To think that with someone else leading the Labour Party things might look very different

[why100000]

Corbyn is a Brexiteer firstly - maybe for different reasons to the Rees-Mogg crew, but a Brexiteer none the less. He may pay lip service to the remain side of things at times, but it is forced.

Over and above this, his position has been and is unendingly wishy-washy. I get that he has a difficult job marrying the different views amongst Labour voters, but come on, stop prevaricating.

My vote for Labour Party leader goes to Keir Starmer or David

Yes he was voted for as party leader, for an election Labour were unlikely to win whoever stood, watch the trends over time - David wouldn't have won either.

The worst thing about the Labour Party by far is that they don't stick by their leader. The tories are much better at keeping quiet and backing their leader unless they feel things are really off track. With time and a good show in opposition Ed would have had a decent shot at the next election.

Instead we have the continuation of the usual divide that insists only by being more left or more right can the party get in power.

I don't think the tories are currently in a much better position by the way.

But it's more frustrating with labour because so many of us want a clear opposition that has spent time building up an alternative picture of where we could be right now with a different approach, that appeals to most people.

Yabu, I think Corbyn would surprise people in brexit negotiations as he is a natural negotiator and genuinely wants a good situation for the many not the few. I voted remain but I see where he is coming from in terms of issues with Europe’s austerity policies and right wing ideologies. I respect that he continues to stick by his beliefs.

@WhirlwindHugs So how long should someone be allowed to carry on as a party leader? How long constitutes giving them a fair chance? I've have said five years was sufficient. He had five years to make them a credible party of government and then failed at the big test to persuade voters that this was the case after a coalition government.

The worst thing about the Labour Party by far is that they don't stick by their leader. The tories are much better at keeping quiet and backing their leader

See, now you really are talking waffle. They got shot of Thatcher for Major. Then they tried to unseat Major and failed. He lost the 1997 election and was replaced by Hague. Who was replaced by Iain Duncan Smith in 2001. Who was replaced by Michael Howard in 2003. Who was replaced by David Cameron in 2005. Who was replaced by Theresa May in 2015.

True, @SweetSummerchild Labour supporters are probably just as bad. The sad thing is, though, that, unlike the Tory Brexiteers, Labour Brexit supporters will be hurt economically by a no-deal Brexit. Yes, they voted for Brexit, but unfortunately there were so many lies told during the referendum campaign.

PS If you take out Harriet Harman who sat in twice as acting leader during leadership elections, Labour have had four leaders since 1994 - Blair, Brown, Ed and Corbyn. In that same period Tories have had 6. All the Labour leaders sat longer than both Howard and Duncan Smith.

I think Corbyn would surprise people in brexit negotiations as he is a natural negotiator Have you got any evidence of this ability? He seems to me the sort of person who would dig his heels in and refuse to budge.

What has Corbyn done in his life to show he's a natural negotiator?

I liked Ed M. I think he had substance. I would trust Yvette Cooper to run the country.

Eh. You don't agree, is fine. But stand in a room full of grassroots tories and Labour supporters and you can hear the difference in the way they speak publicly.

All Labour leaders/potentials tend to get a harder time of it in the printed press too. There were some disgusting articles written about both millibands. Which filters down.

@WhirlwindHugs I'd still like to hear how long you think a party SHOULD stand by its leader if you think 5 years isn't enough, even if we disagree. But I don't agree with your statement about how the parties do or don't support their leaders because it's factually inaccurate.

I want David Milliband back. I honestly think Britain would be a different place today if he'd win the leadership election instead of his brother.

Yes.

Jezza is as culpable as Boris, Rees Mogg, Gove and May for this fucked up situation.

I think Corbyn would surprise people in brexit negotiations as he is a natural negotiator
In what world is he a natural negotiator. He’s like a belligerent child.

Bring back David

If JC wasn't the Labour leader, I might be tempted to vote for Labour! ssshhhh

He's like a belligerent child who sulks when he doesn't get his way.

I’d like to see evidence that he is a belligerent child who sulks - this is a cynical media portrayal of anything imo.

He is a democratic socialist! Of course he is into negotiation which benefits all sides. He has consistently advocated for peaceful negotiations in conflicts such as the Troubles and Israel/Palestine. His is an entirely different approach to negotiation, about being reasonable and personable, and getting an agreement that will benefit everyone, rather than the Tory ‘me first at all costs’ mentality.

Man, I forget how Tory mumsnet is, it’s shocking for me how many of you hate Jez when I see him as such a kind and trustworthy person, but it’s good to hear the other side as I know so few Tories in RL

I do not want JC as Labour Party Leader but I have never voted Tory and never will.

Not liking Corbyn and being a Tory are not synonymous.

Hilary Benn for me too.

Corbyn will never win a GE. The last thing we need is Milliband or Cooper or any of their "clique" - we need to move on into a different era with new personalities.

Blair, Milliband, Balls, Cameron, Clegg, Cooper, etc were all of the same ilk of self serving Metropolitan Elite. No way should any of them make a come back.

We need to get rid of May, Corbyn and Cable in one go and get new leaders and new "top tables" in all parties. They're all tainted.

Merename disliking JC doesn't make you a Tory. Plenty of people on this thread have praised other Labour politicians while they criticised JC. I know card carrying Labour members who can't stand the man.
What skillls do you think he has that makes him a good negotiator? I advocate peaceful negotiations but I would be a rubbish negotiator and would never achieve anything. I know people, very close to me, who have to negotiate in their different fields and they are completely different characters to JC.

Merename I like JC as Labour leader too.

@why100000
*I do not want JC as Labour Party Leader but I have never voted Tory and never will.

Not liking Corbyn and being a Tory are not synonymous.*

This is where I'm at - Don't like Corbyn at all - would never and have never voted Tory in my life.

I'd consider voting for David Miliband, Yvette Cooper or Chuka Umuna.

There is no way on God's earth I would vote for Jeremy Corbyn, John McDonnell and Diane Abbott.

Total jokes. At a time when we need a strong opposition we have a bunch of student-politic clowns. Bloody disgrace.

We have two months left. Either the EU backs down and puts a longstop date re the backstop in the currently negotiated agreement (which I think will be enough to get it through parliament)

I think the first option you mention is what will happen.

Kier Starmer as leader would make Labour credible again.

I agree but I always think I must be missing something that everyone else is seeing with Kier Starmer, because I really like him, but he never gets mentioned really as a possible leader and I don't know why.