To think this job spec is asking the world for very little money?

[naughtybutniceandaspice]

I can't quite believe it.

NHS, I know. But even still. I'm shocked. £20-23k to do all of this?

What do you think?

AIBU?

I have been working in private sector and would get paid over £30k (outside of London), for that.

Being a decent PA is a highly skilled job that not many people can do. You have to have a certain skill set. It’s not easy at all. I would say it’s a very skilled job

Being a junior dr is not exactly unskilled or easy, and not a job anyone can do. But another poster said that’s only 27k.

So for skill level within the nhs the pa pay would be correct.

The issue is shit pay generally. A jr dr skill set should be wort at least 35k. Then 25k for a pa would be reasonable too.

I’m glad I got skilled in 3 times!
But yes the whole point is it’s all shockingly badly paid.

Depressing really.

Really a newly qualified nurse would be band 5. All qualified posts are band 5 and above. All roles that don't require professional qualifications are band 4 and below. Hence this role being band 4, and being paid 20-23k.
I'm sure a PA in a private firm has a good chance of being laid more. In the NHS there is no room for discretion. The banding are set and roles must fit into them.
Someone said below that they felt the NHS may be willing to pay 30k to an 18yo with the right soft skills. Nope!

It's a good salary for an admin role, it's the same you'd get as some teachers and they have way more responsibility.

Qualified social workers where I live are paid £24-£28k. I think wages are shockingly low.

It's the NHS ....they expect you to work very hard for the money you earn and as someone who works in the NHS right ....that will be a busy demanding role,.

I'm sure a PA in a private firm has a good chance of being laid more.

Is that what is meant by 'additional benefits' ?

That's true and you're right, but everything is relative, and that job is not a skilled position so on the spectrum of wages, it should be on the lower end.

Basically this. Everyone is the NHS is horribly underpaid, that’s just the truth. But I am surprised that a PA in the NHS would earn roughly the same as a newly qualified doctor when the skills and experience required are poles apart.

@dorsetdollymixture

Sounds like public sector pay not an extraordinary job spec.

Its because it's NHS
dispatchers and technicians are band 4
Emergency call handlers who have a horrific job are band 3!
Admin is usually better paid than them - I'm not belittling admin but it's amazing that they can pay less to people responsible for others lives

So I think what I’m saying, is that in a system where people doing clinical jobs where a mistake could have devastating consequences are paid so poorly, that is a surprisingly high salary for a job doing admin.

That’s not to say admin is unimportant, it’s obviously vital, but it’s not skilled in the same way, and it doesn’t carry the same level of responsibility.

Obviously, out in the real world, a salary of £23,000 isn’t a hell of a lot. But comparing it to what others in the NHS are earning, it looks pretty good.

It's mad - I was a pa 20 years ago not in London for 21k - oh and it's not easy

In my (large, public sector) organisation, the salary "banding/grading" of a PA is determined by the "definition" of the people they support. So one of the PA's I knew who was great at her job couldn't be paid equivalent to another PA who did the same job for someone of a similar level (Department Head of a similar size/type of department) just because her HoD wasn't a member of a particular board. As soon as he was added to the board later in the year, she got an instant regrading and pay rise, even though her daily job didn't change one bit. Stupid but that's the public sector for you - bureaucracy.

Sadly the NHS is notoriously badly paid. You can be a band 3/4 in the NHS and have a job as a mental health support worker dealing with people in crisis, working with complex mental health conditions or you could work as a porter and earn the same amount.

The NHS pay salary system needs overhauled, but that'll never happen as it isn't really that long ago since that was done.

It IS basic admin. Diary management isn't difficult....

Sounds overpaid to me if anything.

Makes diary management is not basic admin. It just isn't.

You think it's overpaid... that's shocking. Did you read how many people's schedule that person would be responsible for? Can you imagine what it would be like if that goes tits up?

You think it's overpaid... that's shocking. Did you read how many people's schedule that person would be responsible for? Can you imagine what it would be like if that goes tits up?

I’m sorry but responsibility for schedules is nothing compared to responsibility for lives.

The consequences of a pa making a mistake are a few upset senior management. The consequences of a junior dr making a mistake is a dead patient.

Now are you seriously telling me an nhs pa should be paid more when dr’s are on 27k?

Nhs pay is set. This job does not have the level of responsibility that comes with higher pay.

Yes... try working in a Global Corporate...

I do complex diary management plus my day to day role.

Stop trying to make it sound harder than it is.

Just to respond to the comparison to doctors wages: Doctors do start on substantially more I believe once you factor in their shift allowance. I used to work in medical staffing and the basic starting was low but the shift allowance was almost the same again so take home would be more. Although aware that might have changed, it was a long time ago!

It seems pretty underpaid to me; the PAs in my organisation do an awful lot of juggling: minuting complex meetings, organising nightmare diaries, generally knowing where everything and everyone is, managing the putting together of the annual report by making sure everything is in the right place at the right time, managing their directorate's training requirements and more.

I have what I guess is a more difficult job than that, but not much more difficult, really. I work in the NHS in finance and feel pretty well paid for what I do: I'm a band 8a and my job is paid better than a lot of private sector positions round here. So I don't think the NHS is universally poorly paying!

@naughtybutniceandaspice of course it could go tits up
But you aren't likely to be hauled up in coroners court unlike a band 3 who spends every day listening to people 🤷🏽‍♀️

I've said it before but the average job life span of a call handler is 7 years before they burn out. I've heard babies born, babies die, people begging their relatives to live, people murdered, peoples last words, last breath, talked to women straight after a rape, Cumbria shootings, calls that have made me wake in the night crying, calls that have made me throw up in a bin at my desk. I've seen grown men sobbing after taking calls in the middle of a terror incident, colleagues collapsing, been threatened to be raped/shot/stabbed and called everything from a hero to a cunt

Of course admin paid at what, 2 bands higher is underpaid...

I cannot believe the posters on here saying that diary management is a "very" skilled role, high responsibility, complex, not basic admin.

Yes, it requires organisation and multi-task management, good people skills, and so on, but the key point being ignored is that wages should be relative to impact, responsibility level, risk, prerequisite training or education... Not what some Radom on the internet who's only ever been a receptionist or dinner lady thinks

All jobs, be it admin worker to chief scientist or CFO, are vital for most companies to run... They are all needed. But their importance is relative. If a PA fucks up my diary as an accountant, there are a few miffed people and noses put out. If a junior Dr fucks up.. well.

We've just lost three senior administrators to the NHS because the pay was better and the roles less demanding (justice sector)

When I started work that sort of role would have been a 'secretary' and would certainly have included diary management. It was one up from a 'clerk typist'. When the term 'PA' was invented, it was only ever used for someone like a managing director's secretary, because she had additional senior responsibilities over and above a regular secretary's job - ie she was the most important secretary in the organisation. Her seniority was in direct relation to the seniority of her boss.

And now it appears that nobody is called a clerk typist or a secretary any more, and everybody is a PA or an administrator. So the hierarchy has become somewhat blurred.