to ask if you have a PhD?

[Morgan12]

Looking for advice basically. I'm seriously considering applying for a PhD which hopefully will be funded by the uni as I can't afford the tuition fees (based in Scotland).

I was just wondering if you have one then do you think it was worth the hard work? Did it help your career?

Ideally I'd like a career in academia so would be great to hear from people in this field. If you would be willing to disclose what you earn then please do, even a ballpark figure. What are your day to day duties like etc?

Just really any experiences of PhD study welcome. I need to make a decision asap.

I left my fully funded PhD program after qualifying for a masters along the way. I was miserable and after seeing academia up close, really less interested in it as a career. I ended up with a great job that pays well. I have thought about finishing my PhD just to have the accomplishment, but the reality is that I would not want to change jobs so it doesn’t seem worth the time or lost income.

However, what got me was the self interested politics of it all. I (naively and bizarrely) thought it would be above all that. What a total fool I was.

Yes to this! I suppose I had this antiquated view of a academia being all about knowledge.

Has anyone done a PhD just because they were interested in a topic or wanted to do the work for the sake of the work?
I work at a university abroad. I was given 3 years paid study leave to do it which was brilliant I was fed up with my job and got 3 years to do research into something I loved. It was worth it for that alone but hasn't actually changed my career prospects.

I didn't have loads of teaching. I had a quite a lot of marking and lab supervision to do though, but I got paid an hourly rate to do it. I also got paid to give tours to parents and prospective students.

Yes, both me and dh had a PhD. But we are academic scientists so a prerequisite really.

Oh, I did a small amount of teaching and marking. I didn't have to, but it's basically essential if you want an academic job. I was paid for it all.

I loved my PhD, but I moved abroad to do it which was probably the best thing I ever did (plus the pay is a proper graduate salary, not the UK piss-take poverty wages). I made some great friends, got to travel a lot and generally grew up . Having seen how the British students in my subject (STEM) are treated, I'd think twice about doing one in the UK. Too much teaching, low pay, no money for conferences and scientific travel, poor resources, insufficient holidays, no maternity pay, no pensions...

Since then, I've had 5 contracts of less than a year each in 5 different countries. I've been sexually assaulted at conferences, I'm sick of only being invited to things as a token woman, I have no stable pension, health insurance, support network etc, my DH lives in another country because his career wouldn't support moving, and I'm constantly on the edge of a nervous breakdown. I can't access service because I'm not in any place long enough to find them or become eligible or speak the language. Despite this, I'm still looking for jobs in academia, because theoretically I like research, and part of me actually enjoys the nomad lifestyle. It's almost like being self employed, but with no chance to improve your pay .

So all in all: do a PhD if you think you'll enjoy it and don't mind being very poorly paid for very long hours. Don't expect anything from a career in academia. And this is not PC, but don't do it if you don't have robust mental health and a very thick skin. Otherwise you'll come out a broken wreck if you graduate at all. It's not worth it.

I have one and don't use it at all. I don't regret it, but it cost me a lot of money and I'm not sure it has really got me anything good anecdotes.

Mine was in archaeological science which was maybe my mistake.

I do. Now a Reader in a Humanities subject. However, it’s a much more cutthroat time for new PhD graduates now — I can think of two absolutely first class scholars in my field (with post-docs, an excellent monograph apiece from highly-rated university presses, articles in top journals, well-connected, teaching and editing experience, a couple of short-term contracts under their belts etc etc) who are respectively working in M and S and a call centre to pay the bills.

And don’t even consider doing an unfunded PhD.

And lekker’s experience strongly mirrors that of two very good PhD students of mine. One had a small child and was commuting internationally from her job to the family home, as her husband had a permanent contract.

Marilyn one of my siblings is an academic and says that academic politics are so nasty because the stakes are so low

I finished my first (AHRB - as it was then - funded) in the late 90s. I then went to work in the field, one that's notoriously ill - paid, though this didn't require a PhD and then drifted into work in other areas. 15 years later, did another PhD in social sciences and have been an academic since 2009. The second one was way, way harder than the first one: probably because I was under no illusions about the process, but I needed it to progress in the work I was doing (didn't intend to go into academia at the time).

I'm now a Prof, but it's been a slog, to put it mildly, and I walked out of my previous institution earlier this year. I took a number of months off, and was extremely lucky to be head-hunted for my current institution a few months ago. I am aware this was incredibly lucky: I'd intended on leaving academia when I had left earlier in the year.

A career in academia doesn't just require intellectual ability and hard work: you have to also be extremely lucky. I tell my students that they should only contemplate a PhD because they couldn't imagine not doing it - no matter how much passion you have, at some stage, it will turn into a slog, and you will likely have plenty of long, dark nights of the soul. If you don't have children or a partner, it's easier in terms of managing your time, but then you have less support at home and no one to share the bills. An awful lot of people are fully funded and don't make it through to the end, and it can be extremely isolating. If you are a perfectionist or a procrastinator, think very, very carefully before starting. If you are both (like I am) you're making a rod for your own back!

Finally - hands down some of the dimmest people I've ever met have PhDs - it's an exercise in meeting certain requirements to pass, rather than a benchmark of intellectual brilliance. If you can treat it as this exercise, you'll be much more realistic about the process.

Good luck!

I do. In the biological sciences as does DH. I’m now a lecturer and husband a post doc. It’s a hard battle to get to job permanency but if it’s something you think you will enjoy then it’s worth while.

Oh, and I completely agree with Lekker you need to have robust mental health - doing a PhD seems to magnify any existing problems enormously. I say this as someone with very severe MH problems that developed during the PhD.

I am good friends with a couple in my previous discipline: they've never worked on the same continent, never mind in the same institution. They have, though, been very happily married for thirty years

I have a PhD in philosophy.

Generally a PhD is doable as long as you have a supportive supervisor and you have time in your life for it. Part-time PhDs are incredibly difficult as other demands take over and the degree just tails on for years and years - not impossible but certainly more challenging. Full- time study allows you to concentrate on the degree, although keep in mind there will be pressure for you to finish quickly, as close to three years as possible, to meet the funding body’s expectations. You will also be expected to do a little bit of teaching to gain experience, attend conferences and be available some evening for visiting speakers and research seminars.

In my discipline the market is flooded with PhDs. They are the bare minimum for getting a job, in addition graduates need more than one publications in decent peer reviewed journals which increases the pressure enormously, especially if you consider long lead times for submission reviews, resubmissions, etc. For all this graduates get teaching intensive 9 month, poorly paid, contract in any part of the country which makes family life very difficult.

So let’s say you get to the holly grail of a permanent post and your university doesn’t randomly decide to close down your department, you’ll find yourself with unrealistic research targets, some departments set monetary goals for the amount of money you need to apply for, an insane and pointless administrative work load that will take over your life, and really compromise de teaching, e.g, huge classes, low contact hours, etc.

Brexit is expected to cause seismic changes in U.K. universities. Some are already financially compromised, the potential loss of foreign students and the loss of EU funding which probably won’t be covered by the U.K. government will be catastrophic. My friends are looking for ways out to European universities or further afield.

This thread has really opened my eyes to the realities of doing a PhD. I'm starting to think it might not work for me right now with two small children. I know that the last few months of my dissertation were very stressful and I only had one child then. I can imagine this would be 100 times more work.

I have a science PhD from the early 2000's in the UK. I thoroughly enjoyed it as my supervisor was great, the project difficult (well, impossible) but interesting, and my lab mates were great too (all male, which is the trend in my entire career). Never experienced any misogyny or discrimination. I did a couple of postdocs abroad but academia was never my end goal, I just fancied working somewhere nice. I moved into sales for a while for a mega corp and then halved my salary to work in a tech startup as a manager (mostly firefighting problems). Salary has varied from £45k - £90k since I graduated 15 years ago (currently at £60k). I'd do it all again. I'm currently planning my next move which will likely be a complete change of direction and more of a hobby job. I never use my doctor title except on my business cards. I think that's the norm for most people?

Morgan as I said I don't work in academia as such apart from my associate work but it's my MSc that's got me where I am work wise. In fact my current post asked for masters- I don't know how common that is in local government but even in other posts up to now it's given me the edge.

If you don't have a masters have you considered one? I'd say they're relatively easy to do part time - did mine while working full time with 2 small children and dh working shifts or at times living separately cos of work.

It's not a route into academia on it's own though but it would also make you more attractive as a PhD candidate later on?

Sorry if you already have one!

The PhD was worth it, the academic career not so much. My PhD was fully funded and very successful, so I thought I was a natural for an academic career. The higher you go, the harder it gets. And despite working with mostly male teams and colleagues, the misogyny and disadvantage doesn’t kick in until you are senior enough to pose a threat, IMO. And having a family will almost certainly break you or your academic career. Salary wise I do okay - could do far better in other sectors, where a PhD would be an advantage - but then I live in an area with lots of spin outs and tech firms which appreciate research skills.

That said, it provided me with some really interesting work, and great travel opportunities, including living and working abroad. I would do it again, but I would look to leave academic research much earlier.

The worst thing about academic careers is the complete lack of structure. Nobody in invested in you and formal training is almost nonexistent. I’ve often seen pet PhD students been completely cut off once they established their own lab and became competitors.

I don't actually have a masters. This might be the most logical next step for me right now.

I just submitted at the end of last year, and my viva is scheduled for the end of this month. I did it part-time (seven years!!!!) alongside working full-time. Social sciences.

I thought I wanted to be an academic, but am less enthused about teaching now that I've done some (yes, hated the essay-marking). It has been tough mentally - I never felt I was becoming an expert, just that all the gaps in my knowledge and reasoning were being mercilessly exposed and the world was far less knowable than I thought.

Was it worth it? Too early to tell. I work in in professional services in a different university, and it certainly isn't needed and won't add to my salary, although it does give me a bit of cachet (or so I like to think). I am interested in using it in research/policy but I'm not very mobile as I want to stay where I am for my dd's sake. I have some ideas about things I can do now, and some dreams about what I can do with it when she's all grown up, but I can't yet tell how realistic they are. Ask me in a decade...

I have one in psychology. I worked in UK universities for 10 years and now work in a university in the UAE.
Doing a PhD is bloody hard work. Around the mid point you will hate your life, your supervisor and yourself.
I do think it was worth it and I am happy in academia but I wouldnt do it if I had my time again.

Definitely do the Masters first. With two small children you can definitely still do a PhD but you need to make sure you have got a very supportive partner and more-than-adequate childcare sorted out.

Also, I highly recommend reading the Thesis Whisperer.