To say Please Appeal PIP

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If they don't give it to you and you qualify.

They (DWP) mess people around and people give up. It's so easy to do the Appeals form, it is even online now.

www.gov.uk/appeal-benefit-decision/submit-appeal

More info here www.gov.uk/government/news/new-online-service-launched-for-pip-appeals

The problem is it takes ages for PIP / MR months even, and they hope people give up. Once you get to Appeals, well with mine they rang and gave it back at that stage. Up till then, it was different.

Even if you can't face going to the appeal you can select a Paper hearing and if you have good paper evidence (and get some support to write a submission) you can do that. It might even be quicker, they sent ours to a court miles away and it was overturned in 4 weeks. But they had serious mistakes and was apparent on paper. But don't give up.

bump

Some people have been through the appeals process more than once. People are allowed to decide what's more important, money or their sanity.

I second this. We appealed an esa decision a few years ago that was over turned. They had to give us back pay. With our recent pip appeal luckily the reconsideration letter was enough.
With both appeals we used the unemployed workers centre and they were fantastic.

As an aside, are there companies who professionally write PIP or DLA or ESA applications ?

Well yes, if people have appealed and failed then they probably don't qualify. Appeals tend to be more fair than DWP can be. I see them as the real decision makers, now! But over half of people don't appeal and the Appeals win rate is really high, over 70% which means many people are being let down.

Plainspeaking, there are organisations such as Fightback but heard mixed things, as they apparently take a cut of the PIP...

there is a website called Benefits and work which is helpful and has guides, and often if you google the condition and PIP guide there are ones specific to conditions. My friend with MS had some help from the MS Society, we got her form well done and filled in from the GP, and then they contacted her Neurology nurse, no need for a F2F. (quite rare for PIP) and she got an Ongoing award. So it can go well.

My husband applied for pip 4 times and was turned down each time and he did the reconsideration letter each time and was turned down we ended up in masses of debt, we had to give up our rented flat and move in with parents until we very luckily got offered a council house. It beats you down until you just want to give up on everything! The fifth time he applied we went to citizens advice and I think that really helped so I always recommend a visit to them, thankfully he got it the last time but our lives are forever changed from the 6 year struggle for assistance when he couldn't really work. Just need to keep on trying!!

I appealed and failed four years ago, after having high rate for both for 4 years, I had to start a new claim which I got, and has just been renewed for 3 years.
I was entitled, they were lying shits and the stress of it was fucking awful.

Yes, bonnie the reconsideration pip is nothing like Appeals, it is usually just a kind of faffing about to make people give up - and prevent them appealing. Only a small amount are overturned then. It was brought in to prevent people going directly to Appeal.

YY to the stress, they actually apologised to me this time, I couldn't believe it. After spending 3 nearly a year trying to take it off me. They did the same thing a couple of years ago also. Lied all the way and then tried to pretend they lost the won Appeals notice. It has been the most stressful thing, the only thing which seemed to help was knowing Appeals are there to keep them straight.

Yes, yes to appealing and to getting help. CAB took my case and did absolutely everything other than attend the appeal with me.

Here’s a tip from me: on the initial application include as much evidence as possible. They say don’t ask your GP or consultant to write a letter as you may be charged and they will ask if they want to. Well they almost definitely won’t want to. So I got my GP to write a letter which specifically addressed certain descriptors and included it with the initial application ( or reapplication, since I had already been awarded higher rate).

Anyway they did still reduce the award. I appealed and did get it reinstated. Loads of stress and hassle but glad I did it.

I understand why some don’t though.

My PIP pays my bills, so in some cases, money is more important than sanity, or I'd be homeless.

Maybe we can share some more tips, here are mine (been through it twice since 2014, assessed again in 2016 and 2018)

Their letters take ages to arrive, like ten days. But you get 4 weeks from the date of the letter to reply / Appeal. To be aware of that in regards any MR / Appeal

Not attending medicals - if this happens they can stop the claim. You can arrange it once. My MP helped with getting a home visit- they have contacts at Atos. They sometimes don't take GP letters for this.

What else?

Filling in forms- if possible get help with either from family or CAB and state you did this or else they will say you are capable as filled in it yourself. Same with collecting medical info. But if you don't do these they will say you didn't give them enough evidence.

Medical evidence- they have recently moved away from telling people they will contact their Gp (they usually don't) and now people need to supply it themselves. Not sure if they have actually told the GPs that though. You should be able to get free print out of conditions and meds from the GPs, same with letters from consultants. The consultants secretary will send / copy you in on copies, that is a good way of getting evidence. You can pay for GP letters but that is costly and sometimes they seem to disregard them. I never asked for any letter just used the things we already had.

Trying to think of anything else...maybe others have stuff as well. Oh and try not to take personally the stuff they write, just challenge it with evidence. they can write silly things at times.

Also, the level of the award can mean changes to other benefits, like tax credits. So if getting a lower award that can go also

The success rate for appeals is really good (80%, or something) so it's worth going through the hassle.

CAB, law centres etc can help, and for people in social housing, councils and HAs often have financial inclusion officers who can do appeals for tenants.

Use the online guides to fill in the forms and also use them for any of the appeals processes.

If you are turned down at any stage, do persevere and take it all the way through to Tribunal.

I know it's hard to keep on and on and it's hard to see the DWP as being remotely fair in their actions, for example in my experience many errors on the Face to Face assessment, DWP defending the F2F decisions as if it was The Word Of God in the face of overwhelming medical evidence to the contrary, sending you a letter saying you have to reply "within one month of the date of this letter" their letter will be dated say 1 Feb but you only receive it on 13 Feb and have only a very short time to reply.
They also consider (but don't inform you) a reply should be on someone's desk by the month-end date, rather than just received at their building.

Do send replies by PO Tracked about £7 because otherwise DWP will allege that you did not meet the deadline therefore they will cancel your claim. Sometimes they do that with PO Tracked mail, they did with me.
Oddly enough they don't reply to the response that a named person at their office signed for your documents on the date and time as proven by the screenshot.

It's absolutely vile being treated in the way DWP do, I'm sure it's all designed to wear you down as much as possible so you do not continue, but your goal should be Tribunal because you will be heard fairly there.

I had my first PIP assessment on Wednesday and I know I won't get it. I burst into tears when going through the form with the assessor and she didn't bat an eyelid. I felt so down and embarrassed about describing my struggles that I had no control over it. I know she deals with this day in day out but it felt cold.

Yes but once you've been through the whole appeals process (and won) it's often not long before it's reassessed and the whole process starts over again

Yes but once you've been through the whole appeals process (and won) it's often not long before it's reassessed and the whole process starts over again

Angela that depends on how long your award is set for at Tribunal.
They do not give long awards for conditions that MAY resolve.
If you think your condition is a permanent one and will not/can not improve or resolve, then you need to provide the medical evidence for that.

The person I advocated for was given the ruling that "It is inappropriate to fix a term" which means DWP write and say they will review in 10 years' time.

Sorry this will be long, it’s a rant and asking advice:-

I had enhanced care for 3 years,my diagnosis is:- bipolar, fibromyalgia, hyper mobility syndrome, heart murmur, b12 deficiency, and back problems (car accident awaiting surgery) I take 31 tablets a day.

When I had my FTF I was hypomanic. But I can remember a lot of my interview. I wouldn’t allow dp to stay after he got me in the shower and clean pj’s on, because I was ‘fine, I can manage this, it will be great!’ How she laughs now! But that’s the joy of heading towards a manic episode!

Anyway. I have to get my mandatory reconsideration in by next Thursday. So any tips will be most welcome. I should highlight that there was a number of ‘lies’ in my assessment feedback. I take care of my own meds, my own finances etc- we never spoke about them. I was an ‘intellect’ Pmsl I’m sorry just because I’m educated and
have a degree, am I not supposed to be unwell? There’s loads more that I won’t add or it will turn this into an essay.

But question I was asked several times:- how many days have your back been bad in the last 6 months? Umm it’s pain 24/7 the worst pain is when it goes into spasm. Well how many days has that happened? I have no idea as I have not kept a journal. The second question: how many days has your bipolar affected you? Ummm no idea I haven’t kept a journal. I wasn’t aware I should be daly recording all these things, no ones ever mentioned that.

So she said ‘but I need to write down a number’ I said whatever number I give will
be a lie, because I can’t tell you. So
I don’t know what she wrote.

One last thing she wanted to know when I passed out, lost control of my leg, the sudden jerks of my body, the headaches and so on. Which of my diagnosis caused each one. I said it could be any or several and also side effects of meds, but I don’t know. But she kept pushing me for one. So I asked my GP last week, he said we have no idea, it could be any of your diagnosis, a side effect of meds or a side effect from combining your meds, we just don’t know.

But what is pissing me off. I have a very supportive partner, supportive ex-partner, an 18 year old son, and a 14 year old son. They are all supporting me to write this mandatory reconsideration. Because I have brain fog from fibro, I have bipolar episodes that makes it difficult for me to remember things. But what about those individuals who don’t have family, who don’t have access to the internet, who can’t get out and about for help, who don’t have the mental capacity to fight. They are the ones who will open those letters and their hearts will sink. They’ll put it on the side and accept it. Those are the people that I really feel for, and I’m working hard to put this together with support. How are others supposed to manage?

There's a fantastic Facebook page called 4UP who help people with this. www.facebook.com/groups/4UP.HQ/?ref=share
I found the help and support invaluable.

Also, once PIP is awarded, and in particular at Appeal, it is harder then for them to take it away as they have to have grounds to do so. They aren't allowed to just stop it. (they might try to though)

It is stories like the one above, the partner trying 4 times and being turned down at MR before they got PIP, which is a shame as if appealed first time might have got it then. (glad you got there in the end though).

Cabin they did similar to be this time, I also have MH as well as physical. W didn't hold out my hopes at MR (as they are crap) but I did write and explain that it was hard to talk about things with the assessor, like you mention and how they had overlooked other ways you are affected. Did they actually do memory tests? they didn't with me. So you can point that out, perhaps. they just came back with the same kind of stuff for the MR for me, only changing things at Appeal.

Next time, because the MR process is so rubbish, I might just write saying please go a MR as soon as you can we have no further evidence but we need the letter for Appeal.