To wonder when this government are going to stop destroying education?

[brizzledrizzle]

Dbro's children's school was on the news last night as the head was talking about the funding cuts.
Why are the government doing this? I can't see how this is going to mean kids leave school with the skills needed by the country.

When our students finish year 11 they all get to write their best memory in the year book - 10 years ago it was full of comments about Ski trips, Geography trips, all sorts of fun days out and activities.

That comment makes me both very sad and very grateful for the lovely teachers at my son's school - he has been there for two years and has been to France on a school trip and will be going on trips to Germany and Switzerland this year. I hadn't realised just how lucky he is to be there.

hmmm... I have my doubts about Becky Allen. I like her but her experience is limited. The rarely cover thing is the best thing.

fifth I am in an academy but not a MAT. We get our PPAs. They aren't actually marked as such on our timetables but I tend to think that's a good thing. I do one cover a term, max.

Once more, O levels are not GCSEs...

Once more, O levels are not GCSEs...

What point are you making? School certificate was used to norm an O Level pass when they were set up in the early 1950s. O Level pass at C was used to norm GCSE pass at C in the late 1980s. GCSE D to F were normed roughly to CSE 2 through 5. When people talk about a GCSE pass they mean a C or better, which is equivalent to O Level C or better. There is a lot of "in my day" nostalgia about how O Levels were "harder", but little evidence for it: different curriculum, mostly.

(My hands are clean in this debate: I did O Levels, plus a few of the experimental 16+ which became the GCSE later).

So again, what point are you trying to make?

I am tryint to suggest that comparing the PP's DH's O level qualifications with a modern teenagers isn't very relevant. When I talk about a GCSE pass, I actually mean grades 1-9.

But thanks for MNsplaining to a practising core subject teacher.

apologies in addition for typos.

Is there an equivalent now of an O level

When I talk about a GCSE pass, I actually mean grades 1-9.

A usage no-one else would use, any more than anyone would regard an O Level D as being an O Level pass. If a job or course requires a GCSE “pass”, they do not mean a 1.

They would have to specify that, then. I think you will find many teachers do use this expression. A grade 5 is a 'strong pass'. Only a U is not a pass, technically speaking. O level used entirely different pass/fail terminology, hence the existence of CSEs.

There really is no point any more in talking about O level equivalents. O levels are really such a long time ago.

Anyway, it's off topic : other than to say the days of scrapheap CSEs and only worth it O levels are happily long gone. At least, despite what you think oliver there is more aspiration and opportunity in modern times for more young people.

O level used entirely different pass/fail terminology, hence the existence of CSEs.

It’s more complex than that. When O Levels were first introduced (interestingly, with some of the boards using numbers, some letters) the certificate just said “pass”. The grade was on the results slip, but the certificate just listed those that had been passed. That’s because the whole “five GCSE passes including English and Maths” is the inheritor of “five O Level passes including English and Maths” is school certificate, and the definition of “pass” was therefore school certificate level.

O Levels were standardised to A-E plus F (sometimes) and U in the 1960s, and then CSE was introduced with a CSE 1 equivalent to an undifferentiated O Level “pass” A-C, and 2-6 (7?) mapping onto D and E, then subdividing U. The 16+ pilot was a dual award, so I got O Levels A-C and a CSE 1 in parallel in the subjects I took the pilot in.

The mess of English 16+ qualifications is bizarre because ultimately they are all normed to School Certificate circa 1919. Which is completely crazy.

At least, despite what you think oliver there is more aspiration and opportunity in modern times for more young people

Really.

I think you need to look around more at what exactly is going on.

Ds wants to learn a trade. He is in level 2 atm. If in July he fails his English GCSE then he can't continue.

Last year out of a class of 30 only 4 were able to make it to the next level.

In his class at this current time only 1 has both GCSE maths and English.

Then we have the government saying we have a skills shortage and need to bring people in who haven't got the equivalent maths and English GCSE but who are qualified in the trade from abroad.

Do you not see how skewed that is.

Yanbu - The end goal must be privatisation. The whole thing is appalling and seemingly makes no sense otherwise. Academies are a cloak of privatisation imo

Babygrey7
Whilst private schools can continue to teach the iGCSE courses, these too have been overhauled and the first students to sit the new exams will do so in 2019.
I have moved jobs from a state school to a private school and can categorically say that the new GCSE courses are much harder than the equivalent iGCSE courses, not neccesarily subject content, but definitely question styles.

Taxiparent, that is interesting

The Guardian had a good article about this last week