To think I have effectively been dismissed?

[Autumnwindinthewillows]

I worked at an office less than 5 mins walk from a major transport hub. The firm then moved to an office with no easily accessible public transport but the arrangement at the time (or so i thought) was that staff with cars would pick me up from the old office. With staff changes this is no longer happening and I cannot get to work without an hour long journey on public transport plus a 1.5 mile walk which is not feasible.

The bosses have basically reneged on the deal and said it is my problem so it would seem i am out of a job. Can I claim constructive dismissal?

At least you have a belly. Mine has a diamond shape hole in it from when I struggled through a war zone to ensure I kept my 100% attendance record.

Whilst a rush to the bottom isn't a good thing, I think it's fairly clear that the OP has had a much easier run of her commute lately and it is reasonable to point out that many people do have less than ideal commutes.
PengAly
Sadly that had crossed my mind. Starting to enquire about constructive dismissal, then mentioning disability later, then not going into work and telling work that they'll be doing hours that suit them.
I've seen similar patterns in the workplace before which is why I'm cynical (person had lots of help and support, things changed a bit, reasonable expectations, refused to do them/decided they would do what they could and nothing else, managers picked up on them not doing their job properly, went off with stress, claimed bullying and tried to get paid off).

The OP has said the 1.5 miles is along a dual carriageway which isn't suitable for walking

Hour by public transport and a half-hour walk is my daily commute. It also includes a change of trains.

@SnuggyBuggy

Plenty of dual carriageways are perfectly suitable for wall along. East Kilbride is bloody full of them.. all with footpaths. Many other towns are the same. It's a legitimate question to ask if there is a footpath, flyover or underpass for walking.

Contrary to the vast majority of opinions on this thread, you could actually theoretically have a case. But it’s not certain.

If your contract specifically states that your workplace is the old address, and they don’t have the contractual right to require you to move anywhere else, then forcing it upon you is likely to be a fundamental breach of contract.

You could therefore have a constructive dismissal claim if you have been there for two years, or wrongful dismissal (worth the value of your notice pay) if you resign without notice and you haven’t been there two years. However if your contract has a mobility clause allowing them to move you elsewhere then there wont be a claim as there’s no breach.

Its also further complicated by the fact that you’ve continued to work there. Any fundamental breach will be waived if you continue to work under the contract without raising any objections to it - so the passage of time could have waived any claim that you had.

Speak to ACAS or a lawyer.

I've seen ones I'd walk down and ones I wouldn't. I'm giving the benefit of the doubt on this point

I knew someone in a previous job of mine who was diagnosed with Anxiety and she had a lot of reasonable adjusments made for her. It got to the point that everyone catered to her every need for fear of her gping to HR...eventually she was sacked for bullying a co-worker.

We are very fortunate that so many employers this day and age offer a lot of support for both physical and mental disabilities. Its disgusting that people take advantage of this

@MrsPinkCock Employees can't claim unfair or constructive dismissal before 2 years of employment. The only exception is discrimination cases, but even then, it's very hard.

*Employees can only claim unfair dismissal if they’ve worked for a qualifying period - unless they’re claiming for an automatically unfair reason.

• pregnancy, including all reasons relating to maternity
• family, including parental leave, paternity leave (birth and adoption), adoption leave or time off for dependants
• acting as an employee representative
• acting as a trade union representative
• acting as an occupational pension scheme trustee
• joining or not joining a trade union
• being a part-time or fixed-term employee
• pay and working hours, including the Working Time Regulations, annual leave and the National Minimum Wage
• whistleblowing*

www.gov.uk/dismiss-staff/unfair-dismissals

If none of these apply (and doesn't sound like they do), she has no case.

Disability aside, I think your employers have been disingenuous.

Good employers often make a contribution towards commuting costs for an agreed time after a relocation. Instead your company expected other employees to pick this up. .

Your best hope now if you remain with the same firm is some flexibility over hours or working from home, but I suspect you really need to find another role. Good Luck.

@Milly848

Please re read my post. It clearly states the two year point for constructive dismissal. Wrongful dismissal on the other hand does not have a qualifying service requirement.

@MrsPinkCock What qualifies for wrongful dismissal is set out above, and OP does not meet any of these. Location on contracts mean little,, most contracts say the terms can change as long as the employer gives notice. This is therefore not a breach of contract - offices move all the time!

I just think people telling the OP to get a lawyer etc are not helping. I have been unfairly dismissed in the past, and I was there longer than two years too. I spoke to ACAS, went to CAB, the works. They said there's no point fighting as it's more grief than it's worth so I should just focus on getting another job. I think the OP should take this advice too.

It's a losing streak. Don't fight it. You'll only lose in lawyers fees.

Find a better employer. Loads out there.

FYI i also use a come/chair

I’m confused, do employment contracts explicitly say that the place of employment will always stay the same? What about leases expiring, or the place getting burnt down, or they get a a better premise elsewhere?

@Nicknacky No they don't. They say anything on the contract (including location) can change as long as employers give adequate notice.

Thanks milly I was just confused by MrsPinkCock saying they didn’t have a contractual right to move employees.

The only thing wrong her employer has done here is pressuring other employees to give her a lift- they have a better legal chance than the OP! She hasnt even had a proper conversation with her boss about it, cant believe people are saying she should get legal advice!

Op you should have taken appropriate steps to manage the commute which does not include relying on lifts. You have to take responsibility for this, not just give your employer and ultimatum. I feel you are abusing the system

AIBU is not the best place on this forum to get employment advice.

Hi OP
I just want to say that Access to Work have been incredibly helpful and proactive in helping many people I encounter through the sector I work in and their response time is pretty damn quick. Don't give up hope just yet. I've been amazed at the advice and support they've been given which is precisely what that scheme is for.
Best wishes

OP, you’ve not answered people who’ve tried to help you which is frustrating. Some of us empathise and know what it’s like and there are ways to manage things.

PoutySprout
Normally I would agree, but this isn't asking specialist employment advice though. A quick Google tells you that it's very, very difficult to win a constructive dismissal case and you can only bring a case after working somewhere for a qualifying period of time.
This has been shared with the OP multiple times by multiple posters. (Just like the fact that it's not someone else's job to deal with the OP's commute, she's just been fortunate to have colleagues who would help out & be out of pocket doing so).

Everything else is why it's unfair that colleagues won't sort their transport to work, why they've taken a day off to call the union, why they've told work that they'll not be working their contracted hours.

Maybe I'm being a little cynical but it's probably in AIBU probably as a gamble that people would create a huge mind against the boss whereas in an employment forum the advice would be much the same as the initial advice here.

Why are there so many people who don’t understand that mental illness can cause physical, mobility problems? It’s why there’s a whole question on “planning and following the route of a journey” for pip (although the DWP have just caught up with this).

The ignorance is astounding, some people with mental illnesses can’t use public transport (due to anxiety for example) or would struggle to follow the route.

Not all disabilities are visible.

Yes @Ginandsonicscrewdriver but OP has no problem using public transport as she has been doing it for a part of her journey. What she has a problem with is paying for a taxi or even paying her colleagues for fuel. That's not disability related.

Plus, it's not up to her colleagues to make her life easier, disability or not.

No one's saying that disabilities can't cause mobility issues. They are saying that the employer is perfectly entitled to move offices. The employee is entitled to reasonable adjustments. Those do not include staying at the same office or expecting colleagues to give lifts, or expecting a full time wave for reduced hours

And if the op wants to discuss reasonable adjustments, the way to do that is to act like an adult and speak professionally to her employer. It is not to decide she cannot come in at short notice, effectively issue her boss an ultimatum and threaten to drive without a license. That is not rational, adult , or ant way to behave when expecting a boss to accommodate your wishes.

She has said she can’t walk 1.5 miles and it has been questioned over and over.

@Nicknacky

It depends how the contract is drafted.

If the clause says “your place of work shall be x” with no elaboration, that’s explicit. If it says “your usual place of work shall be X, but we reserve the right to require you to work anywhere within X radius” then they have the contractual right to move the employee (as long as the clause is exercised reasonably).

I haven’t seen a contract in 10 years of post qualification experience that specifically states a workplace location will never change. The point is that often contracts don’t contain a clause permitting a change in workplace location. If the workplace burned down and the business could no longer operate, that could be redundancy or even a frustration of contract. In that scenario the employer may need to continue to pay the employees until the situation is resolved, but it depends on the circumstances.

If a lease expires or an employer needs or wants to move premises, they need a mobility clause to lawfully move the employees to a different location.