To ask how people get these jobs.

[Ecriture]

I'm over 30, I come from a working class background.

I grew up with a mum on benefits single parent, 3 kids.

I tried though.

I went to iffy poly uni and got a crap degree (2:2) because I worked three jobs just to stay on the course.

It's not been easy but I've been willing to work as hard as it takes to make a life for myself unlike my childhood.

However, in the past 7 years I'm working I've barely scratched the surface and I am only on 25 grand and still at the bottom of the pile.

Today I had to attend a meeting where 60% of people present were some type of chief officer, cfo or head of major departments.

They all seem to have very distinguished careers and have attractive salaries way beyond my own.

My question is this how did they get there?

A lot of women on this site also seem to be high earners with lots of responsibility.

Does one have to be born into a wealthy family, know the right people or go to the best university. I have none of this.

Can hard work actually get you anywhere in life?

Am I destined to spend the rest of my life doing a low paid work despite my ambitions?

Am I being unreasonable do you think that someone from my background could ever rise higher?

Can anyone give me any advice about what I can do or how they progress in the phone their own career?

OP was talking about how people get into C level roles , not middle managers on 40 and 50k.

That said OP. A lot of CEOs do come from a very small stock , public school educated etc

Sure there are some heads of department who have done well but I'd say CEOs for the most part are groomed to be CEOs. But yes there are some who've networker their way to the top through sheer determination and deep sense of belief in themselves

I feel similar, and similar background. My mum worked very hard for not very much.
I'm an EA supporting four directors, I make £24k a year - in London.
I've been studying in the evenings for 4 years for a BSc, I've now been offered a place on a graduate scheme (Civil Service) when I graduate later this year. I feel like I'm finally getting a grasp on the ladder and I'm almost 30.

Does one have to be born into a wealthy family, know the right people or go to the best university. I have none of this.
I had a working class upbringing (or it would have been if there was any work, to quote the Commitments) father on the dole in 80s/90s NW England, mum worked PT in a factory. I went to the local comp then the local 6th form college. By the time I left for Uni at 18, 50% of the girls in my class already had kids. So there was no culture or expectation. I did get mostly As and study law at a RG Uni. I borrowed heavily to do this and was c.£20k in debt by the time I started work. It took until I was 30 to pay it off.

Can hard work actually get you anywhere in life?
It can get you most places, but it needs to have focus.

Am I destined to spend the rest of my life doing a low paid work despite my ambitions?
There is only one person who can change that...

Am I being unreasonable do you think that someone from my background could ever rise higher?
Yes you are being unreasonable, stop focusing on your background! (It's not where you're from, it's where you're at. Don't look back that's not the way you are going)

Can anyone give me any advice about what I can do or how they progress in the phone [?] their own career?
You need a target to aim at, an area you are good at that you can progress in. You need to know what your ultimate target is and what the route is for getting there.
Think about what you can do and what you do have, stop focusing on what you don't have and haven't done.

I'd also add that I absolutely don't think jobs are about "who you know". I've never landed a role because of who I know. What I think does come into play is confidence, how you present yourself (which ties into how you speak and dress - I'm not saying you need to be the full RP and couture, but well-spoken (and I don't mean a non-regional accent, just clear, articulate and confident) and well-dressed goes a long way when first impressions count for so much) and how you comport yourself.

Agree about Beth Rigby @yolofish . She's really underrated. Amazing journalist

Hi OP

I am from one of the poorest areas in the country and come from a working class background. I left school at 16 and got a job as that was what was expected. However, I went to night school and got the qualifications to go to University. I got a 2.1 and afterwards did a professional qualification (think law/accountancy that type of thing) and specialised. I have worked extremely hard (no 9 to 5...) and through a matter of hard graft, studying, being useful and the colleague the company wants to have around I am earning a lot - well in excess of £100k. It did not come easy though

With a solid basis in admin roles i would be looking at the next move being around the £30-35,000 mark.

Administration manager in a university, civil service, charity, local council

School business manager is an interesting and varied role often advertised at around £30k eteach.com is a good website for school roles

If you have strong organisational skills what about a prince 2 qualification and project management

If you are analytical and process oriented then a Business Analyst role may be good.

Look at large charities who often advertise roles via LinkedIn or direct on their websites and don't rely on jobs websites, seek out companies local to you and go direct.

Bid writing is a role that i see in my sector a lot, not reliant on specific qualifications, more the skills of being able to write in a compelling way and pull together knowledge from the right people.

Work out what your skills are, look at a variety of jobs or contact somewhere like the National Careers Service to see if they can guide you in the right direction.

For internal progression the most valuable tools i have used are

• Know your business inside out, talk to other teams, follow processes through so you can see how they work across different teams
• DO NOT whinge and moan, if there is a problem, identify the right person and take them a solution. Make it positive, sell the improvement and show them why they will benefit.
• Work smarter, if a process/policy/system isnt working find a way to.bring efficiency. Above almost anything, the people who.make the big decisions in any company want cost saving and higher productivity.

Someone said gravitas, apparently I have that, I only wish I could define it! The other thing is positivity, negative people are tiresome, draining and an absolute pain to work with. My least favourite thing is “Oh we tried, but ...”

For me hard work got me where I am.
I done my degree at 23, started at the bottom in my company and worked my way up.
The key to my success was being reliable, hardworking and always willing to do that little bit more BUT don't be a push over.. I've had some disagreements with my employers, but i stay respectful and within professional boundaries. I found my employer actually liked that I stood up for myself. Be strong and confident.. I'm currently studying for my masters while on maternity leave which was always my plan.
You won't get anywhere in life if your floating through your days waiting for things to happen.
If you want a higher salary, chase it. It'll rarely get handed to you.. even if you deserve it

Namechanger22 if you've been asking for a payrise for 16 years and haven't got it the either:

• You're already at maximum pay for the role and theres no scope for increase

Or

• The company you work for know that they don't have to give you any more money and you'll stay in the role doing everything you're doing

Or

• You havent demonstrated through action or words that your performance is worth more.

iboogy yes I think Beth Rigby is fab! very good journalist, and completely doesnt sound the part (to ref earlier comments). she always seems to cut through the crap, and has her ear to the ground.

@Lwmommy Just because someone is good at admin/organising stuff doesn't mean that s/he will be a good PM! PMs need to know the industry they work in and be knowledgeable about a lot of things not just prince2 or agile or the other latest buzzword.
I work in Senior Project/Programme Management + as a Business Analyst and have seen so many really bad PMs who thought that it's just some organising stuff.... It's not!
(don't know about OP, so not directed at her)
I would suggest though maybe looking at Project Admin roles. There you need to have much less knowledge of how PM things work, but is an easier way to learn the PM stuff as well.

BA: it's not that easy, again. Although if you want to look into it search ISEB qualifications and training material to see if it would fit. It can be very rewarding (great, awesome and such :) ), but it takes a lot of learning and practice to be good at it.

I'm from a working class background in a backwater part of the Midlands. I just got lucky by being good at exams and getting into a good uni and a professional career. I haven't exactly been adventurous but I've progressed to middle management, could have done more but had family instead!

MTGgirl, no offence was intended i just wanted to give some variety of job roles to demonstrate that experience in admin roles can be used to moved into other distinct roles that use some of those skills.

I see too.many people who pigeon hole themselves and will stay in the same roles for decades because they can't see how transferable their skills are.

Early 40s here grew up on council estate, father hardly worked, mum worked cleaner/dinner lady, left home at 17, worked low paid jobs did an access course in evenings, went to uni in 20s now working full time earning 60k. It can be done, I have worked long hours and put myself forward for everything since qualifying (2.1) only in the last few years do I feel like I've reached a decent responsibility / salary level.

I grew up with a dad who never, and I mean ever, take holidays or have a day off sick in 40 years and a mum who worked 3 jobs. I think that gave me a very strong work ethic. I had my DD young so I missed out on uni but I made sure I did some study. I did get ok grades at school but didn't apply myself and just wanted to work. I took the first full time job that was offered and stayed with them for 5 years until I found a niche. Then self funded a diploma to get into that field, got qualified then started mapping out a very defined career plan in a progression of industries and stuck to it. Religiously.

It's meant that I've had to work in different places and at the time, it wasn't easy for my daughter to be moved every 2 years. I sacrificed time with her, taking on bigger jobs, taking on a MSc but I think it was worth it. It afforded me a life where I could give her a helping hand and it showed her the importance of keeping skills fresh, keeping options open and not to let moss grow. She's now on a very good salary for her age in IT.

I think my drive, keenness to keep my knowledge current, confident in my field, objective driven attitude has meant I can command high salaries in jobs that I can walk into. The longest I've been unemployed is 2 weeks. It comes with its drawbacks though. I burn out after 2 years, get itchy feet and I'm very self critical.

I think the key is to have a goal, stick to it regardless how tough it gets; there's been times where I've cried with exhaustion, frustration and guilt. Self funding is tough going and it can take years for it to pay off, if it ever does. I was lucky, took some risks and they paid off. Being flexible is a gamble but again, it paid off for me.

Well privilege gave many anhead start in life. Watch this video:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=4K5fbQ1-zps

Those who are from wealthy families, those who get grammar or independent schooling, those who went to first class universities, they would have all found it easier.

The place you live also has an impact on the oppprtunities available, and the salary paid.

There is the matter of personal characteristics- some people are just able to push themselves that bit more. Adaptability and ambition, confidence, leadership skills, sheer bloody mindedness, and raw talent, all will very from person to person.

As in the video, even those who start at the back of the race can move to the front, and so can you. But it might take you longer, you might have to make more sacrifices, you might have to take more risks, it won’t be easy. But it’s not imppssjble.

@Lwmommy no offence taken :) It's just me overreacting.

I think there are people who are very capable and competent and this is underscored with confidence. I think confidence is the key whether that comes from knowing you are good because you really are or it having been instilled in you due to your background.

On the other hand there are people like Chris Grayling who either don’t realise or don’t care that they’re not good. There’s an arrogance in assuming they should be in top positions. My manager is a case in point. He is shit at his job. He bluffs and blusters his way through. He says things then flatly denies it when it doesn’t suit his agenda anymore. There is a band 7 where I work who is chronically incapable of making a decision or taking responsibility for anything. I couldn’t be in that job, I would feel too much of a fraud.

I worry about this. I am not a confident and capable person. I don’t think I can ever do a job which means having to train or supervise. I just don’t have it in me. I lack the confidence, I have anxiety.

I can't put my finger on it, was as thick as mince at school. Dropped out of uni. Parents sent me on a posh secretarial course and then to finishing school.

Expected to do flowers and/or directors' lunches. Went to Cornwall with a naice young man for the w/e. Went to dinner with the family's yachtie friends, said I needed a job and a middle aged man gave me his card and told me to ring him up Monday.

I did. He gave me a job as a secretary to "young bloods". I took a lot of shit, put bets on, laughed and found I was good at drafting and adding. Not because of a Modern degree from a modern university but because I was well educated. I flirted. With the toffs and the barrow boys.

But, do you know what? I was never late, never rude, never arsy. Also I paid attention to detail. So they encouraged me to join the syndicate desk and worked even harder. So they let me start selling. So I worked harder.

I gave up that career at 35. I had a house, a nice car, a fab wardrobe and wanted babies.

And when they went to school I atarted another career. And smiled and worked really hard and got prof quals and took shed loads of shit.

I don't know why it worked twice but suspect as someone else said confidence and gravitas helped. I have no idea why but I can "own" a room. I have a lovely mastery trill of "how lovely".
I am also perceived as very very calm.

And I should have added have felt a massive imposter since the day I started work. V v senior people ask me for advice and even now I think "oh fuck; why me". And then think okaaay, so we need to get to x, what's legal, what's contactually possible, shall I just meet - tell the truth and say this is where we are, x was a cock up, this is a potential solution. That's what it boils down to. It's called calculated risk.

My advice: stand up straight, smile, work hard, be nice (keep your views to yourself) and be early.

I didn't come from a poor background but my parents worked in care and social services. I was expected to go to uni but no advice on corporate or even office work meant I chose a terrible arts degree got a 2:2.
No thought/idea/help for what to do after. Ended up working terrible jobs on max of £12k till I was 30. Managed to get onto a MA course.
Then moved IT I worked all over London contracting on anything from £275-650 when I started to when I left London. Moved down south a few years ago. Applied for many similar jobs here. Took my 3years to get a similar job here. Worked in care and retail before I started. Started an MSc.
1 year ago I got my new job. I applied to the same company 10 times in 3 years. Finally got a job. Now I've moved from a small to one of their most important projects.
Now I did that by being helpful willing to take/help with anything. Also I've never expected to be treated differently from any man. I'm assertive and confident. I have experience on my side and have worked for top global companies. I treat everyone the same nice, polite and friendly from the CEO to the cleaners. I work for a great company who will promote staff who work hard and achieve the best possible for the company between 9-5.

5 years ago I felt like you OP. I don't have a degree, came from a single parent, council estate background and had absolutely no idea how to progress up the ladder. No one in my family had ever done it (mostly self-employed tradespeople) and I had zero connections.

What worked for me was finding an area I wanted to work in and focusing on that, plus a fair bit of luck. As admin, I was ten a penny, but I managed to get an entry level job in an engineering firm 3 years ago. I saved as much as I could and paid for lots of training in systems, continual improvement and auditing. I have gone from 23k when I started as a document controller to 50k as a systems engineer when I start my new job next week. In the 3 years, I've moved roles 3 times (twice as internal promotions, which is where the luck comes in). Each time was a little more money and responsibility than the last.

The key things are to be confident, don't be afraid to say you don't know and don't be afraid to say when you do know. People who are not afraid to have opinions and are willing to put themselves out there seem to get furthest, I find. Whether those opinions are right or wrong, it's the attitude and initiative that matter.

It also depends where you live to how far salary goes. 25k in north of England will get you a heck of a lot more than the midlands/south

Thanks everyone. I have a lot to think about and will reply back in the morning.