Amber Rudd

[sue51]

I'm seeking to understand the differences between the terms “coloured women” and “women of colour”. They sound intrinsically similar but they may well be different, and a web search didn’t help in defining the difference.

The first term was used by Amber Rudd yesterday, and she quickly apologised as it had caused offence, but was still under criticism in the main national news. If a term is offensive then it’s right that it isn’t used, and where it has been used that should be the subject of an apology.

However, the term “women of colour” was used on Radio 4 this morning, and a review of the play Richard II at the Sam Wannamaker Playhouse by the Guardian’s Michael Billington prominently used the term “women of colour”, and one would have thought, given the Guardian’s credentials, that the term would not be used if it was likely to cause offence.

So, and asked in all sincerity, can anyone explain the difference between these two terms, and why one is deemed to be offensive while the other is apparently not? I would be mortified if I used a term which caused offence to someone but am genuinely curious about the difference in this case.

Queer has been appropriated by the LGBT community though. I was quite taken aback by a gay friend’s Christmas jumper which had a depiction of a stag and the slogan “Oh deer, I’m queer”.*

Absolutely. I have a dear friend who refers to himself as ‘queer’ but I’m not so I don’t use it.

Amber Rudd isn't fighting for the right to say coloured though is she? She's apologised and admitted she shouldn't have said it.

She should know better really, in her position, but she would have been brought up to use that term.

Language evolves, but sometimes we get stuck or slip up.

It doesn't necessarily make you a racist or mean that you would treat somebody differently.

I’m just so surprised she didn’t know it was an offensive term. She clearly does live in a white Tory bubble.

She’s not a anyone’s Auntie Amber who gets her words wrong. She is a senior politician who has presumably had extensive media training. It was unforgivable.

What lesson has Amber Rudd learned? Not to use the term she used but also that next time instead of trying to highlight the abuse related to women on a racial ground that she is safer just saying nothing.

I hate it when people cry "PC gawwwnnn mad" as an excuse to be unpleasant about people.

I do think Amber Rudd made a genuine mistake with no malice intended.

I wasn’t aware that what she said was wrong but then I wasn’t brought up in a multi racial area.

“Not to use the term she used but also that next time instead of trying to highlight the abuse related to women on a racial ground that she is safer just saying nothing.”

Well, if she is incapable of monitoring her language she is safer saying nothing!

All the speech writers and advisors on the planet can’t affect a live, think on your feet interview. She made a mistake and she’s apologised. I haven’t heard but has Dianne Abbott had the grace to accept the apology?

Someone of her standing should not be making mistakes like that. It would not occur to me to ever use that term let alone a politician on national radio.

“I wasn’t aware that what she said was wrong but then I wasn’t brought up in a multi racial area“

Do you live in an area with no newspapers, books, television, radio? Do you have no intellectual curiosity?

“has Dianne Abbott had the grace to accept the apology?”
Any reason why she should?

Also Cape coloured is a distinct ethnic group in SA, being people of mixed descent incorporating Indian, malaysian, european and african heritages.

Ideally, yes. Because Dianne Abbott has never, ever made a mistake in a radio interview, has she? Only it’s numbers she can’t get right.

“Diane”

And there is a huge difference between making a mistake with the figures -a work mistake, if you like- and using a word that has been widely unacceptable for maybe 20 years - a social/courtesy mistakez

My understanding is that "coloured" was always a pejorative term in US whereas in U.K. it was (in the 70s?) considered to be more polite than referring to someone as "black". That fell out of favour and now most black people I know in U.K. prefer to be referred to as "black".

In the US I find black colleagues prefer to be termed as a "person of colour" or "African American". So I think language varies depending on location.

No politician in U.K. should be referring to anyone as "coloured". I did wonder if AR meant to refer to her as "a person of colour" and stumbled over terminology. But maybe I'm being over generous.

I was listening to radio 5 this morning, one guest (an academic) gave an explanation which I didn't fully understand about why one was right and one was offensive, a little while later another guest (a politician) said he wasn't bothered and was happy to be called either.

I assume both guests were people of colour, there doesn't appear to be a concensus so imo it's understandable that some people are confused.

Yes, there is a huge difference between being the shadow Home Secretary and broadcasting that you’re basically innumerate and using one word of outdated terminology in defence of a fellow MP. Honestly @Bertrand being so unforgivingly right on must be exhausting.

It was unforgivable

Do you mean that in absolute sense? Can Amber Rudd literally never make amends?

Language evolves and what might have been acceptable once can bite you on the arse in the future, as we now see daily with trial by twitter

Happy to talk about Diane Abbot’s blunders. But that’s not what this thread is about. Would it have been worse if Rudd had called her “coloured” if she had never for anything wrong on radio/telly?

The thing about Rudd’s language is that I don’t think it is the sort of thing you say “by mistake” I think you would only say “coloured” if that was the word you used in your head, and only used “black” in public discourse because you have been told that’s the PC way.

The word 'colour' in reference to black people is clearly not offensive or racist since black people have approved the term 'person of colour' so I'm confused also why 'coloured', which is a variation of 'colour' is offensive.

I also don't like calling all non whites black, many are not black at all. Equally, I don't like how people are classed as 'white' as unless you're very fair and living in the highlands of Scotland, this is unlikely.

We should move away from describing or grouping people into any colours at all.

We are all human beings, all equal in this day and age and always should have been, end of.

I think Amber Rudd was clumsy and I bet she's very regretful about it but it does certainly infer that she is very comfortable and used to using 'coloured' as the description for black people.

“I'm confused also why 'coloured', which is a variation of 'colour' is offensive.“
There have been many helpful explanations on this thread.

So we’re now the thought police. That’s a bit too Orwellian for me.

@CallMeRachel

Did you actually read any of the other posts?