in passing to be familiar with all Northern European accents and be able to correctly identity them?

The point stands, that those of us who are not familiar with the various diverse African nations can still recognise an African accent, or an Antipodean one. It's not racist, though I suppose you could call it ignorant if you wanted to be petty. Plenty of people struggle to tell the difference between Eastern European accents, but you wouldn't get called racist for saying Eastern European rather than Latvian.

@VforVienetta - but would you really expect a Peruvian you met in passing to be familiar with all Northern European accents and be able to correctly identity them?

No I wouldn't. However, the other examples you gave were factually correct in that a person from Zimbabwe is also from Africa. I think it is offensive of you to lump Irish in with British as all the examples you gave were about categorising people in larger geographical groupings.

Ireland is not part of Britain and for a British person (I am assuming you are British based on your example) to suggest it is, as you did, is offensive. For a Peruvian to ask me if I am British would not be offensive unless they continued to call me British after correction.