1st time at Magistrates Court

[Nothininmenoggin]

Posting for traffic here so hope some magistrates or lawyers can answer this. My son is due at magistrates for backchatting a BT policeman and riding his bike on the platform, he didn't realise you couldn't do this and platform was empty at time and he had literally seconds to get on train.
Unfortunately he has a spent sentence which he received as a youth just wondering if the magistrate will be told of this when he appears before him and if so do they take previous convictions into account. He has turned his life around since youth conviction I'm just scared this will hamper his chances of the career he wants to pursue in the armed forces. He has written a letter pleading guilty to the court and is genuinely sorry. He is worried that the magistrate will be convinced he is a bad person because of the past.

My advice would be to get a solicitor's advice, phone round for someone who deals with minor transgressions by youths. It sounds trivial but he needs to know how to conduct himself in court, dress smartly and if, like many people do, use the term FO tell him to make a conscious effort to stop. Get the letter approved by the solicitor, don't know if he's entitled to be legally represented.

I hope you're worrying over nothing serious but I would be in your shoes. Good luck.

Whatever he does, tell him to show respect in the court and keep his mouth firmly shut.

Have you also explained to him that it’s illegal to ride a bike on the platform because it is bloody dangerous?

He sounds like a loose cannon! None of us are perfect though, and teenagers are evil little shits (some of them!) Hats off to any parents who have gone through that stage (with girls OR boys.)

They probably will take into account his last misdemeanour, but as a pp said, he is hardly a hardened vicious criminal.

He wants to go into the armed forces though? With a temperament like he has? Is he going to be able to take orders? Be yelled at without punching someone? He needs some lessons in being calm, and behaving like an adult. Sorry OP, but he is behaving like a 12 y.o. brat, not an adult who is wanting to join the armed services!

Tell him if he screws up again after this, you will wash your hands of him, and he's on his own.

Hope he just gets a massive bollocking and a caution.

Keep us updated. And try not to worry. In the scheme of things, you could have a MUCH worse son.

for backchatting a BT policeman and riding his bike on the platform

Those are two very different things. Has he been charged with two different offences?

If it's just riding his bike on the platform then that's just the Railway Byelaws and it's a fine for that. I don't know what the fine would be.

"backchatting a policeman" What, are they going after him under Section 5, Public Order Act?

If so then you really should make sure that he is properly represented in court and he doesn't just go in and plead guilty.

he was 17 and got a 12 month youth referral order

Can I ask what the conviction was for last time - and what exactly he's been charged with this time, come to that? Given the pattern here, I'm wondering if he really is just "gobby" or if there's something more?

Fairenuff and Kneehigim the charges are Section 5&6 Of the Public Order Act and Byelaw 15&24 Of the Railway Byelaws. Thanks to all of you who gave supportive, factual and considered replies. We have tried our very best as parents, he comes from a good family unfortunately we cannot choose his friends who shall we just say would not be my choice. But for those of you with teens it's so bloody hard trying to get them to see what you see. HoppityFrog3 yes you could say he is defo a loose cannon needs to mature and not be so impulsive and reactive. I've said also about being shouted at and given orders in forces how would he react?? As you say he is hardly a hardened criminal though but you know you just want a good life for them.

I work with Magistrates and yes they will be told of his previous once he has pleaded guilty. Magistrates sentencing in accordance with sentencing guidelines so you can look on the sentencing council's guidelines for the offence your son has been charged with to get an idea of the likely sentence.

Bellaposey Thank you so much for replying to me. He is due in court next month. I will let him know this and hopefully a lesson will be learnt or he will just carry on ruining his life chances.

He’s pleaded guilty. That is the verdict. So it’s only about sentencing now. Therefore yes they will have access to his record because the verdict is done and dusted.

If he thought he was still waiting for the verdict then perhaps he should have pleaded not guilty? But he’s admitted the charges now. Sorry OP.

He will go to court and the charges will be read out. He will be asked if he pleaded guilty or not guilty.

Following a guilty plea, the prosecutor will outline the details of the case and ask for costs. They will inform the court of your sons previous convictions, but also remind the magistrates to reduce their penalty by 1/3 due to your sons early admission of guilt.

Your son will then get a chance to say anything he wants to the magistrates. He should accept the facts, apologise wholeheartedly, and explain what sentence he would like, and why. For example, I think (but I might be mistaken) that the forces would accept someone who had received a fine, but not a community penalty. (Though he’d be wise to check this out first). He can also explain his previous offence and what he’s done to change his life since, and his remorse at his behaviour this time.

If he is given a fine, it will be based on his earnings.

He should refer to the magistrates as ‘your worships’ or ‘sir/ma’am’ (whichever is the one in the middle) and anyone else in court as sir or ma’am.

Fettucinecarbonara Thank you so much for your detailed reply it has helped a lot to know exactly what will happen and how to address the magistrate and officers of the court. As I've said before thank you so much for the factual and supportive answers everyone. It's good to know that most posters are happy to provide helpful and constructive advice rather than some who seem to gain pleasure from making glib comments and giving non helpful advice.

Say for e.g. I hit a boy, but there are no witnesses.

Said boy goes to police, makes a complaint, I'm called in for questioning.
If I plead guilty, police don't have to do much more really (only in certain circumstances). Because the verdict is guilty (because I've said I was) - they don't have to prove that I was if you get me?
Sentencing is the next bit, and his guilty plea will likely gain him a very lenient slap on the wrist. Pleading guilty gains you a lesser sentence as in severe cases, it saves the witness(es) being cross examined. In more minor cases, it saves court time.
Did your son have any legal representation at all? I presume he was arrested, held in a cell etc., given an interview with a solicitor present?
There are some solicitors who are detail oriented. So they'll notice one thing wrong in dates/times and manage to get it thrown out of court.

Are you leaving him with the duty solicitor?
He has pleaded guilty now, so I guess, all he can do is plead for mercy and apologise (profusely). If the magistrates see that he is contrite, they will go easier on him.

It's not going to be a custodial sentence as you know, but his solicitor can argue that he has ambitions to join the armed forces, and I've seen them dismiss cases on this basis.
But he needs to look on this as the be all and end all of his future with the armed forces.

It's not going to affect him getting onto the Forces (unless there's strong competition in an oversubscribed trade). They'll sort out the gobby teenager problem pretty quickly though! Or not. In which case he'll be back home doing wheelies on platform 2, telling plod to Jeff off in no time at all.

Kneehigim No he wasn't arrested he was given the chance to take a fine by the British transport policeman whilst still on the platform but he was gobby said no and the policeman said well in that case you can go to court. We received the summons to court 2 weeks ago. We went to see a solicitor in town she said due to the minor nature it'll just be a fine nothing else. He can't get legal aid she said not for this sort of offence as non custodial. I knew nothing about this until the letter arrived in the post 2 weeks ago he didn't tell us what had happened. The event occurred in Nov last year. He intends to plead guilty as yes he did cycle on the platform and yes he did swear at a policeman. Son told me policeman grabbed his arm to take him off the bike. I'm not interested in that whether he did or not he should gave got off bike when asked then none of this would be going on. He has written a letter of apology also so will see what happens next month.Iseesheepthat made me smile let's hope he gets in and they sort his gobbiness out. I know to some this sounds like I'm droning on and on but it's been a very difficult few years since joining college and his friendship choice I just want a bit of peace for him and us.

Whatever happens in court or for future job applications, he should count himself lucky that there was a copper there to grab him in the first place.

The aftermath of somebody toppling over on their bike onto the tracks, even before the 10.57 rolls in, is absolutely horrific.

I feel very sorry for you, less sorry for him I'm afraid. Yes his previous record will be disclosed, and its quite recent too (its pretty petty stuff, so I would be more concerned about his telling a police officer to F Off - how on earth is he going to cope with being in the Forces if thats his attitude...). Why on earth behave like this if you want to join the Forces? Hes not a child any more..Genuinely hope it goes ok and he grows up!

Thanks Purplecatshopaholic believe you and me so do I.

I was present at a case where a young girl (about 18 also) had been caught smoking marijuana or similar. She was utterly contrite, scared, sobbing quietly etc. The magistrate said that given her guilty plea and the fact that she had no previous, he was not going to be the one to ruin her chance of ever travelling to the US or Australia in the future, so he dropped the case entirely, whilst giving her a stern stripping down. I thought it was nice of him and until then, I hadn't been aware that they had that power.
You never know, if he is actually sorry, it will probably be fairly obvious to a magistrate. Please ask the solicitor to ensure she states his ambition to join the forces, and his fear of the current repercussions of his actions. They might very well go really easy on him. I've also seen cases where say for e.g. the magistrate will ask how much money they have with them now. It will go in his favour if he has a job of some description and is willing to hand over his hard earned wages immediately (magistrates seem to like things to be over and done with on the day - or maybe it was just a particularly quirky one that I was observing!).
It's a harsh lesson alas, but I suppose the officer in question on the day had no way of knowing whether your ds was a future hoodlum or a generally decent sort of chap, so they can be quite unforgiving.

Sent you a PM OP @Nothininmenoggin

He'll probably get a fine and or community service at most
He needs to worry about his record though.
And to learn a lesson!

I would again advise employing a solicitor to speak on his behalf. It will ease the stress of appearing in court, feeling intimidated, and potentially saying the wrong thing.

Clearly a very quiet day on the railways. I'd have thought that British Transport police had to deal with far more serious matters than rude teens riding bikes on empty platforms. Even though he's got previous I really don't think a magistrate is going to throw the book at him, it's really minor stuff despite the pearl clutching on here. The Armed Forces will soon deal with dissent!

Also agree about getting a solicitor involved. Well worth the money.

While he isn't entitled to legal aid, he is entitled to legal representation.