to think parental gender disappointment probably plays a big role in the increase of "trans" children?

[Valanice1989]

An FB friend shared this article about "gender disappointment and grief". The author writes about having a baby of the "wrong" sex as though it's on a par with the death of a child, using phrases like "I've just lost my girl" and saying that she's looking forward to finally getting a daughter when she goes to Heaven.

She has a stereotyped, fetishistic idea of girls: "I’ve always dreamt of having a daughter. I fantasized about the pink bows, sheets and nursery walls. I imagined the shopping trips, mani/pedi outings, and the hair braiding. I thought about our heartfelt conversations, her first kiss, first love, and first heartbreak. I imagined the tears we would both shed as she found the perfect wedding dress. I pictured the look on my husband’s face as he walked our baby girl down the aisle. I dreamt of the moment she would become a mom and finally know the depth of my love for her."

It doesn't seem to have entered her head that a daughter might not like pink things or shopping (I'm one of them!), or want to get married, or want to have children. And seriously, who cries when they find their perfect wedding dress?

She criticises the people that she feels weren't sympathetic enough to her and says that she's learned to stop hiding her gender disappointment. She writes that she "lost the one person I cherished most" - more than her sons. And at the end of the article, she includes her real name and a link to her blog. So it's entirely possible that her sons will one day read the article and discover that she loves her fictional daughter more than she loves them.

Is this part of the reason so many children are now being diagnosed with gender dysphoria? Now that it's becoming more socially acceptable for parents to talk openly about gender disappointment, what impact must that have on their children? If you knew that your own mother was so disappointed in you when you were born that she actually spiralled into grief, wouldn't that leave you with very low self-esteem? Wouldn't you want to change yourself?

Why is it ignorant and ill-informed, llangennith?

Steppemum your DD sounds ace.

I certainly think stereotyping and preconceptions can play a role. I was a Tom boy and I am the most ungirly girl I know. I have no interest in most things push onto women in the media. Perhaps if I was growing up in this generation I would think that there was something wrong with me and that I need to be 'fixed'.

Valanice1999 because we’re not allowed to question the trans narrative. We’re supposed to believe that there have always been lots of children who desperately wanted to transition, but just who never had the chance. It all falls down rather when you consider that the majority of kids being referred to gender clinics are girls, a high proportion of whom have ASD, yet this new acceptance of trans hasn’t resulted in thousands of older women wanting to transition. Conversely many middle aged men are transitioning, where as the numbers of boys being referred is dwarfed by the number of girls. Clearly the logic and the numbers don’t hold up to scrutiny, and too much discussion might lead to awkward questions.

It's an interesting theory OP. I'm not sure I agree but I think gender stereotyping relates to both issues. I've read a lot of "gender disappointment" threads on here and they always seem to be started by mums with only sons, with pretty much all the replies being by those also with only sons (or people who wanted several girls). There often seems to be a feeling that boys are "second best". That they will be difficult and messy, and have nothing in common with their mums. Whilst girls will love dressing up and grow up to be their mum's best friend and involve their mum closely in every part of their lives. I am sensitive to it though as I have two sons and have been on the receiving end of numerous rude comments about how disappointed I must be, how I should try again for a girl etc., like my family somehow doesn't really count.

most of the gender disappointments I have read about or heard about are mums desperate for a girl. I'm always curious if as many fathers feel the same desperation for a boy? (i do know of 2 dads with DDs who have said they would have really loved a son)

The original blog though _ its all a fairy tale with pink bows, wedding dresses, her (imaginary) DD becoming a mum....all of those may not happen...although she could become a GM if her DS had children. Why wouldn't that be a cherished moment?? my MIL , seemed just as overcome with emotion at her DS becoming a father as my mum was.

Interesting theory OP. Food for thought. I did want girls and had them but hope I wouldn’t have been like this mother had I had sons.

No idea why llan thinks this may be not valid or relevant. I think all this stereotyping: the girls are pink type thing, is massively damaging and may well feed into the trans ideology that has exploded.

...she "lost the one person I cherished most" - more than her sons.
This is so sad. To me this woman never grew out of the invisible friend phase!
I feel sorry for her sons, they should not be 2nd best to an IDEAL that only exits in their mothers heads.
And yes, in their heads, to get mums full love and attention, they would have to turn into that IDEAL. Talk about messed up people.

'Gender disappointment' is vile. It really stinks. It so self obsessed. It's up there with the people who complain they have 'secondary infertility' when after two healthy children they can't conceive at the age of forty.

While there may be the odd parent who 'forces' their child to live as a different gender this thread is just a chance for more FWR trans-bashing wrapped up in fake concern. New wrapping to be fair ...

What have you based this theory on exactly?
Tripe

I feel sorry for her sons, they should not be 2nd best to an IDEAL that only exits in their mothers heads.

Agreed. And imagine if the 3rd had been a girl - it's hard to imagine she'd treat all the children equally.

To be honest, it sounds to me like she had severe PND.

I really, really try not to trivialise other people’s pain because it’s real to them and if you haven’t experienced it then you can’t understand it... but there are limits. The fact that this exists under her own name is so selfish and cruel to her children.

I’ve had people say to me that children with special needs are only given to those who can handle them, which is frankly bollocks, but thank Christ this woman isn’t in my situation or those of the other parents of disabled children I know. It actually fills me with rage, which I know is irrational.

I truly hope that her sons don’t get any wind of this as children, because this absolutely could contribute to severe mental health issues. Could it contribute to a gender dysphoria? I suppose that depends entirely on the parent’s actions.

I'm not sure about the trans issue, but I couldn't agree more on the point made about her sons finding out that she wanted a girl instead.

This really resonates with me at the moment because I am 33 weeks with DS2. There is a thread on here started by me asking for advice about having 2 sons and no daughters (this is our last baby). I admit that I was disappointed to not be having a girl, I received some great advice via that thread and I'm now really excited to be having 2 boys.

We have kept the sex a secret from others, but I have said that I have a 'feeling' it's a boy. The comments I've received about having 2 boys have been awful. A friend asked me the other day whether I was trying to convince myself that it was a boy so I wouldn't be disappointed if it wasn't a girl. Errr no, actually I quite like my DS, he wasn't a consolation prize and neither will this one be.

I went along to a new playgroup this week and a lady I know by face but wouldn't call a friend who has one DD and two DSs so how I must be doomed if I'm right about having another boy and that she'd have another baby but only if she could guarantee a girl. Her youngest son was sat next to her. I can't help but think that if she goes around speaking like that her 2 boys are going to get the idea that their sister is much more loved and they were a disappointment to their mother because of what's between their legs.

I can't wait to see my 2 boys grow up together, but it does worry me that they will be led to believe that I wished they were girls because of drop handed comments made by people who don't even know me.

I kind of get having a preference of sex of a child but not being deverstated. I had a slight preference towards a boy with my third and she was a girl but I honestly never felt the slightest bit disappointed, she is perfect in every way
I agree some parents influence it, there was a little boy in my nieces class who only ever played with the girls, wanted to do 'girly parties' (nails and hair done) and wanted to grow his hair long. His mum was fantastic though, let him get on with it without labelling him or pushing him one way or another. He's now much more of a 'typical boy' and is quite happy as a boy, he said he never wanted to be a girl, just enjoyed those things. He could have easily been pushed into being a trans child if she'd wanted. For some though obviously, it is very much their own choice/who they are. I do believe 100% it is genuine thing for some

I think there are probably lots of studies and lots of reasons for the increase in trans people. However the biggest is probably increased awareness and acceptance of the issue

I know lots of people who have had gender disappointment. All of them were find once the baby was born and realised they didn't actually mind.

I think gender disappointment has always been a thing - it's not like there is any more choice over girl / boy than there was a few years ago so I'm not sure why you think it has increased. I'd have guessed it would actually gave decreased given people can now find out early in pregnancy and work through their feelings before the birth or even terminate if they feel that strongly (not saying I agree with this but it is possible. I found out when doing a genetic test at 10 weeks privately. The sex was a free add on)

I would think it a very very small minority of people that are so desperate for one sex that even after delivery of a healthy baby they still can't get over it to the point of it impacting negatively on the child

It seems like (IME) that the people who tend to express ‘gender disappointment’ are the ones that conform to the more stereotypical gender roles. For the girly-girl types, maybe they struggle to connect with men on an equal level and feel that they won’t have things in common with a child who is a boy.

For our family, we don’t really conform to stereotypical gender roles - DH is a bit of a nerd who likes reading, science fiction, playing computer games, listening to music and watching movies. He hates sport and is useless at DIY. I’m actuall pretty much the same....and I am not into makeup, clothes or other ‘girly’ things at all. We both like animals and nature and camping and hiking. We both have always had mixed groups of friends of both genders.

And our DS, 7, is pretty similar to both of us - not into sport at all, loves the same nerdy things that his parents both like, and so all three of us have lots of shared interests in common and feel a close connection.

To us, it wouldn’t have mattered if DS was a DD....as long as he/she was happy and healthy. But also, not having specific ‘gendered’ interests meant that I never worried about having difficulties connecting with a child of either gender- just looked forward to getting to watch a whole new individual grow and develop into their own person.

For this theory to be correct there would have to be a much higher incidence of trans people from families where all offspring were the same sex. Also this

I know lots of people who have had gender disappointment. All of them were find once the baby was born and realised they didn't actually mind.

I actually think gender disappointment is more likely now that people find out in pregnancy, and sometimes so early, when your hormones are a complete mess. If you don’t find out until birth it’s much harder to be disappointed when you’re holding your new baby I think. I realise this is a tangent, apologies!

I think gender disappointment has always been a thing - it's not like there is any more choice over girl / boy than there was a few years ago so I'm not sure why you think it has increased.

I don't think it's necessarily increased, but it seems to be more socially acceptable nowadays to admit to it (and risk the child hearing about it). I've definitely noticed an increase in people posting on social media about how gender disappointment is nothing to be ashamed of and parents should talk openly about it. All the focus is on the parents' feelings; there doesn't seem to be any thought given to the impact of this openness on the child themselves.

It was really overtly spoken about in the 1950s, for sure. And I expect much of the following decades.

But wan't in such a narcissistic way as the writing quoted above. The change isn't in the desires and disappointments of wanting a particuiar sex. It's in the utterly self-indulgent and over-emotional reaction.

I'm not recommending a stiff upper lip. But do think the pendulum is too far the other way at times.

Not gender disappointment. But I do think if society as a whole held a less rigid idea of what each sex has to be like there would be far fewer people feeling they were the wrong gender.

If people could genuinely wear whatever they wanted, walk, talk and enjoy whatever they wanted without certain traits being considered to be only for males or only females things might be less difficult for many.

No, sorry, I work with trans people (I’m a dr) and have lots of trans friends and the suggestion of this is almost laughably preposterous. Parental alienation and abuse for being trans is such a huge factor in homelessness, suicide, etc. of trans people.

But by all means go on living in your teeny tiny bubble...

I doubt it - I think that degree of obsessive disappointment is very rare and it would be excessively rare for a parent to push it onto their child.

I think it's more about some teenagers knowing more about trans and sort of mistranslating it (pardon the pun) as the answer to the eternal teenage problems of not knowing who you are, hating yourself and being uncomfortable with your body. Transitioning gives them a way to change who they are, to choose a name and to change the bodies they dislike so much, it's hardly surprising some kid convince themselves it must be the solution to how they feel.

NB, I do believe that being trans is a real thing and have trans friends and family. But I also believe it's relatively rare and you can't have a school with 60 genuinely trans kids in it. And I also hold onto the hope that everything going on now is a messy move towards a world where people can express themselves how they wish perhaps ultimately without anyone having to go down a medical route or attempt to 'change sex'