To think that no-one will choose to swap cars for public transport when it's still easier / cheaper / faster to drive?

[BogstandardBelle]

Since starting a new job 18 months ago I have used public transport to get there and back 3 days a week. I leave my house, walk 10 minutes to the metro, spend around 20 minutes on the metro with one change in between, then walk around 15 minutes at the other end to arrive at work. I always assumed that (living in a big busy city) it was cheaper and easier to travel this way and never really considered driving.

This morning I needed to take some heavy bags into work, so I decided to drive. I left around 15 minutes later than usual and still arrived at the same time! And I didn't need to walk anywhere or share my space with hundreds of coughing / sneezing / inconsiderate / odd people en route. The cost was negligible compared to the 64 euros I spend each month on a metro ticket.

I'm really disappointed! I know that the exercise is good for me, and god knows the air pollution problem in my city doesn't need yet another single occupancy, short distance car journey being added to it. But it was so much easier / more pleasant than using public transport... and now I know how easy it was, there's going to be a little voice saying "just take the car...".

So it is unreasonable to expect people to give up their cars when public transport is actually more expensive, less convenient and overall harder work than driving? I used to think that all the motorists clogging up the roads / causing the pollution were BU, but now I'm not so sure.

LOL it was reading George monbiot in the guardian that really pushed me to post!

I’m fairly environmentally aware, and it is something that I take into account. DH and I haven’t used the car for work regularly at all: DH cycles, I’ve used public transport (and will continue to). I was just really disappointed today as one of my main reasons to use public transport has been shown to not exist: it’s not cheaper or easier or fasterthan driving. So all I’m left with is feeling good about doing the «right thing» environmentally and being able to mumsnet as I travel ;-) That might be enough for me, but how is it ever going to convince the millions of drivers who don’t care about pollution, and who make a decision based purely on comfort, cost and convenience ? It’s just not going to happen.

I drive to work in London. It takes me 60 minutes door to door

That's nice for you TedAndLola but not so nice for me who doesn't have a car but has to put up with air pollution from people who drive in. It takes me 20 minutes by tube to get to my office or an hour's walk on a nice day, except it's not a nice day because it's polluted by people like you who think it's okay to drive all over my city. And then I have to put up with the residual pollution when you go home.

Are you geared up for the ULEZ zone? It's only fair, isn't it?

It’s diabolical really, I would love to use public transport more and we do try but honestly it is shocking and so expensive for what it is, ot doesn’t even turn up half the time where I am (Wales) and they have 2 carriages which simply isn’t enough so if it does turn up you can’t get on it. It really needs sorting because it will have such a positive knock on effect with pollution and the god almighty traffic issues we have by me

I often prefer public transport to the car, but I live in the outskirts of London so transport is decent and congestion/parking/stress of driving is often more hassle than its worth. It only works if the cost is reasonable and with decent connections/frequency though... When I've lived in more rural areas it just hasn't really been an option.

I have a 17 mile commute. In the car, it takes about 30 minutes (35 if I get stuck behind a tractor).

If I take the bus, I get to walk for 20 minutes, sit on the bus for 45 minutes and then arrive for work half an hour late. But that's not a problem, because the bus home goes half an hour after finishing time.

If I go to visit my relatives (600 mile roundtrip), it's about the same price and time spent to drive or get the train. But the train is always crowded and noisy, there's invariably a hen party sitting in the quiet carriage so it's just unpleasant! Plus the state of the toilets is enough to put you off... Then you're reliant on people to drive you around when you get there. If there are two of you, it's a no brainer to drive.

The only time I'll take the train/bus is if I'm going to Edinburgh or Glasgow, then I'll park up at a train station with free parking and get the train for the last 15 minutes to avoid having to drive in the city centre. Or if we're going for a meal out and we both want to drink.

Public transport definitely isn't worth the hassle. The only people that use it are too old, young, drunk or poor to use a car.

We went down to one car 18m/2 years ago

I use my electric bike & at Christmas DH bought one too - we rarely need to go in opposite drections in 2 cars (DH is retured and I work parttime) - we couldn't have done it where we lived before (no public transport or shops/GP/etc for miles in any direction - but in a town it's fine

We were planning to do our bogger journeys by train but the train company have changed the rules on carrying bikes so that looks less likely

I avoid public transport for a number of reasons, but the main one is inconvenience. I might endure a noisy bus to go into town, but I prefer to use the car to get to work. Buses where I am are expensive and not reliable. I also generally drive on a Friday as going home this way is more pleasant than sharing the train with noisy hen/stag parties on their way to the main city where the train heads. Aside from that though, I dont mind trains when they run on time, and people aren't shit faced etc, but they are so expensive...I think the cost of public transport is so high. I don't know about you lot but a significant chunk of my salary goes on petrol or train tickets depending on what I opt for that day. Fortunately I have a permit for my place of work so I dont have to pay to park (although getting a space in the first place can be a little 'Battle Royale...'

The issue is private car motoring is being subsidised and the cost of public transport is rising

www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2014/12/09/the-war-on-the-motorist-is-a-myth

If you track back to 1983 a packet of cigarettes and a gallon of petrol we’re about the same price.

If a litre of petrol had risen at the same rate as a packet of cigarettes it would cost £2.22 but fuel has been frozen since around 2010

Think we need some radical thinking on public transport. As councils push ahead with their local plans, roads will become more congested.

London has 12 miles of segregated cycle paths that apparently no one would use, and then no one would use in the wet and no one would use in the winter.. but they do

My car recently died, so I've been walking and using public transport.

My petrol is usually about £90 per month, plus cost of car, which was 7.5k when I bought it, so £1.5k per year. Plus tax, mot, insurance, repairs.. So probably no change out of £3,000 pa.

My bus fares add up to £600 per annum.

I'm seriously thinking about not replacing the car until closer to winter. Winters here (far north of Scotland) are very unpleasant, and I do often have to walk close a mile to the bus stop, depending on which bus I can get. So a car will be very appreciated then!

Timewise I lose out, the journey is about 20 minutes longer than driving, and if I have to walk to the further away bus stop then that's another 20 minutes. But I'm making progress on some audio books, it gives me thinking time and I'm more active, which is a bonus.

I hate driving and would much rather get public transport, but travelling in the car saves me so much time.

I used to get the bus sometimes in my last job. On the way home I had a five minute walk to the bus stop, a 20 minute wait for the bus, 25 minute journey to the next bus station, where I’d usually miss my connecting bus by a few minutes so another 25 minute wait, and another 20 minute journey followed by a five minute walk. About 1 hour 40 minutes in total. It takes half an hour in the car.

I’d love to get public transport but I love having an extra hour with my children in the evening more.

I commute to/from a rural area. If there was a form of public transport that was a) cheap (a bus return is about £7 whereas petrol would be less than £4), b) frequent enough to be convenient and c) near the place in the rural area that I need to go (the nearest bus stop is two miles away on unlit, unpavemented main roads) then yeah, I'd do it. Far better to be able to sit with a book than the bother of driving.

But there isn't, so I don't. Rural bus services have been decimated in my lifetime (I'm not that old and can remember proper bus services too/from the villages - nowadays a rusting sign is the only indicator that there was ever a bus stop around) so there is no convenient, affordable or safe option but to drive.

There are buses that you can pop your bike on the front etc, so you cycle to the bus stop, both get on the bus and then hop off at your stop. If other countries can get this so right why can’t the uk that has illegal levels of pollution

Have to agree regrettably. It shouldn't be this way but it is. It's a PITA to travel by bus in my town, and also expensive. It would take me an hour and a quarter (75 minutes) to get to work by bus (Around 4 miles!) factoring in the walk to the bus stop from my house, the walk to work from the bus stop at the other end, and one change (which I would have to wait 10 minutes for.) But it's not just that; as I said, it costs a lot too.

I can drive that distance (to work) in TEN MINUTES - 15 max. I usually cycle it which takes about 25 minutes. Good for my health and fitness AND for the environment. And free (apart from the initial outlay of £120 for my bike!)

I live rurally, very little bud service, only goes to closest city, no where near my work. Also finish early in the day last bus 5pm. Trains only in the nearest town. Plus I work in community nursing and a car is needed for that if I’m to get the huge amount of visits done in my work hours

We decided to catch the bus into town last weekend instead of driving. We live in a village about 3 miles from the town we wanted to get to, it takes about 15 minutes on the (once an hour) bus.

The cost for return tickets for me, dh & 2dc was over £20

We'll drive next time.

Also in the "I live rurally, what fucking public transport" category.

Our village has a bus every 2 hours which goes to the nearest small town, from where there is another 2 hourly bus to a bigger town that has a train station/hospital/jobcentre. Obviously these buses don't coordinate so you arrive just after the bus onward has left and have to find something to do for 2 hours before the next one. This means that an appointment in the bigger town will take about 4 hours to travel to, when you include the waiting time. It's only 21 miles away, and takes me 30 minutes by car as it's along a dual carriageway (obviously the bus doesn't go on the dual carriageway, it goes through every village in between and takes nearly 1.5 hours).

7 hour round trip (it 'only' takes 3 hours to get home as theres a shorter wait for the connecting bus). Let that sink in. 8 hours to go 21 miles on public transport.

So obviously we all drive.

No choice here as there are no buses

Oh yeah and I drive my DS to school. He has SN and goes to a school 5 miles away. The journey by bus costs us nearly £15 a day (2 adult returns at £5.60 each, plus one child return at £3). The bus there in the morning means we have to leave the house 40 minutes earlier than if going by car, then arrive at school 30 minutes before going in time. DS has autism and ADHD so waiting around is an issue. Then to get home it's either collect him 10 minutes early and run for the bus, or collect him on time and wait (in a village that has nothing, no cafe, nowhere to wait in comfort) for 1 hour 45 minutes for the next bus.

So twice a day I drive the school run. I hate doing it. I'd love to do it by bus, but it's just not practical at all.

The rural bus service here has become more expensive yet goes through less villages. My daughter gets the public bus to school and it often either doesn’t stop or or is late and she gets to school late.

Buses are also expensive here. Taking a family can cost close to £20 each way! The last bus is about 6pm so when I would be tempted to use them - to go to town for a night out so I can have a drink - they aren’t even running. Taxis cost about £25 from home to town each way.

Needless to say, I won’t be choosing to rely on buses unless they have a massive overhaul around here.

Oh yes and the last bus anywhere from our village is at 6.40pm. You have to leave the nearest big town or city (both 20 odd miles away) by 3pm to get home by public transport.

I didn’t learn to drive til I was 34. I had years of frustrating commutes - a 15 minute drive to work took two buses and an hour to complete. I’m a teacher and taking sets of books home to mark was difficult. The buses were unreliable and I had to be at the bus stop at 6.40am to ensure I wasn’t relying on the bus that would get me to work on time as it would frequently never turn up, so I had to go in extremely early.

Taking my children around when they were one toddler and one baby was awkward and stressful on buses. Things like going swimming were virtually impossible when it came to the logistics of transporting bags, buggy and children especially when I needed to fold the buggy on the bus. I have spent so many hours of my life waiting for buses I cannot even imagine.

Having a car has changed my life immeasurably in terms of how much easier everything is. But now I live only 1.5 miles from work and I feel terrible that I take the car on such a short journey. It would be better for my health and the environment to walk. But I have such a tight time schedule when I finish work and have to pick up my children that there is simply not time for me to walk - I have to drive or I wouldn’t be physically able to make it to them on time.

I always wonder about cycling as I would hate to arrive at work sweaty; would I need a change of clothes? I’m also scared to cycle - no cycle lanes near me and I don’t think it would be safe.

I think that radical changes to the way people live will have to take place. Currently, car ownership is ingrained into the fabric and routine of most of our lives and society is set up to make it that way.

With everything I read about climate change, I think a massive shift is going to be forced upon us when there is absolutely no choice left. At the moment, making individual changes is difficult and demanding and so most people won’t do it. I think the culture of work, presenteeism, lengthy and draining hours etc that we have means that people are often under a lot of stress and are generally exhausted. Making their lives worse by quadrupling their commute time and leaving them at the mercy of buses that never turn up, overcrowded trains, waiting endlessly in the driving rain and everything else that public transport entails - is not a choice most people are going to make freely. In the end, I think it is going to take a lot of disasters to force any kind of major change.

My journey to work by car takes 10 mins. By bus, two buses and 45 mins. I know which one I'm choosing...

Yup! If I drive to work it’s 25 mins door to desk.
If I get public transport (have had to on occasion), it’s an hour and not a direct journey which is why it takes so long.
I would love to use public transport if it was feasible.