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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

NHS Dentistry takes the piss

129 replies

gobbin · 12/02/2019 22:45

AIBU to wonder why the Receptionist at my dental surgery gets pissy when I haven’t been for 2.5 years (because my teeth aren’t giving me any bother, I just thought I’d have a check up) and arsily suggests that ‘I’ll have to ask the dentist if he’s prepared to put you back on his books’.

Fuck me, my hospital consultant only sees me once a year for my well-managed, life-threatening chronic illness, my tits and fanny get seen every 3 years...what the fuck is so different about teeth that the dentist NEEDS to see a patient every six months. Apart from the kerching they get from the NHS, that is. Christ, if we all went to the GP every six months for a check up the system would be beyond breaking point.

OP posts:
arethereanyleftatall · 12/02/2019 23:48

Sausageroll. I agree £20 is a lot of money to some people. That wasn't the point I was making. My point was that the op has implied several times that it's some kind of massive money making venture, but I don't think dentists will make much from check ups.

CJsGoldfish · 13/02/2019 00:33

What the fuck is kerching? How does one kerch?

You didn't go, you may have lost your place. Seems fair.

To not go regularly seems crazy to me but it's also up to you. If you don't want to, don't. You just now know that you may have issues finding a NHS dentist to see you. No biggie

QuietContraryMary · 13/02/2019 00:36

NHS dentistry is shit, they get their £30 or whatever it is for a kids check-up and spend about 2 minutes checking because they dgaf, it's just to get the money.

Bryjam · 13/02/2019 00:37

I can't believe anyone could get worked up about a free dental check up, I mean come on!

CockleburIck · 13/02/2019 00:43

NHS dentistry is shit, they get their £30 or whatever it is for a kids check-up

Kids’ check ups are free Hmm

QuietContraryMary · 13/02/2019 00:47

The kids check-ups aren't free - the NHS is paying for them. He gets his £30 from the NHS and spends about 30 seconds on it because it's a fixed-fee service.

Bryjam · 13/02/2019 00:48

Kids’ check ups are free Hmm

They are free to the child. The dentist gets paid to do it Hmm

EBearhug · 13/02/2019 00:48

Kids’ check ups are free

To the patient. The dentist is paid by the NHS for doing the check-up.

Last time I went to the dentist, they said they'd like to see me in a year. If you don't go for more than two years, they remove you from their books

MrMeSeeks · 13/02/2019 00:50

You’re lucky. Most places 12 months and over and you’re kicked off the books.
If you don't want to go regulary go private.
Lucky they've put you back on! Mine are not taking any on at all!

LotsToThinkOf · 13/02/2019 00:53

We go every 6 months, teeth stay healthy, denting gets paid. What’s the problem?

serialtester · 13/02/2019 00:56

I think the OP makes a really good point. We're required to see an nhs dentist (and pay for the privilege) more often than any other "state provided" professional. Imagine if you had to pay £20 every 6 months to remain on the books of a state school?

GooseberryJam · 13/02/2019 01:08

My parents' NHS dentists have been very keen to get them in for all manner of extra polishes and treatments every 3 months. I'm sure it's not at all that they recognised my dad as someone who gets anxious easily about his health and played on that. Hmm Funny how when on one occasion there was a problem they backed away from all responsibility faster than greased lightning.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 13/02/2019 01:23

Sausageroll. I agree £20 is a lot of money to some people. That wasn't the point I was making. My point was that the op has implied several times that it's some kind of massive money making venture, but I don't think dentists will make much from check ups.

Sorry, yes - that was clear and I inadvertently derailed your point.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 13/02/2019 01:27

Out of interest, does anybody know how much dentists receive from the NHS for each patient appointment?

They obviously get paid for seeing/treating children and I assume the charge that adults pay (unless they're exempt from paying) is only part of the fee that they receive - otherwise, what would be the difference between being an NHS patient or a private one?

redandyellowandpinkandgreen99 · 13/02/2019 01:28

YANBU. Although oral health/dental health is important, it's ludicrous to suggest that ANYone needs to have it checked every 26 weeks ...

Even opticians only ask you every 2 years (unless there are issues.) And as a pp said, smears and mammograms etc are every 3 years. Yet we have to go to the dentist every 26 weeks and pay £22.00 for the privilege of a 5 minute check up. If they just HAPPEN to find a tiny hole or score in your teeth... KERCHING - That's £60 please! If we refuse, we get booted off the books!

So yeah the OP has a point. And the 'at least you HAVE an NHS dentist!' brigade can feck off too!' Hmm Just coz we are registered with an NHS dentist, that doesn't mean we don't have the right to complain. We are still having to pay our dental fees! And more often than private patients too, coz they are not forced to attend every 26 weeks. Hmm

mummarosie1 · 13/02/2019 01:30

Why should the precious few spaces be saved for people who don't seem to use the facilities?
It's nothing personal, but it's a waste having people on the books who don't seem to want to use it.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 13/02/2019 01:32

My parents' NHS dentists have been very keen to get them in for all manner of extra polishes and treatments every 3 months. I'm sure it's not at all that they recognised my dad as someone who gets anxious easily about his health and played on that. Funny how when on one occasion there was a problem they backed away from all responsibility faster than greased lightning.

Hmm, that does indeed sound ropey, to say the least. I sometimes wonder if the three pricing bands, ostensibly designed to make things simpler for the patient, could tempt them to make a judgement/diagnosis to tip people from the very highest reaches of one band over the border into the next one up.

That said, dentists are humans, so some of them will be less than 100% honest or scrupulous, probably in the same proportions as people in any occupation.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 13/02/2019 01:42

Why should the precious few spaces be saved for people who don't seem to use the facilities?

But you could say the same about people who are registered with a GP, but never need to go and aren't in any higher-risk age brackets/groups who are called in for regular check-ups. Should they be struck off and find themselves high and dry if, many years down the line, they do have cause to need the GP? Especially as the fit and healthy are statistically more likely to pay more in taxes towards the NHS than those in a position to need the most resources.

Surely, if there are so many people unable to get on to an NHS dentist's list and also so many who are on the list, but never go, thus leaving dentists ostensibly twiddling their thumbs, the officially-allowed ratios should be changed to allow dentists to have more people on their lists, instantly solving both problems.

QuietContraryMary · 13/02/2019 01:44

"Out of interest, does anybody know how much dentists receive from the NHS for each patient appointment?"

The NHS fees are Band 1 - £21.60, Band 2 £59.10, Band 3 £256.50

The dentist doesn't get this, they get paid in 'Units'.

Band 1 = 1 unit, unless urgent = 1.2 units
Band 2 = 3 units
Band 3 = 12 units

Prescription issue = 0.75 units
Denture repair = 1 unit
Bridge repair = 1.2 units
Stitches removal = 1 unit

"UDAs are awarded and calculated for completed treatments. Therefore if, for example you do a treatment with crowns, you will get 12 UDAs. It does not matter if it is 1 crown or 10 crowns, you still get a total of 12 UDAs. If you do a treatment involving endo, you get 3 UDAs and again, it does not matter if it is a simple upper incisor, or 5 difficult molars as you only get awarded 3 UDAs."

A unit value is set in a contract with the dentist, and is around £20, but it varies from dentist to dentist.

The way the system is structured is that the dentist is encouraged to complete a treatment as quickly as possible since you get the same payment for a 30 minute scale in polish as a 3 minute examination, and if they can recommend repair work that is quick to complete, then they will do so as the £60 they get from the NHS is worth it for them.

Whereas obviously if you are paying privately they will provide a better, more expensive service.

If the dentist receives adult patients, the £21.60 paid is probably a bit more than the UDA value, so in that case the NHS is making a profit. However obviously a private dentist will likely charge much more than that, so you are still saving money, even if the dentist only receives £20.

For exempt patients (children), the dentist gets the same amount of money, it's just that there is no money paid over to the NHS.

Original poster
gobbin · 13/02/2019 01:45

Why should the precious few spaces be saved for people who don't seem to use the facilities? It's nothing personal, but it's a waste having people on the books who don't seem to want to use it

But I DO want to use it. Regularly. Just not as often as they think I should, which is far too frequent in my opinion, compared to other NHS services. Every two years would be fine, with no urgent issues.

OP posts:
WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 13/02/2019 01:47

We go every 6 months, teeth stay healthy, denting gets paid. What’s the problem?

If it were free at the point of use, like most of the NHS, there would indeed be no problem. If you're a low-income household with two parents and two young adults who are not in education but not yet earning, finding the £172 every year 'just in case' - with the fear of further costs as a result of the check-up - that's where there could be a problem.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 13/02/2019 01:49

@QuietContraryMary

Thanks very much for that extremely comprehensive information - very interesting to know.

redandyellowandpinkandgreen99 · 13/02/2019 01:59

@Bryjam

I can't believe anyone could get worked up about a free dental check up, I mean come on!

It may be free for you luv, but some people work for a living, and have to PAY for their dental check ups (AND treatment.) Hmm

redandyellowandpinkandgreen99 · 13/02/2019 02:03
Hmm
redandyellowandpinkandgreen99 · 13/02/2019 02:04

@Webuiltthisbuffetonsausageroll

Good points. More people should be allowed on the dentists register and everyone should not have to go so often. (Maybe every 2 years, unless they have a problem obviously...)

As you said, why should people not be allowed on (the register,) because they don't go very often/don't need to go very often? Like you mentioned, we may as well apply this to doctors too! Don't go at least 2 or 3 times a year, then fuck off when you DO need to go.

Makes no sense does it?

Yet some people think it's OK for (NHS) dentists to do this.

My niece's boyfriend (aged 27,) last went to a dentist at 16, and has not been registered at one for 11 years. He just simply has not needed to go. He has nice teeth, and has always looked after them...

Last month he had a toothache for a month or so and went to a private dentist. He needed a small filling, and with the check up and x rays it cost him about £120 in total. That's how much he has paid in 11 years for dental fees. £120!

Most NHS registered patients will pay almost £50 a year just for check ups, and 2 to 3 times that amount if they need fillings. That's every year.

So it doesn't always follow that the NHS dentists will cost less - not long-term......