To feel absolutely sick to my stomach about this story

[MissyCooper]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-46535996

Clearly I’m not unreasonable. I can completely see how this could happen.

What they can do to prevent it happening again, in a time of staff shortages and pressures...I can’t answer that.

That poor, poor woman and her poor family.

My mum was in the ERI for months. It is a big hospital but it's not that huge. I think people don't tend to use the stairs that much though. I was visiting weekly at weekends and in the middle of the day and I never saw another person on the staircases. I was in several different parts of the hospital as my mum moved wards a few times.

Absolutely horrific and so so preventable. I was furious when I first read it.

Vulnerable and unwell postnatal women should not be expected to make the journey to and from the neonatal unit unaccompanied - but of course they are. God, even thinking back to being on the postnatal ward myself, I was expected to abandon my newborn at my bedside and walk out of the ward and down a long corridor to collect my meals. I’d had surgery for a third degree tear and could barely put one foot in front of the other.

Also, why are disused wards and stairwells not given appropriate signage to stop people from wandering into them? Why are doors not locked? It’s an absolutely sickening series of failures.

I saw the headline in a shop this morning, found the story online and have thought about it all day.

I had my daughter there and she was taken to SCBU at a few hours due to low blood glucose and jaundice. I was discouraged from going down with her, so they could ‘settle her in’, then given brief directions to go and visit. I spent the first three days walking a long way round, every two to three hours, through the day unit waiting area until I worked out the proper route. I had high blood pressure and was anaemic, they refused to test my iron levels for three days and I remember feeling like I was going to pass out as I went to and fro. I doubt the staff on my ward would even have noticed I was gone. They messed up discharging me and left me, still with high BP, without care for a day too.

Poorly designed to have babies so far from maternity wards. But at the very least Mums should be shown the way and entry routine in person for the first visit. There should be lines on the floor/wall to show the way and you should have to sign in and out of each ward. I wish I had not felt so overwhelmed and had complained at the time.

Vulnerable and unwell postnatal women should not be expected to make the journey to and from the neonatal unit unaccompanied - but of course they are. God, even thinking back to being on the postnatal ward myself, I was expected to abandon my newborn at my bedside and walk out of the ward and down a long corridor to collect my meals. I’d had surgery for a third degree tear and could barely put one foot in front of the other.

This. Just read the threads on here about how women are treated in postnatal 'wards' - with even new hospitals designing them to be overcrowded wards where postpartum women are left to share one toilet for 6 (or more if they allow the partners to stay overnight), fetch their own meals, look after the baby alone and often treated like total nuisances for asking for a couple of paracetamol after major surgery.

If she had pre-eclampsia she should have had far better monitoring.

Cheshire, we were allowed to spend as long as we wanted on the baby unit, except during rounds for other patients privacy. However if you are still a patient yourself someone should be aware of where you are and how your health is. This was something I felt was greatly lacking during mine and my daughter’s stay.

Very sad indeed for all concerned. However I suspect there will be more come out at the post mortem.

There was another bit on the BBC news a young, 24 I think year old colapsed and almost died, some pre existing condition. The bad headaches she reported sound very suspicious but all in very sad on what is one of the happest times in most peoples lives:(

Why are people saying the headaches are suspicious? What are they implying? Is that not a symptom of pre eclampsia?

Anyway does it matter? The fact is she was able to wander away and no one knew where she was. She was vulnerable.

Because the headaches could have indicated she went on to develop eclampsia and should have been better monitored after the birth, not allowed to be up running around on her own.

I don't think she developed eclampsia. I read that she suffered a haemorrhage? Not on that link but on something I read previously?

Doesn't happen often but very occasionally women can have a secondary post partum haemorrhage in the days after giving birth.

Sadly staffing levels don't allow for the majority of women to be accompanied because the midwives are caring for 10,12,15 women and babies. Normally if someone has got a medical issue such as very high blood pressure then they'd be advised not to leave the ward at all, even accompanied because the last thing you want is someone having an eclampsia fit in the middle of scbu. Some women if they're well but struggling mobility wise may be taken in a wheelchair but a lot have had a normal birth and are generally ok to take themselves, though I appreciate it's not ideal.

It's an absolute tragedy though.

sky news

Absolutely heartbreaking.

There are good reasons to get women back on their feet after childbirth, even surgery, because it lessens the risk of developing clots and post-op pneumonia etc. But sometimes they are a bit harsh about it. Personally, I had a c-section at 6pm and was on my feet and off to see my baby as soon as the catheter was taken out in the morning, but not everyone had the same (relatively easy and painless) experience as me, and for some people even sitting in a wheelchair is agony. Nursing staff often have very little sympathy because ultimately they care if you heal, not so much if you hurt when doing so. :( No one ever asked where I was going or asked me were I was, and some nights I slept in the neonatal ward with my baby... Probably not a good sign.

In my hospital the neonatal unit has 2 doors - one onto the main corridor and one directly into the maternity ward. I am shocked and saddened to discover that this is not the case everywhere! I can't imagine having to leave the ward and wander the halls to get to my baby. 😭

Why are doors not locked?

Possibly for fire safety reasons?

Dd was in NICU and I can totally see how this could happen. I got wheeled around 6. hours after surgery to meet DD then wheeled back to the ward overnight. In the morning they came and removed my catheter and helped me out of bed. I showered (very shakily) and they came and took blood as I had lost 1.5l during emergency section.

I then asked if I could go and see DD and they just said yes make your way there when you’re ready. To say I was a little surprised would be an understatement, I slowly made my way round. Once I’d been there for a couple of hours the postnatal ward called saying they needed me back. Turns out my blood count was crazy low and I needed a transfusion 🙄 I was only told this once I’d walked (wobbly) back to the ward by myself....

As others have said once the baby is here the mum is just seen as ‘baby x’s mum’ something that really needs to be worked on

When I had a dc in NICU and I'd had a c/s they wouldn't let me go off the post natal ward unaccompanied for I think 48 hours. It was very frustrating as they couldn't spare the staff to take me down there for long and I was doing well so I really resented not being able to spend much time there.
If I'd had a VB then maybe I could have wandered off as much as I liked.
Fundamentally it has to come down to staffing of post natal wards and the standard of care they offer.

Yeah. I have had two sections. I’ve been lucky enough to avoid SCBU etc but I was appalled (particularly the first time round) that after nearly three days of labour, failed forceps and an emergency section in which I lost a lot of blood, that they wheeled me into a ward in the early hours and handed me a baby to take care of. I was beyond exhausted, could barely move and wasn’t right mentally at all. I wasn’t well enough. DD kept choking on her mucus and I was too scared to go to sleep.

That few days in hospital (Ninewells - blue lighted there) was one of the most scary times of my life. I barely knew whether I was coming or going.

I can totally see this happening. I had a premature baby due to pre-eclampsia and was not monitored or accompanied at all going down to NICU after the first day. We were allowed to stay as long as we liked, even when there were ward rounds there was a family room you could sit and wait in so you didn’t have to go back up to the ward. Frankly though, how would the midwives keep track? They were massively overworked and nowhere near enough of them to accompany mothers of sick babies to NICU, especially as I was on a high risk ward so there were a few of us.

A truly heartbreaking story. I can't find the words.

Not surprised she got lost, I used to work for the NHS and some of the teaching hospitals were difficult to navigate when you were not used to them.

Oh my goodness, her poor family and that little baby.

I had eclampsia after the birth of my second baby and the headaches were like nothing I’ve ever experienced (and I have bad migraines with an aura). I can easily see how you’d be disorientated and could get lost with one. I also had a PPH with that birth and was weak and ill. I needed looking after, I hate to think of what might have happened if I hadn’t been. Poor woman.

I gave birth there earlier this year, induced early because I had pre-eclampsia. I had bad headaches for a couple weeks post partum and was readmitted several times by local midwives as i was showing signs of being close to seizures. Kept in over night then released in the morning without ever having been assessed every time!!
I think its such a poor set up for a maternity unit! I also gave birth in the old ERI and that was so much better.... amazed they went backwards when designing the new hospital.

All they need is a whiteboard with patient names on and a time out, same at NICU, time in/time out.

Orderlies could be used to accompany mums to and from surely, to make sure the journey was mDe safely and they could call for help if necessary.

She’s from my home town. I know people who knew her.

I also had my DS1 in that hospital. He spend his first days in SCBU and me in HDU, after that I was left to get about on my own. SCBU and the wards seem really far apart in my memory but are probably pretty close. But it felt like miles when I was shuffling along them in agony. And it’s definitely easy to take a wrong turn.

That poor woman, and her poor family.

Many years ago I had my dd in a public hospital in Mexico. She had to stay in an area where they gave her special care. I was always accompanied when I wanted to visit her and I could visit as often as I wished.

I've not been in the maternity unit but I didn't find the ERI easy to find my way around when I was in for a clinic and again overnight. A rabbit warren which all looks the same and lousy signage - just try finding a loo.

They don't have enough porters or orderlies or staff to man a whiteboard. This poor woman was too sick to be walking about alone.