To be so angry with the British high street?

[peoniesarejustperfect]

Went sales shopping yesterday with my elderly Mother yesterday. We went to an 'affluent' city in the south east. We always go shopping after Christmas and it's a bit of a tradition and we normally really enjoy it. Yesterday was just so depressing - it made me fizz with anger. I hardly know where to start!!

The shops were just horrible - full of badly merchandised sales stuff which looked totally uninviting.

In several of the shops we went into there were no staff on the shop floor - we wanted to ask where different departments were (to save Mum walking too much), but no one to ask and poor signage.

In House of Fraser (one of the stores which is remaining open) we waited for 25 mins in the luggage department for a member of staff - there was no one there to help - no tape measure, no useful signs about cabin luggage allowances and no one to take any cash. We hung around for ages with two other families - no chairs to sit on, we just stood around. After a while we all gave up. The same in lingerie - no staff on duty. We had lunch there, which was really nice, but the restaurant loos were closed for cleaning when we went in at 12:15. What restaurant shuts its loos at lunchtime??? They suggested we left the restaurant and 'popped down' two floors to use another loo.

The British high street keep moaning but really, why on earth would anyone want to shop there? Why do they deserve our hard earned cash? It's incredibly expensive to park and the retailers don't seem very keen on keeping customers happy - let alone delighting them! There's not enough staff and with some notable exceptions, many of them are poorly trained - it all seems a bit of an effort for them.

Last Christmas we went to the US. I know it's different in America, but every morning in Macy's, when the doors open, a group of staff clap the shoppers in. We couldn't get over this and asked a sales assistant about it - she told us it's an honour to be picked - to welcome customers, look them in the eye and say thanks for coming. US retail is facing similar challenges, but what a different response. Helpful staff directing you to places, gorgeous merchandising, seats everywhere and staff trained to sell.

Anyone else fed up with the high street?

My recent experience in my local high street chimes with your own OP. I went shopping a couple of days before Christmas in the Kensington High Street M&S, just after they opened, so as to avoid the crowds. The store, though quite busy, had the atmosphere of a graveyard. The floor reeked of dirty mop water and there were no staff to ask help from. One of the shelves didn't seem to have the prices of the items on them. I bought five items anyway, two of which were not the colour I wanted, as they didn't seem to have them in stock.

I waited for about 20 minutes to pay. I stood in a queue with six people in front of me, one person served, whilst three others were stood huddled together behind the counter, gossiping. When I finally got to being served, the woman serving was surly and tried her best to make me feel as if she was doing me a huge favour. I was taking the morning off work and had a couple of calls to make, so I stupidly went for a cup of coffee in the cafe to make them there. The coffee was barely tepid, I took it back to the counter to complain - having to wait another ten minutes to be served. Again I was made to feel as if I was in their way by a grumpy, disinterested member of staff who took a very unpleasant 'what is it with you people' tone with me. I had to protest that I didn't think I was being unreasonably demanding by expecting a hot cup of coffee, having just paid about four pounds for it.

Next time, I shall be better organised and do my Christmas shopping from behind my computer from the comfort of my own home. I don't feel that I, or the general public, owe the high street a living. If it cannot provide a decent service it deserves to fail.

If you came to my local town: the business rates are crippling the shops. They in turn are cutting the hours for staff, and the better staff at places like House of Fraser are moving on as their jobs are at risk. The trading figures up to Christmas are not that positive, so the staff are probably down (as well as over worked).

In the US the land taxes are much lower - which is why their supermarkets are rarely as busy as those in the UK, they can have a huge one serving a much smaller population. The shops in general can afford to employ more staff. And there is a culture of service, and more chance of extra rewards. (In the UK sales rewards are very very low, my DS can make a sale of £1000 and only earn 10p extra.)

If you came to my local town: the business rates are crippling the shops.

Worth reminding ourselves they are set via central government ...

I work in retail and I'm good at it. Yes, it is 'unskilled' but to be honest, there are people who can do it and people who can't. Unfortunately, a lot of the ones who can't also cannot get another job because of lack of qualifications/interest etc. I work in a small store and we have a staff of 3. All the staff are great with the customers and are chosen extremely carefully because of the nature of the job (the potential of assisting vulnerable/ill people). Most of our customers are delightful, but you do get the odd arsehole who ignores the greeting and avoids eye contact and doesn't respond when you offer help.

I would not work for Mike Ashely for any money because of the way the staff are treated. He doesn't want long-term staff, or full timers, because they cost more money. He wants people who are still at school or university who need some money, but he couldn't give a shit if they are polite or otherwise and HOF is going to end up the same way. He simply wants people to buy stuff cheaply from him and he rakes in the cash. Head Offices rarely want to hear anything from the staff on the ground and even when customers email, the only time staff hear anything is if it is a complaint. Praise is not passed on.

I don't know what the answer is. I am as guilty as the next person of buying online. A lot of the things I like I cannot get locally. I do appreciate good customer service online, too, though. And I do judge when I go into other shops.

Ooh rossetti, that's hefty for a whisk. Anyway, hope you find your knife. Then you can start a hunt for grape scissors

Parking is a major issue for me. Tiny spaces and high costs put me off shopping in my local high street and going to Bluewater. (Large parking spaces for all and parking is free)

Ooh rossetti, that's hefty for a whisk.

Tell me about it. We had one which was wonderful, until "D"W managed to break it. All the ones that aren't GoodGrips are shit. Arguably you'd expect that for £3.50. Which leads onto another problem in retailing, which is the lack of "middle options". I'd rather spend £7.00 on a fairly decent product than 2x£3.50 on crap ones that break easily (The Vimes theory of economics kicks in ....)

Anyway, hope you find your knife.

It was easier to stop eating grapefruit.

Then you can start a hunt for grape scissors

I'll be honest, if that's a wind-up, you got me

Had to but a corkscrew a couple of weeks ago. I know it will break before a month. It's made of light metal, and simply not up to the strain of pulling corks out of bottles. It's not "occasional use". It's "10 uses and that's your lot".

Did I say we've been keeping receipts for years ?

A small local high street near me (Longfield in Kent) has really suffered from recent parking rules changes. You used to be able to pull up and park outside lots of independent shops and businesses and you also could park in Waitrose and walk down. Parking in Waitrose has been stopped unless you shop there, you don't even have the option to pay and display for an hour. Almost all of the high street and surrounding roads have been double yellow lined or made permit parking for residents. It's now extremely difficult to just 'pop in' to the small shops and businesses there. There is insufficient parking available anywhere for shoppers. Even collecting a takeaway has become so problematic that I've started using a different takeaway.

Town centre parking in most places is stupidly expensive as well. Councils need to realise that they shoot themselves in the foot with this and do huge damage to the town and the local economy they are supposed to champion. It does nothing to help struggling shops and businesses if customers find it too difficult or to expensive to access them.

Cant remember the last time I needed a corkscrew but I am with you regarding the whisk. And tin openers can be added to the list. This year there appeared to be a distinct lack of nutcrackers anywhere.

Life's not what it was Rossetti, I too, am fed up with attempts to flog me stuff that rightly belongs in a tray dangling from the neck of Throat Dibbler. Grape scissors? Definitely a thing. An employer had a pair delivered to the workplace many years ago. I was as bewildered as you.

When I go into a shop I want:

To walk in a straight line to the appropriate area. Not zig zag through a labyrinth. Not have to divert because the whole (narrow) aisle is obstructed by a buggy or stock display etc.

To find stock in a logical place. With the proper range of sizing. There's no point in asking if there's anything out the back these days as it's all what you see is what you get. I tried to get vouchers in WHSmith the other day, the displays were scattered all over the place.

Stick to what you're good at. E.g. M&S for quality basics, not frumpy mock "fashion" that suits no one of any age. There's enough other stores doing fashion properly. WHSmith, there's enough jack of all trades like B&M. A shop like Waterstones is a joy. A great core of stock, attractive displays. Interesting complimentary stock without being a jumble sale.

Clean, pleasant, decently lit (but not dazzling). Not booming music. I'm not surprised BHS failed as it felt neglected for over a decade.

Pleasant, clean changing rooms, big enough to move in with spaces to put things on cleanly. A seat so you don't have to teeter on one foot.

Friendly, accessible staff that acknowledge you. Not overbearing and pressure selling. Not ignoring you either. If you are busy, acknowledge me and indicate when I can be helped. Maybe shops need a little counter to go to where there's a bell or something to get attention when needed rather than playing hunt the assistant.

External factors such as expensive parking, running the gauntlet of street drinkers, drug addicts, preachers, chuggers and other promotions doesn't help in general.

My first job was in a shop. I understand the pressures, such as being a free cleaner at the end of the shift. Following irritating scripts. Senior management have a lot to answer for. Independents are better because staff have more autonomy to respond appropriately to customer needs and aren't stuck on a script.

The delightful Great British Public aren't necessarily helpful with too many people being obnoxious and "entitled" to treat low paid staff and their workplace poorly.

I try to shop on the High Street and did pretty much all of my shopping in real shops this Christmas. If I want individual items, all too often the P&P online is no dearer than transport, and it's easy to get exactly what I want, particularly for specialist items.

A small local high street near me (Longfield in Kent) has really suffered from recent parking rules changes. You used to be able to pull up and park outside lots of independent shops

Likewise, a very popular shopping street near me was ruined by the council. Same thing - lots of on street parking so you could park for a few minutes, pick up what you wanted and move on - ideal for the pie shop, bakery, butchers, etc. If you couldn't find a space, you'd just drive round the block and try again by which time someone would have moved. Council decided to make it pedestrian friendly by widening the pavements and putting in traffic calming meaning that about 40 parking spaces were reduced to maybe 5. Not only that, but it took the council over 6 months to do it, during which time the street was closed completely for cars and some shops weren't accessible for pedestrians for days due to the road and pavement outside being dug up. It's now deserted with closed down shops and the odd nail bar and tattoo parlour. So, much "nicer" for pedestrians to walk down, but nothing for them to walk down for! Clever, these councils!!

Cant remember the last time I needed a corkscrew

In times gone by, it wouldn't be because the one you had broke ....

To walk in a straight line to the appropriate area. Not zig zag through a labyrinth. Not have to divert because the whole (narrow) aisle is obstructed by a buggy or stock display etc.

Maybe my views are too coloured by the fact DW uses a wheelchair ... by the time you've done the parking round, got through the never-empty lift bonus, and finally made it into the shop you realise it's another level of obstacle dodging.

Either way, that's something that's got worse, not better over the past 20 years.

@DGRossetti now I cone to think of it I believe the last time I needed a corkscrew I used my son's swiss army knife type thing and the time before I used a screw and a pencil

A few years ago, I had a lovely gift for Xmas from some German clients (they gave the same gift to every name on the project ...)
It was a two-piece corkscrew. Beautifully made and too fiddly for everyday use.

The year after I got a desk watch - again beautifully made.

One of the best free gifts we've ever had was a cast-iron bottle opener (came with our set of cast iron frying pans). Wonderfully functional, and indestructible.

I work in this town. It is absolutely vile.

Unhomeless beggars are scaring people, mainly elderly or vulnerable from the shopping areas during the day.

The local megasupermarket is popular in the evenings and has acquired its own collection of beggars who also trawl the car parks of the local retail parks.

Shopping is unpleasant, you're on continuous lookout for the next potential beggar/thief and the declining shops are selling goods of ever decreasing quality.

I'll see you Walsall and raise you Redditch ....

Redditch! I went there with my DB to get a bike for his DD. Grim - way too many roundabouts, we got lost. Several times.

Ive been screamed at for shutting toilets off at inconvenient times, usually it's because someone has thrown up or shit everywhere and there are 85 million things I would rather be doing than cleaning it up then getting shouted at because someone is mildly inconvenienced.

Minimum wage, staff cuts and getting spoken to like I'm stupid plus working over Xmas mean I'm probably not going to be as enthusiastic as I should be, let alone want to make someone else's shopping day some magical experience.

My pet hate is the lack of mirrors. Has anyone else noticed that they're as rare as hens' teeth except in the changing rooms?

Yes, it's annoying isn't it. Another peeve is going into M and S and seeing a mannequin wearing an outfit or piece of clothing I like the look of and said item is nowhere to be seen anywhere in the shop.

Lack of mirrors ..totally . And I loathe the sweaty faff of using changing rooms , especially in winter when one wears multiple layers and boots . It's a shame because clothes and footwear are the only items I purchase offline . Plus finding the same shops in every town and city nationwide is largely full and doesn't inspire me to shop much anymore .
I believe the high street as we know it will not survive .

Airport shopping is also awful. When we went to Spain last year I realised at the airport that I’d forgotten to pack DS swimming trunks and goggles. It turns out you cannot buy boys’ swimming trunks at Gatwick. Designer handbag yes - ordinary holiday requisite at an airport primarily serving the holiday market - no. Plenty of girls’ fashion available but not even basics for boys.

There's just too many negative factors against high street shopping now. The councils really shot themselves in the foot with car parking charges. People need good reason, now, more than ever to bother with the high street. Not more reasons not to bother! It's just not inviting anymore. It's a cuppa, the sofa and the laptop for me and ever increasing numbers of people. It won't change unless councils and the government really want it to. Or perhaps the days of the high street are just over?

Like ratchethandler said: I don't feel that I, or the general public, owe the high street a living. If it cannot provide a decent service it deserves to fail. Sad but true.