To think this is ridiculous and will mostly affect the poor of London?

[mothertruck3r]

www.standard.co.uk/news/london/new-emissions-zone-to-hit-drivers-with-1250-a-day-pollution-tax-a3858531.html

I understand he wants to reduce pollution but how is this going to help the hundreds of thousands of poor people who can't afford to buy a new car, pay the fee (£12.50 per day!) or pay the fine, especially after people were encouraged to buy diesel cars?

Great if you are rich and can easily buy a new car but there are loads of poor people in London who can't do this and rely on their old car for their jobs, taking kids to school, disabled getting about etc.

It's not very well thought through. I thought Labour was supposed to be the party to help the poor. Seems all this will do is help boost new car sales for big manufacturers whilst screwing a huge part of the electorate that voted for him !

I'm really panicking about this - I need to drive a van around London for my business (which involves transporting heavy items from one place to another, so public transport is not an option). As a small business making around £27,000 profit per annum, there's absolutely no way I can possibly afford another £3,000 every year.

I feel something of this magnitude, which has the power to make or break people's lives, is a huge issue that should be included in a mayor's manifesto before the election, not just brought in when there's nothing voters can do about it.

Also, like PPs have said - why on earth should owners of classic cars get a special dispensation? I feel so horribly let down by Sadiq Khan - bring on 7th May 2020.

Great if you are rich and can easily buy a new car but there are loads of poor people in London who can't do this and rely on their old car for their jobs, taking kids to school, disabled getting about etc.

Actually loads of poor (and not so poor) people in London rely on public transport because almost half of London households have no cars. About 40% of households have one car and that car quite often is not used for daily commute or driving children to school.

I cant understnad why you would need to drive in central London. Just take the tube. (disabilities / SEN etc obviously different).

I need to drive a van around London for my business (which involves transporting heavy items from one place to another, so public transport is not an option). As a small business making around £27,000 profit per annum, there's absolutely no way I can possibly afford another £3,000 every year.

Then you and others doing the same business will have to increase your prices accordingly. Shouldn't be a problem if your competitors are hit by the same tax as they'll have to hike their prices too.

Good. That's what needs to happen. When the earth dies, then so do we.

I support this 100% and I'm poor, I don't even have a car.

If there's one place where this should happen, it's London. The UK taxpayers have paid a fortune to subsidise London's public transport system, so it's only right that the people living in there use the service we've all paid for, even though most people outside London have to put up with crap public transport and often have no alternative.

Then you and others doing the same business will have to increase your prices accordingly. Shouldn't be a problem if your competitors are hit by the same tax as they'll have to hike their prices too.

Increasing my prices when the economic climate is so unstable? It's been hard enough to keep my head above water this year as it is, so yes, of course it's a problem.

Have you not been following the news? Time is running out for the climate (or rather for the human race, as the planet will adapt and a whole new lot of species will emerge that can live in the changed enivronment) and there is a major air pollution issue in London that is affecting the health of all its inhabitants, particularly children.

For the majority of people, there is nowhere easier to live without a car than London. Supermarkets deliver, there are buses and trains and tubes and trams and new cycle lanes. We have a car but we hardly ever use it (and we certainly don't have more than one), and I admit I would miss it, but not as much probably as I think I would. If you were really poor in London, you wouldn't choose own a car - what a waste of money. It is a waste of money for most people in London. I know lots of 'carless by choice' people, who use a mixture of public transport, bikes, car clubs and when really necessary minicabs to get around.

Of course, unfairly, rich people can afford to absorb this cost, but it is about reducing vehicle use, not deliberately penalising poor people.

I don't think you need to be rich to live in London. I'm certainly not....I'm a nurse working for the NHS. I just happen to be over 50 and bought my home at a time when property was still affordable. There are also people living in social housing and in rented property, admittedly because they can't afford a deposit.

Oh and I don't drive either. I've got an oystercard, a bike, and a fine pair of legs, ta (though my husband drives a modest fiat panda, unlikely to be effected by the emissions charge.)

Unsure I sympathise, but what would you do if your van broke down tomorrow? At least you can trade in your old one so will get some money back, and can get the tax back on the difference. My DH is self-employed so I do understand how difficult unexpected business expenses can be, but you would have had to replace your old van one day.

A scrappage rebate would definitely have helped. Not sure why they could do it ten years ago but not now.

Is it worth pointing out car ownership in the affected area is already in the minority? Should the majority suffer the pollution?

content.tfl.gov.uk/technical-note-12-how-many-cars-are-there-in-london.pdf

Take a look at page 11.

My DH is self-employed so I do understand how difficult unexpected business expenses can be

Thanks Sashkin. It's a huge additional expense for someone like me who earns relatively little. I'm afraid it's the sort of thing that can - and almost certainly will - break a business like mine (and I am sure there are plenty of others in my boat).

Birmingham are planning to introduce a 'Clean Air Zone' to be brought in , in 2020 too - Council is voting to formally adopt the process tomorrow I believe.
Thing is, Birmingham doesn't have the tube, not free transport for kids either, and the whole 'cleaner air for our dc' argument doesn't work, as they want to push the traffic out to where poorer people actually live, around the inner ring road - which is already as congested as possible.
I don't think anyone is going to come out and say they don't think cleaner air is a good thing, but taxing people who can't afford to replace their cars with new ones is not the solution.
The country needs to set up some action groups (with actual teeth) which are cross political and don't change every time there is an election and look at solutions that might actually work. This is just a fundraising 'putting a plaster over it' rather than tackling the issue.

I live within this zone and have a car affected. It is rather galling that we bought it because as a diesel we were told it was better for emissions but now appears to be worse for the environment.

However I would also very much welcome improvements in air quality

We have to clean up the air, and it won't happen without some painful changes

So the rich get to keep their cars and to enjoy life made easier for them with less traffic whilst the poor are funnelled onto already over crowded and ever rising over priced public transport. Sounds peachy.

I live just outside the zone. My GP, supermarket, dentist etc etc are all inside the zone. My childrens swimming lessons are inside the zone, and also their main weekend hobby. We can't afford to buy a new car. But also can't afford to pay £12.50 on a regular basis, but due to the time getting to these places takes on public transport (eg, a 20 minute drive to work for me, would take 90 minutes on public transport) that isn't an option. Excellent.

With everyone seemingly claiming public transport is perfectly useable in every situation then why don’t we just ban cars in London? Surely that’ll be completely fine no matter what? Or at least according to your reasoning. This change won’t make enough of a difference to really fix anything and just penalizes those who can’t afford a new car while completely not affecting anyone rich (not even their classic car hobby).

Living in London sounds horrendous...why do people do it!

At least if all cars were banned it would equalize things and the rich people in power would sacrifice as well.

I dread to think how workable and expensive getting 2 primary kids to school and 2 adults to work on time via public transport every morning would be.😱

Well we've all got enough time to change our activities/doctors etc so we can use ones we can get to.

There are loads of classic cars dead cheap by the way - think you just need something over 25 years old - I had a midget I paid £600 for (I don't have it now)

@Gogreen

Umm because some people are born there and their entire support system is there? Better job and pay opportunities? Personal preference?

I mean I moved away (across the ocean) but it still annoys me when people make such unhelpful comments on every single thread vaguely relating to London.

Why are classic cars seamed ok?Isnt allowing them just going to force everybody into buying dirtier older cars. It should be no cars at all.