Friend committing benefit fraud

[namechange091]

Name changed.

A close friend is pregnant. She's living with her parents and her DP although claiming that he doesn't live there and pays minimum maintenance.

She's getting money for being a lone parent and he's also earning almost £2k a month and they have £50 a month rent to pay.

AIBU to be so angry about this?!
I keep getting temptations to dob her in but feel like it's immoral as a friend!

There’s always threads in mumsnet about “friends” committing benefit fraud and the rage it causes and everyone yelling “report them!!”
Why is there no rage at the real cause of society’s problems, the tax breaks given to the rich, the loop holes, the offshore accounts? The ever increasing MP’s salary? The selling off of public assets?
Benefit fraud is not good at all but it is not the biggest problem by a long stretch.

Warped galaxy

Whilst I agree that DWP should make people fully aware of their entitlements and pay back pay for claims that take a long time (thought they did with PIP and ESA), there is no reason to have to do that BEFORE tackling benefit fraud.

They should ensure people get what they are entitled to whilst also ensuring no-one gets what they aren't entitled to.

Incidentally how do you know it is only a tiny percentage who are claiming fraudulently?

Yes we do all lose out. But benefit fraud is so much less than people think, (see diagram above) but you only have to look on these threads to see how much people fixate about it. I've never seen a thread where someone suspects their neighbour of not paying enough tax and threatens to dob them in.
Its generally seen as much more socially acceptable to defraud the tax man. Heroic even. I know a few wealthy people who are proud of the fact that they manage to avoid tax, including one who keeps her money in diamonds hidden in her house. But she is the first one to start moaning about scroungers over her very expensive lunch.
I really hate the instinct to kick people when they are down just so we can show how much better we are than them.
If we want a fair society, lets make a fair society. If you have people who are stealing a million quid a year, why are you worried about someone why may be getting 400 quid a month that they are maybe not entitled to.
If we have to prioritise, why don't we work from the top downwards? Could it be that we are encouraged to go after benefit cheats because those at the top are hoping to distract us while they fill their boots?

@hazell42 I don't totally agree with you that we shouldn't go after benefit fraud. However, I totally get what you're saying and at the moment I would probably choose not to report someone I knew was scamming the system. I find the amount of hate spewed at people on benefits at the moment so constant and upsetting I would have no part in fueling that fire.

The truth is that the amount of money claimed fraudulently is negligible compared to the money not paid by the richest in society.

I'd love to tackle all fraud but I'm scared of the benefit hate in our society, it's truly shocking. I've seen people attacked in the street over it. My grandparents read stories about benefit fraudsters and make a game out of going into town to follow disabled people round and film them without their knowledge. It's totally sick and every fraud headline in the paper makes them more spiteful and evil.

Sorry, digressed a bit. OP I don't think you would be unreasonable to report it nor do I think you would be unreasonable not to report it for my above reasons. You have been honest with your friend so whatever you do here I think you can do it with a clear conscience.

I would question whether it is even morally wrong to scam such an unjust system.

Personally I think it's verging on immoral not to report benefit fraud, if you're certain it's happening.

If more people reported it, fewer would get away with it, and fewer would tell themselves it's easy to get away with, so wouldn't do it in the first place.

It's not as if the country is awash with taxpayer money going begging.

ShartGoblin, you are right about benefit hate. You only have to look at those awful benefit street tv programmes which have deliberately been made to be as inflammatory as possible so that people who work hard and receive nothing get upset.
If I believed the stuff on those shows I'd be upset too. But I have worked for the last 15 years on a very deprived council estate with a high level of poverty and I know that, even those few people who are scamming the system in some way, are usually doing so out of desperation or as a temporary measure (ie they get a job and don't declare it straight away) to get them over a temporary hurdle.
Every day I ask myself, would I swap places with them? Every day I say, No, I bloody wouldn't.
That seems to be the acid test to me, so I keep my gob shut and thank my lucky starts

Definitely report it. This isn't the government's money she's scamming, it's everyone who pay tax's.

You can report it but she will work out that it's you who reported her.

No wonder you name changed .

What some of you upright citizens are forgetting here is this .

OP rings and dobs her in . Investigation begins . Whilst the investigation is ongoing all benefits are stopped . Could be for many weeks or months. If its proven she is NOT frauding them , there is no backpay, no apology even . But hey, let's go after this woman on what you think ay ?

I had a 'friend' who for years claimed she was a lone parent, all the while living with her working partner, an receiving money from her ex for their son. It always astounded me that she/they were able to purchase their Council property (she did not work - except for holiday spending money, and that was never declared). Basically they were able to buy it because his earnings got them a mortgage.

They later sold the property and made a massive profit, bought a larger property and did the same. Still she did not work, other than for holiday spending money. They had the best of everything in their home, took regular holidays etc. In the meantime, my partner and I were both working and couldn't afford that proverbial pot.

They now live in a property valued at just under £1m, and it's fair to say it was all on the back of benefit fraud. By the time they were reported, they were already quids in and able to take advantage of the housing situation. She walks around lording it over everyone, when she'd have nothing if it weren't for her deceit for so many years. She got a fine and presumably a record, but was only caught out for doing fruit picking one summer - the rest of it was never discovered.

Perhaps you could give her a reality check, and remind her of how fortunate she is without breaking the law out of sheer greed. When you have her response, ask yourself if you really want to be associated with such a person.

*What some of you upright citizens are forgetting here is this .

OP rings and dobs her in . Investigation begins . Whilst the investigation is ongoing all benefits are stopped . Could be for many weeks or months. If its proven she is NOT frauding them , there is no backpay, no apology even . But hey, let's go after this woman on what you think ay ?*

I think the OP is fairly confident that she is committing fraud. Besides, if the partner is on £2k a month it isn't like they're going to starve!

Oh FFS!
Council House Envy as well now!

CoolJule43 How do I know? Well, google is my friend, and I simply googled how much is really lost to benefit fraud; how many reports of benefit fraud are actually false; how much is lost to tax evasion (that figure is around 3 times higher than benefit fraud btw), how much is underpaid and how much is overpaid in error by DWP ie not fraudulent claims but they disingenuously include their own errors in fraudulent claim figures to skew public perception.

See, while we’re all screaming ‘stop thief!’ at the shoplifter running down the street with a loaf of bread under his jacket we’re turning a blind eye to the gang robbing the bank on the corner.

I'd ignore it. You won't get a medal for being a grass and you most certainly won't see a days luck. Thousands and thousands of people commit Benefit fraud and it'll be going on for decades to come, you can't catch them all and by dobbing in your friend it won't make a slight bit of difference!

Only time I reported someone for benefit fraud was what a disabled person was being abused.
As for someone's boyfriend earning what - you cannot be 100% sure, plus boyfriends are not necessarily long term. Keep you beak out of it

WarpedGalaxy how can Google or anyone else possibly know how much is lost to benefit fraud?
If they knew with any degree of certainty, that would mean they also knew about the vast majority of cases where it's happening.
Logically they can only know about the cases which have been found out.

Just seen there's another thread going about benefit fraud! I thought it was pretty rare.

Well the MN threads certainly aren't. They normally follow this pattern...

'Friend' tells private conversation to OP about committing benefit fraud.

OP says absolutely fuck all to said 'friend'.

OP runs to MN to start a gossipy thread under the guise of asking 'Shall I report?'

Buns start to fly because some people think these threads do nothing but give legitimate benefit claimers a bad name.

I sit here thinking what a waste of fucking time. If you're going to report then just do it. No need for yet another thread about this sort of thing.

My B I L defrauded the social security system via PIPS and DLA - claimed on behalf of our niece - she lived in the most appalling conditions and lost her leg and sight due to his neglect - When he died he left an estate worth £500,000 - she will never benefit and the executors were forced to repay £10,000 to DHSS - I think such actions are indicative of a personality disorder ( unless as a previous poster had said there is dire poverty) - in most cases it’s cupidity and stupidity which incites people to commit such fraud.

My dhs Ed is terrible for this. There's been so many times he's nearly dobbed her in but hasn't due to the affect it would have on his child.

Claimed she was working 16 hours a week. Getting every benefit possible. And working cash in hand 4 days a week. £80 - £100 every week.

Dh has always paid maintenance. Wouldn't of minded if she was struggling but she's been living the high life for years. She has 4 holidays last year and went to 2 festivals. We struggle financially.

Now the latest bf has officially moved in (been together a full 3 months). Wouldn't surprise me if she hadn't informed HMRC of this.

It frustrates the hell out of me.

Completely agree with Worra if you've got an axe to grind just go on and do it no need to start threads on here.
Although I will say it never ceases to amaze me how people know what others have in their bank account i.e I could say I earnt £75,000 per annum to my mate but it would not be true and she'd never know unless she saw my bank statement

I sit here thinking what a waste of fucking time. If you're going to report then just do it. No need for yet another thread about this sort of thing

Agree...and also your point about saying nothing to 'friend' Makes me wonder what sort of friend it is that slags you off in a public forum.

If I had a friend of mine who was commuting benefit fraud but I knew she was struggling to cope....I wouldn't ever dream of landing her in it. Nor would I come on here and slag her off.

But when you know someone that does it that isnt struggling and is more financially stable, it pisses you off. And it doesn't matter who it is. Wether it's a relation or a friend. It's frustrating.

If the op's friend had come to her and opened up about how she was struggling to cope financially with a baby on the way, I very much doubt op would be on here.

It's the fact the friend has laughed it off. These are the people that need stopping.

Those who commit benefit fraud and those who don't pay sufficient tax are thieves. They should be reported. Frankly I'm fed up with paying tax only for it to be stolen and for people who really need it to go without proper support.

If it were me I would report it. I wouldn't waste time posting on here.

Tax fraud and benefit fraud happens a lot but people will alsways tell those who see it every day that it's doesn't exist.

Report her. It’s immoral and illegal. She is stealing money from the poor, underprivileged and disabled people who rightfully deserve it.