To wonder if middle class children appear more ‘scruffy’

[Workingclass]

Went to a Childs party today for an old school friends DD (they are incredibly middle class) and her group of mum friends (who are equally as middle class)

I admit I don’t usually socialise in many middle class circles but I couldn’t help but notice that all of the children looked... scruffy, for want of a better word.

None of them had brushed their hair, they were all in mismatched clothes with muck on their faces. Didn’t look bathed..

I feel awful saying it, but I notice this also with the MC children at the DC school, has anyone else noticed it? I’m just curious as to why this seems to be a thing? Does my dds plaits and dresses ‘out’ her as having a working class family?

Is it more of a privilege thing? We don’t have much money so am weary of being judged as lazy by not doing her hair, I also make an effort to dress her nicely so she doesn’t look like ‘the poor kid’ is it that if your middle class you don’t have that fear?

Absolutely happy to be told IABU and judgemental but I am genuinely curious on the subject.

That's interesting Maisy I have a working class upbringing too; much complicated by stuff I can't go into online. Culturally, despite real poverty, my upbringing was all about the books, the education. All but one of my siblings has a degree, though we don't all share similar cultural interests. Significant union activity features, though. Is this inherited?:o My present lifestyle (hideous word) is resoundingly middle-class.

Since I left my home town, the vast majority of people I've got to know have been born and raised middle class. Did/do I feel different? Quite often, though never inferior. It's no mistake that my DH was also an educated working-class man. I didn't consciously select him on that basis, but it was there nevertheless.

As an aside, do you socialise with “farm workers” 😂😂😂😂 who wrote that dross

I listen to "The Archers" every day, Does that count?:o

echt
That's interesting.
I think you make a good point about sometimes feeling different but never inferior. That's sums my feelings up.

DH has a middle class background but never considered it until we talked about memories growing up and there were so many differences. We're both well educated and keen to have a comfortable but not well off lifestyle.
We have friends with sinilar incomes who do lots of travel and have fancy possessions but we've put our money into getting a nice house in a nice area. When friends came to see our new house many of them were surprised at it and then it clicked that we have our house but they have nicer cars and a more luxurious lifestyle. Swings and roundabouts really but it would be boring if we were all the same.

I thought the term 'underclass' went out years ago!!

@huggybear

Class is alive and kicking in the U.K.!! If you can't see this, then either you are not in the UK or you're living with your head firmly buried in the sand 🤷‍♀️

Underclass is a relatively new term tbh, if you’re having trouble identifying them, they’re the ones you secretly don’t want your kids playing with

What about family size? I've been 'accused' of being both posh and very much not posh for having 4 children. 2 children is seen as safe and respectable it seems. Perhaps that is a middle class thing. Certainly easier to keep 2 looking clean and tidy as opposed to a large troop!

fuck
Isn't underclass (hate the word) used when people want to differentiate between good old fashioned working class people who are nice, polite & have a work ethic vs those who choose to be loud, anti-social, sit around Maccies all morning in fluffy tracksuit and fluffy boots. (I would say chavs who behave antisocial but it's a mumsnet taboo and anyone who uses it gets yelled at by people claiming people like that don't exist, despite anyone living in a working class area being able to confirm they do)

@christmasknickers

Really? Well I can't think of any occasion where I've actually thought about what class someone is. Who cares? Perhaps it's more prominent if you have kids.

@MaisyPops

Correct!

not British here, can't identify with particular class, but grew up much poorer. We were raised with a notion that clothes were expensive and to be cared for, not damaged. When washing machines weren't around, washing was a big chore - so an extra care not to get clothes dirty. Now no such worry - just sling it in a washing machine, or if beyond repair, just bin it and buy new - so no problem if kids' play gets messy.

Isn't underclass (hate the word) used when people want to differentiate between good old fashioned working class people who are nice, polite & have a work ethic vs those who choose to be loud, anti-social, sit around Maccies all morning

It shouldn't be. The working class, unsurprisingly, are those that work (and are exploited by the bourgeoisie), while the underclass are those denied access to the labour market.

I’m in a very middle class area and yes most kids are scruffy. Filthy coats, filthy lunchpacks for school. Worn out shoes and trainers. Most of the houses are filthy too.

This thread turned very unfriendly. I did agree with some of the opening sentiments- that yes, i am middle class (though my kids wear plenty of cartoon characters), no I don't care that much whether they look scruffy, yes on reflection that probably does come from a position of privilege. That's all really. I wasn't making any particular value judgments, but nor was i resolving to mend my ways because I still don't care very much. I have two DDs, i am sure there will come a day they are obsessed with their appearance. At 7 and 3 they have their own style preferences and I indulge them. I still don't really see that I am doing anything particularly wrong.

It’s the same with hand me downs and second hand clothes. These are a badge of pride for the middle class.

Many poorer families won’t touch them for fear it’s not good enough.

As an aside, do you socialise with “farm workers” 😂😂😂😂 who wrote that dross

I listen to "The Archers" every day, Does that count?

Listening to The Archers is almost certainly a key indicator of being middle class .

Filthy bunch the middle classes. 😁

Kids go to school in a very middle class area and yep we have the younger siblings doing the school run in the fairy wings, wellies and tutus combination (DD2 insisted on dressing as a dalmatian for about a week when she was younger so I can't knock that one - at least the dalmatian outfit didn't cause havoc with car seats like fairy wings do)... but they pretty much ALL love supermarket clothes fodder with the more unicorns and swipey sequins the better (7 year old girls not being noted for their understated taste in clothing as a general rule). Loads rock up with those unicorn horn hairbands on as well - thankfully our school is not one that obsessively micromanages uniform rules.

The difference tends to be the bedraggled hair - on both sexes to be honest... mind you if it makes me look working class to have my kids' hair plaited back - bring it on because getting nits out of DD2's long thick hair with her sensory issues is a fucking nightmare! There's no way I'm letting mine go to school with their hair loose and flowing - and funnily the other teacher-parents seem to take a very similar line on that particular one!

DD2 tends to look dishevelled anyway because of her dyspraxia when she's dressing herself and her hair being naturally so blooming thick and wavy (jammy fucker - poor DD1 and me have the most ridiculously fine and uncooperative hair).

Definitely the case round here that the working class children are immaculately turned out (plaits, massive hair ribbons, dresses, kneesocks, patent leather shoes). The parents tend to look extremely rough though - as though they have completely let themselves go. Greasy hair that hasn't been cut, old tracksuits or pyjamas, scruffy shoes. Worst of all are their facial expressions - hard and ugly. Clearly life is hard but they still have hope for their children.
MC children may look scruffy but their parents, although probably 10 years older, tend to look better.

Yeah that's about the size of it Maisy.
I would call those people chavs or scrotes. They are not representative of the entire working class! I HATE "underclass" though. It's like untermenchen(sp?)Horrible connotations.
I'm loving all the oh-so-wide eyed comments about how "my children are just too busy being imaginative with mud to ever brush their hair, unlike those shiny-shoed commoners who are all in debt to pay for designer crap and never let their kids play freely"...
I know this is a shocking idea on Mumsnet, but honestly working class parents make dens in the woods with their kids. They take them fishing. Sometimes they even (gasp) read books! (Not just Take-a-Break). They just also wash them and brush their hair!
And what's with all the snarky comments on "intricate plaits"? If you know how to do them, plaits take a few minutes, they keep hair nit free and for many types of hair they are pretty essential. Better plaits than lice, or tangles you have to cut out fgs.

I have spent a lifetime trying to look casually thrown together. Even in jeans and a tee shirt I look immaculate. My children did too even in Boden hotch potch.

4 children can be posh because when I worked in the city all the partners had four kids at expensive private school. I think it was a bit of a status symbol. Whereas the lower/middle middle class who aspire to have a certain lifestyle for their children recognise that comes with a price tag and they probably can't afford more than 2. Of course they could afford more than 2 if they had different priorities/values which is where I suppose the "not posh" comes in. Again, no judgments intended. My kids don't attend private school.

IfNotNowBernard
Gosh I haven't heard the term scroates in a while.

We were working class and played out, made dens, read books and managed to turn out ok. We had leggings and classes and non branded shoes (except school shoes which had to be properly fitted because mother had this big thing about having properly fitted school shoes).

I'd love to be able to do plaits against the scalp. They're so practical and pretty.

Within any group of people there's the try hard folk who want to present a certain carefully curated image.

I think most of us just bimble along doing what we like, not fitting in to an exact strereotype.
Interesting that 4 kids is a status symbol. That might be true, especially if they are close in age. My friend has 4 but they are 2 much older than the next 2 (as in over 10 years gap) as she had 2 with her second husband. That's probably less expensive as the older 2 are working now!

Really interesting discussions
I don't agree with defining class by what shop you buy your kids clothes from though. I hate labels, I think it 50% con/ 50% marketing with most stuff made by kids in sweatshops and labels stuck on and prices x100 for 'designer' clothes.