Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to not want to look after my Father in Law (FIL)?

133 replies

CarolineTheChemist · 18/12/2018 15:34

Apologies in advance for the length of this post. I know it's really long and I'm sorry if it's rambly. Smile
I've been skulking around the internet trying to get advice about this for a few weeks, but nothing seems to quite fit my situation. I also hope that by sharing it someone else will benefit in the future.

My AIBU dilemma is how much I'm prepared to help my in-laws, specifically my FIL, but to understand how we arrived here I need to give some history.

It all starts just over 3 years ago when my MIL left my FIL due to his controlling behaviour. To start the separation she moved out of the family home and began staying at the flat my DH (then boyfriend) and his brother were living in.

My DH (32) and BIL (36) had bought the flat together the summer before and at xmas my BIL decided he was going to move to Australia in the autumn, it was just for a year for his work. My DH then asked me to move in to replace BIL - this suited us both as we had already been discussing living together. A couple of months after we agreed this my MIL (65) left my FIL (66), it was around easter time, and started staying at the flat. Before then, she had been staying quite frequently at my BIL's invitation (it might be worth noting that he's single/divorced), but she always went home at the end of the week/weekend. My DH wasn't that keen on having her there so much, but BIL and DH never discussed it. Non-communication is a recurring theme in their family.

There are only two smallish bedrooms and a single open plan living area, so rather than sleep on the sofa my MIL alternated sharing the double bed with each son every couple of nights. During this time my DH/Boyf spent a lot of time at my shared house so that he didn't have to share a bed with his mum. During the first few months after she left, my FIL stepped up his controlling behaviour by writing horrible anonymous letters to my MIL's friends, hanging around outside the flat trying to see my MIL and leaving her abusive voicemails etc. At their parents' request, DH, BIL and their eldest brother (40) tried to mediate the separation, there were family meetings which ended in arguments, they avoided communications via solictors because of the expense. MIL often directed the brothers to take messages to FIL and fetch her items from the family home where FIL Was living, but she would not communicate with him directly. FIL is very old fashioned and believes his wife should obey him and not have friends that he hasn't chosen for her. MIL said she wants to be independent and life her life without his control. (tbh, I'm not sure she knows how to be independent, espesh after 40 years of being married to him)

After a few months things calmed down a bit, but 3 more months went by in this casual arrangement, with my MIL spending morning, noon and night watching loud trashy TV in the shared living space and getting more and more comfortable in the flat. Whenever I was at their flat whilst MIL lived there DH was very highly strung. He would not touch or hug me, would not even sit next to me on the sofa. He got very frustrated and snappy when she would not clean up properly after herself. I thought he was going to explode when he found her using metal spoons to scrape his expensive non-stick saucepans. The poor guy was very stressed :( BIL by contrast seemed to tolerate it well as MIL did all his laundry and cooking as he works long hours (he's a surgeon). On a slightly related tangent, BIL had asked DH to do some of his laundry and cooking when they first moved in together, but DH told him that categorically was not going to happen. The date that BIL was moving to Australia was fast approaching and at that point I told DH that I wasn't going to move in with him and his mother, so unless she found herself something more permanent, I needed to find a new place to live as I was scheduled to move out of my house when BIL left.

Again, no one in the family had discussed MIL's plans for the future or what was happening with the separation. All we knew is that MIL would not divorce FIL because it was shameful. She would not respond to questions about where she would be in 6/12 months, only that she wanted FIL to visit a psycologist. FIL did oblige, but didn't like psycotherapy so only attended a few sessions. As the move out date approached, both BILs started applying pressure to DH that MIL should move in permanently and take BIL's room until MIL and FIL had sorted things out. He said no, I don't want to live with my mother, I want to live with my girlfriend, just as BIL gets to move to Australia as he wishes and other BIL gets to live with his wife and 2 children.
Both BILs applied some more pressure (MIL was silent) but stopped when DH pointed out that MIL couldn't afford to pay half the mortgage, and neither BIL wanted to have to pay this for her. It might also be worth noting that during the separation eldest BIL didn't have his mother to stay for even a single night.

DH then asked his MIL to start making plans for a permanent place to stay because she couldn't stay at the flat after BIL had left. MIL didn't take it well and cried a lot. BIL laid into DH saying what a disgrace he was and how disgusted he was with DH's selfish behaviour. BIL said that if he was DH, he would have taken out a loan to pay the mortgage if that's what it would have taken to have MIL stay there. BIL isn't great with money and already owed DH money for shared bills that he had not paid. DH felt guilty about asking her to leave, but feels it was a reasonable thing to do.
MIL and FIL also own a house abroad, so DH suggested MIL go there until she had decided what to do with herself. She did this for a few weeks, admittedly this was a bad idea as FIL found out and followed her there and began harassing her again. She then went to Australia to stay with BIL for a few weeks, then came back and stayed in various friends' spare rooms for another 5 months. She occasionally came to stay with us at the weekend, sometimes because her friends had asked her to give them some space. When she was with us she used to make comments about how her friends would wait on her, bring her doughnuts, tea, cakes and biscuits etc. Things that we did not do when she was staying with us - we don't keep these things in our home and neither should she because she has type II diabetes! Winter came and went and in the spring, she started proceedings for a non-molestation order against FIL, after this was granted she got a 6 month occupation order for the house. A year after she had left him, she moved back into the family home and FIL moved into a bedsit in a nearby town.

Fast forward 2 years, this is how they have been ever since. DH and I got married a year after I moved in, we didn't invite any of his family or mine, we just had one witness each. Partly because we're saving money for a house deposit, and partly because we knew his MIL and FIL would argue if they both attended. It was easier to not invite anyone than have to pick favourites and/or deal with all their bullsh*t.

DH didn't see his father for the best part of a year, he was ashamed and disappointed at how he had behaved, but felt sorry for FIL as he was alone and had lost many friends and family as a result of this separation. FIL lives in a single room in a mouldy old house. He could afford to live somewhere nicer, but chooses not to. We think it's because he likes the company of his housemates. MIL and FIL have a lot of debt so FIL keeps his money in cash so that their creditors are not aware of it.

MIL still refuses to communicate with FIL and FIL has asked (via the sons) for her to sell both houses and split the assets so he can move on. She doesn't want to because she likes that house (4-bed detached house) and wants to stay living there. The last time FIL asked for this was a few months ago. As far as we know MIL has still not responded to this request.

MIL and BIL are still very close although BIL has a girlfriend now (25). BIL often pays for MIL to do and have nice things, like getting taxis instead of using her bus pass. MIL is living off a state pension, so isn't very wealthy and is still paying down the debts that she shares with FIL. DH has offered her money for practical things like roof repairs and a cleaner, but she would prefer him to pay for her holidays like BIL does and has asked for money for this. She explained that BIL bought the flights for a holiday to India, so perhaps DH could pay for the accomodation and other BIL for spending money. We haven't been on holiday nor had a honeymoon as we're still saving for a house deposit.

If you're still reading now then bravo, cos this is where it gets to the sticky AIBU....

Recently, FIL has been very ill and was diagnosed with cancer a few weeks ago. They think it's operable and hopefully will lead to a good prognosis without the need for chemotherapy. DH and the other brothers are upset that their father is ill and living in a horrible room.

Although the occupation order has long sinced expired, MIL will not have him back in the family house, nor will she sell it or the other house, nor do an equity release. She has said that if one of the sons moves back into the family house then FIL can stay there whilst he is ill. MIL suggested that if one of the brothers will not move back in and be there 24hrs a day (nevermind that they all have jobs), they should get FIL a live-in carer instead. This costs around £1000 per week. BIL agreed to this, but DH and eldest BIL think this is a ludicrous expense. When they pushed back, MIL sent them all a long message saying how they owed MIL and FIL to pay for this because they spent money on bringing them up as kids, clothing and feeding them. How she was ashamed by how heartless they were, and how they should not expect FIL to pay any of his savings towards this 24hr carer if they truly cared about him. She repeated all the stuff BIL had said about DH's behaviour when he asked her to move out of the flat. When I read it I was so angry, who has children with the expectation that they will "pay them back" when they get old. Eldest BIL and DH refused further and said that this was an attempt to guilt trip them into doing what she wanted and it wouldn't work. FIL doesn't actually need a 24hr carer, but MIL wants one as she does not want to be alone with FIL.

Unfortunately, BIL had already told FIL he was allowed back in the house, but since DH and eldest BIL refused to pay for a live in carer, he can't. FIL is angry with MIL and has responded by telling his brother (uncle in law/UIL) to permanently move into MIL and FIL's house abroad and threatening to disinherit MIL from everything and anything. He called DH and told him to arrange for a solicitor to draw up FIL's will removing MIL from inheriting anything if he dies. DH refused as he didn't feel comfortable doing this to his mother, especially as she would still be left with their joint debts. Needless to say, my FIL's behaviour still isn't great. I can see why MIL does not want to live with him.

Despite all this crap, DH has asked if his father could come to stay with us whilst he is recovering from surgery. This could be a week, this could be 2 weeks, it could be longer. It would depend on how ill he is and how guilty DH would feel about asking him to leave. We have a small 2 bed flat, one bedroom is ours and the other is a dressing room with a mattress on the floor for the occasional guest. This is where we would sleep if FIL moved in. I work very close to home and often arrive back 2/3 hours before DH does. DH has just stared a company and is working long hours to get things off the ground. As a consequence I often do the vast majority of the cooking and grocery shopping. Also, my husband doesn't drive, so if FIL needed taking anywhere that would fall to me too.

AIBU to say that I do not want my FIL to stay with us? I understand that he's ill, but my MIL and FIL have created this shitty mess and have had years to sort this out, but haven't. As a consequence this is creating arguments between me and my husband. I love him and clearly want to support him whilst his Dad is ill, but I have to draw the line somewhere. We've only been married a year ffs, still haven't bought our first house. DH's family walk all over him like a mat and he feels guilty if he doesn't do their bidding. He says he likes it when I force him to stand up for himself to them (i.e. not agreeing to pay for a 24hr carer or his mother's holiday wishes), but where do I draw the line on a man with cancer?

I knew his family were crazy before I married him, but he's such a lovely guy. Sad He has a heart of gold, he's a great friend, but they totally take take advantage of him. ARRRGGGGGHHH Angry Angry How did I end up with these crazy people in my life?!?!??!!?!??!!?!?!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!

Thanks for reading this. All opinions/comments/suggestions welcomed :)

OP posts:
SushiMonster · 18/12/2018 17:41

I mean, there was no way I could make it to the end.

But whatever that batshit family want NO NO NO NO NO. STEP AWAY

diddl · 18/12/2018 17:44

"That your lovely DH's Bros are leaving him with this problem, is beyond shitty."

Perhaps he needs to be like his brothers & refuse to make it his problem?

Absofuckinglutely · 18/12/2018 17:52

I feel for you. And definitely DO NOT let your FIL get a foot in your door.

Your MIL sounds so immature and irresponsible. She just expects other people
to care for her, like she's a child / victim and just takes and takes. Sounds like she buries her head in the sand about reality, procrastinates and actively avoids sorting out finances and legal arrangements with your FIL, which would actually help them both move on in a far more sane way. And then she wants hand outs for holidays but she neglects upkeep of her house.
Madness, she's a nightmare. She needs to grow up. I don't know how your DH can hold his tongue, I feel like he and his brothers have been enabling this shit for far too long.
As for sleeping in the same bed as her adult sons ConfusedHmm, I mean what on earth?
Seems your FIL has been a total dick over the years too. What a pair!

Honestly, do not let him stay. And put a rocket up your DH, he really needs to get a bit of backbone and stop enabling his mother's crap. The finances and house situation does need to be sorted as a priority. Your FIL can't disinherit your MIL while they are effectively still married.
Even if they legally separate and don't divorce, the houses can be sold and more realistically sized ones bought so they can get on with their lives independently.
Good luck, I think you might need it! X

StormTreader · 18/12/2018 18:01

The BIL who is making all the noise about who should do what is the one who should be putting them up for the foreseeable, since hes just so concerned and all that....

NurseButtercup · 18/12/2018 18:09

sending you a massive hug and a large glass of Wine or Gin whichever you prefer(or both).

I've seen your updates and you're making the right decision, this reads as though you mainly came here for a sounding board.

People have commented about your FIL being able to have carers/respite accommodation being provided by hospital. Access to these resources are mean tested so depending upon how your FIL declares his assets/savings, plus his prognosis post surgery he might not be eligible for free carers/respite accommodation.

Good luck & dare I say merry xmas xx

trojanpony · 18/12/2018 18:18

Glad the almost unanimous noooooo is of assistance.

I think You/your husband needs to talk to his brothers/SILs and get them on the same page.

Namely,
Suitable accommodation is needed for both parents.
The family home MUST be sold (&the holiday home if needed) and TWO suitable properties purchased.
The funding of luxuries (like hols to India needs to be stop immediately “put on hold” until the practical day to day issues are resolved.)

MIL can’t have it every way - she needs to buy him out (which she can’t) or sell up.

Your husband might benefit from some kind of professional support during this time or at least having regular conversations with you to “refocus” because when you have people rewriting history and coming at you with emotive demands left right and centre it can be hard to see the wood from the trees.

This is evidenced in a lot of their past actions which sound bonkers don’t make a lot of sense practically speaking if you look at it objectively.

sackrifice · 18/12/2018 18:20

Also, I found it very weird that she shared a bed with her two 33 and 36 yr old sons for months and months. DH shrugged it off at the time, but it was weird getting into his bed and finding her nightie under the pillow...

Eek, this is horrid.

And yes, the answer is 'no'. You are not being in the slightest bit unreasonable.

Parisetoile · 18/12/2018 18:21

Absolutely not. Actually, its not fair on anybody if a sick person is left to recover in your flat. Everyones health will start to suffer and you do not know how long this will go on for.
There are alternative places to go for convalescence depending on age/circumstances, I know it's not easy, but this is absolutely the time you say no before you lose your mind. It is better to be the monster now than three months down the line. Please be strong and value yourself, contact a cancer support charity for some support.

Absofuckinglutely · 18/12/2018 18:29

Also, I found it very weird that she shared a bed with her two 33 and 36 yr old sons for months and months. DH shrugged it off at the time, but it was weird getting into his bed and finding her nightie under the pillow...

I find this lack of boundaries quite shocking actually. Look up parental enmeshment.

I admire your tenacity. I'd have run for this hills after the nightie thing. Urgh.

Belindabauer · 18/12/2018 18:34

In short, no, don't do it.

BlueJava · 18/12/2018 18:39

Don't let FIL move in. I suggest you distance yourselves from MIL and FIL and BILs as much as possible and don't become part of their drama. FIL is an adult - he finds his own care. MIL should make her own arrangements. Frankly it sounds like they should divorce and sell both properties and buy 2 small flats so they live apart! Feel really sorry for you - what an epic mess!

MargotSimpson · 18/12/2018 18:46

YABU for the unnecessarily long post

YANBU for not wanting to take care of FIL

AngelsSins · 18/12/2018 18:47

No way would I have a man who sees women as beneath him, stay in my home.

HoneyDoo · 18/12/2018 18:51

OP, may I ask what culture your DH is from? I only ask because a lot of what you say sounds very, very much like a culture where children are EXPECTED to do their parents bidding, even after they've become independent adults. You mentioned your DH being told that it was his 'duty' to do the right thing, the right thing being what suits other people, even when their demands are completely unreasonable.
You have also mentioned property overseas where you FIL has commanded a family member to move in, meaning they are perhaps originally from somewhere else and they have retained a base there.

You may wonder why their culture is important to know? If they are from the culture that I am assuming (Indian/Pakistani etc....) then in terms of dealing with the situation that puts a whole other slant on it.

SummerGems · 18/12/2018 19:01

Honestly? The fil may well be an abusive arse but the mil sounds as bad if not worse. Sharing a bed with her sons who didn’t see that as an issue? I’d be wondering what other issues were at play there e.g.whether the brothers had possibly been abused by her when they were children as this is so far outside the norm that it’s creepy as fuck.

The answer to having the fil move in would categorically be a no. But I would go further and inform him that if he wants to disinherit mil he needs to file for divorce otherwise she will inherit everything when he dies.

And then I would go nc with the lot of them.

bastardkitty · 18/12/2018 19:42

Maybe it would focus your husband's mind if you told him that unless he steps right back from the circus that is his parents (and siblings) and starts putting your marriage first, he risks losing it. This is about two pathetic adults who don't have the maturity to get divorced and are engaged in a relentless battle to pull their children into this circus. I just can't imagine how much stress this has caused you OP.

Chasingdandelions · 18/12/2018 20:56

I'm not sure if I've read the entire thing correctly but am I right in saying the MIL is refusing to sell the house , which I presume FIL paid at least half of , so instead expects her son's to pay the cost of his care instead? They sound like children themselves and shouldn't be dragging their sons into it. I wouldn't care for FIL and I also wouldn't pay for his care.

MortyVicar · 18/12/2018 21:04

OP you've said that your ILs and DH are from a culture where the younger ones are expected to look after their elders. Would I be right in thinking that therefore it's also part of the culture to see divorce as shameful and likely to have one or both parties (but probably the MiL) shunned?

That being the case it isn't as easy as saying they should get divorced, they've been brought up with a mass of cultural beliefs and expectations.

You're going to have to be DH's backbone and spell it out to him (as you have done, but you might have to keep doing it) what your response will be.

GreenTulips · 18/12/2018 22:26

The fil may well be an abusive arse but the mil sounds as bad if not worse

This!

FIL needs a solicitor and force the sale of the house so they can buy separately.

HeebieJeebies456 · 18/12/2018 23:19

If they won't officially divorce then FIL still needs to see a solicitor to get advice about selling/separating the properties and cash.
He might be able to force a sale as well seeing as he has care needs.
Mil needs to understand that half their assets are his and this mess needs sorting.
Otherwise if he goes into a care home then the house may well be forced to be sold and mil loses out more in the long run.
Better to divide the assets now so at least her half is 'safe'.

Without at least one of them getting legal help i don't see this going anywhere but in circles.

tillytrotter1 · 18/12/2018 23:39

Personally I think the MIL is the villain of the peace here, she is being totally inflexible about the house, he needs to take her to court and get an order for selling it, and the house abroad, and splitting the assets, she wants a cosy existence at everyone else's expense but hers.

Lovingbenidorm · 18/12/2018 23:42

Fuck no

Jamiefraserskilt · 18/12/2018 23:50

So mil has both houses and will not sell.
Fil chooses not to live somewhere smarter.
Both of them are in a shitstorm of their own making and both crying poor me.
Do not have him to stay.
He can arrange care during his illness and they will come to him where he lives. He should file for divorce and division of the assets - something that should have been done long ago.
Both hold the answers yet are pushing their mess at their kids. Fuck that.
All kids should push back and force them to sort themselves out. Whilst you are all enabling them to carry on, they will.
Mil is greedy and delusional. Fil is playing victim.
His illness is very sad and worrying but it does not change a thing as far as their messy break up is concerned.
Please tell your husband you will not be accommodating his father as you fear for your safety and wellbeing and so should he.

Blondebakingmumma · 19/12/2018 03:21

FIL cannot move in with you as his behaviour towards women is abusive.

MIL is selfish and immature. I don’t understand why the properties haven’t been sold or split between adults. If they really don’t want to sell if they are worried about debt collectors, they could take turns living abroad and at home e.g. 6months home/abroad then swap

Don’t get sucked into this mess

70isaLimitNotaTarget · 19/12/2018 18:35

I thought your PIL were going to ask you to move into the family home to minister 24 hour care !

(My D Granmother expected my DMum to leave her family - DDad and my sibling& I when we were 12yo, 9yo and 5yo .... and move to her house to look after them ( my Grandparents ) that;s a "No" )

Stand Firm