To think the comments in the Daily Mail are frightening

[MotherOfDragons90]

I shouldn’t read it, I know, it is drivvel, but I downloaded the MailOnline app to read the Brexit stories as my friend said most of the comments were from Leavers and I quite wanted to know what Leavers think of how Brexit related things are going. Anyway, I digress.

There’s an article on today about new mothers and their maternity rights in the workplace.

The comments have shocked me to my core!

So many posts basically claiming women shouldn’t have any rights as they choose to have children, people saying they refuse to hire women of child bearing age etc.

If this is how Leavers feel, AIBU to be scared for our future as women?

Worrall, I know. It is refreshing that people on MN now admit to reading the daily mail. In the past they pretended not to read it but yet surprisingly seemed to know so much about the "racist, benefit bashing" rhetoric in the daily mail.

Firstly - people are prepared to say stuff online they'd never dream of saying to someone's face or owning up to in real life.

Secondly, you have to remember DM is a global site and sad old gits from across the world can go on there to sneer at whatever racist sexist bullshit is giving them a hatey hard-on today.

To be fair I usually read Apple news which shows lots of papers!

people saying they refuse to hire women of child bearing age etc

This is actually really common, just people don’t admit it.

Eh. If I was running a small business I would think twice before hiring a woman of child baring age. The maternity system in Britain isn’t great and has disadvantaged women in some respects and certainly been problematic for employers. It’s worth revisiting. That aside you have to remember that most people read and comment on the daily mail are older and poorly educated so their views won’t be well considered and they won’t be fashionable either.

That aside you have to remember that most people read and comment on the daily mail are older and poorly educated so their views won’t be well considered and they won’t be fashionable either.

And you know this? how?

Do you generally think older people are poorly educated with ill considered views?

I know several people who write nasty comments because they have a competition with one another to see who can get the most responses and downvotes!

I think this is a really stupid thing to do, by spreading hatred like that they need to consider how nutters are driven to harm people. Negative rhetoric probably influenced Thomas Mairs to murder Jo Cox, how irresponsible of them just to get a kick out of goading.

Daily Mail comments are considerably more interesting than the virtue-signalling, group-think twaddle on here.

MN “debate” = 99% supporting View A (which they learned from here) vs 1% arguing for View B, and getting called “trolls” and “goady fuckers” by the majority.

As hard as it might be for most of you to understand, there really are places online where adults feel able to say what they actually think, rather than simply regurgitating the party line to impress other users.

*AIBU to be scared of our future as women?”

Oh, grow up.

@Racecardriver If I was running a small business I would think twice before hiring a woman of child baring age.

What, like 16-50? Do you know men can take leave after having a baby now too, and some women don't even have babies? FFS

@Twit

Not sure grow up is relevant, thank you kindly for your input though

Men don’t seem to count when it comes to having children/employment... no negative comments about ‘men continuing to work and leave their children all day despite wanting to be father’ ‘fathers having time off with sick kids all the time’ ‘men thinking you can be a parent AND have a career, no you can’t have it all’ etc etc

The comments make me despair of humanity sometimes but I read them 1) realising that people often show the worst of themselves on anonymous forums 2) so that I’m not trapped in my little bubble surrounded by like minded ‘liberals’ unaware of other opinions.

As hard as it might be for most of you to understand, there really are places online where adults feel able to say what they actually think, rather than simply regurgitating the party line to impress other users.

That’s what we should be encouraging though - more honest debate, not less. Not shutting down those people whose views you disagree with, instantly writing them off and hurling insults, but trying to understand one another, accepting that we all feel differently about important issues and trying to find a consensus.

How did we get from DM comments to Brexit so quickly?

It's not difficult - read the OPs first post which included the following:

I downloaded the MailOnline app to read the Brexit stories as my friend said most of the comments were from Leavers and I quite wanted to know what Leavers think of how Brexit related things are going.

If it helps op, none of the leave voters I know read the DM.

Angry men like to 'own' online forums. It gives them the comforting impression their views are mainstream.

I read the hate mail precisely because of the bile and hate, know your enemy! However, one thing I have noticed that gives me hope, even if it is totally accidental, is whenever there's a scare story about weed, so that's about weekly, the most upvoted comments are always 'ffs just legalise and tax it'. The prohibitionists get short shrift. And that's mail readers saying it!!

I tend to read articles via Google news from a range of sources. For centre left read the Guardian, centre right the Telegraph.

@houstonbess it’s way more of a risk with women. All other things being equal men are a better bet because of the way maternity laws are set us and the expectations that arise around them.

@whenthedealgoesdown no. All the well educated people I know stick the times/ft regardless of age. Age is relevant because younger dummies get away with it because they tend to have more of a hive think mentality and people tolerate them because their views are popular.

I'm with you OP. I used to go on the comments and respond but it made me too stressed and angry I had to stop. Especially the women hating posts about maternity leave etc. It seems a lot of people think that children are solely the woman's responsibility and as soon as they are pregnant they should be banished from the workforce.

It's the sheer lack of logic that gets me, how would this work in practice - we'd either need a lot more immigration to cover the workforce (hated by DM readers), more people would be on benefits to cover their wage shortfall (hated by DM readers) and people would put off having kids, or not have them, leading to an elderly population and everyone else having to pay massive taxes to support them (hated by DM readers).

Of course everyone is allowed their own opinion but it's difficult to debate when there is a complete lack of logic, just blanket 'don't employ women' statements. And there is the small matter of people admitting to illegal practices in the workplace when discriminating against women of childbearing age

It worries me because a lot of comments like this are written by women who seem to think it's acceptable to discriminate against other women in the workplace which is really sad.

The most worrying this is that this isn't some small corner of the Internet for extreme views, it's the most widely read paper in the UK so a LOT of people must think like this.

When I've tried challenging some of their views with logical discussion (I try not to name call or be dismissive online as in real life) I just get comments like 'you're a sheep - that's what they want you to think' and 'get real' or 'I agree with everyone and I'm a woman so I must be right' etc

I read the FT although I sometimes look at most of the rest of the papers.

I do think it is good to see al kinds of people's views. Eg a lot of us are in favour of benefits cuts and changes many of which are for the better. That is not a view some people tend to hear so I think it is good that we can have both views showing. It is particularly important to hear an listen to different views (as the Queen was saying yesterday too) . It important so taht you don't get a shock when you realise e.g. Labour has not won an election since 2005. If people just talk to Labour voters like they are they may not be aware of the views of all those others who have not voted in in any election since.

Women are completely disadvantaged in the workplace IMO.
None of my friends with children have retained anything like the kind of career they had before.
Tbh, I don't think maternity leave helps us at all, (and I know I will be unpopular for suggesting this) and I think we would in fact have more opportunities if it were limited to say three months.
The risk of taking someone on who may take maternity leave for a year may be too great for some small employers so they won't do it.
Brutal but true, I think.

Tbh, I don't think maternity leave helps us at all, (and I know I will be unpopular for suggesting this) and I think we would in fact have more opportunities if it were limited to say three months.

More opportunities at what cost though? Sacrificing that time we can never get back?