To give up my job and set up as a painter decorator?

[sundayopening]

I have a crappy job, and although the annual pay is ok, I have to work anti-social hours away from home (but also have a lot of downtime in-between shifts). The job has no prospects at all, and is low paid - but I get a shift allowance. I currently earn aprox £21,000 pa with this job (I do work in a different field in my 'downtime' so have additional income to live on).

Although I am pretty well educated, I have no real 'proper' work experience (I have always worked, but odd self-employed things - I have been lucky with some great jobs that I have loved) but none look good on my CV for a professional/office job..

I would like to adopt in the near future (I am single & no other children) so will 100% need to change my current job if I am to do this plus earn enough for us to live on.

I have been musing about becoming a self-employed painter/decorator/tiler. I haven't much experience (although I have done most of my home/every home I've ever lived in myself) but I am sure I can learn, I'm pretty handy/skilled in other areas of art/craft.
I can also do flooring/shelves/flat-packed furniture/wallpapering no problem.

I have a degree & masters which is in the visual arts, and lots of knowledge of design/colour etc which might help with client relations etc.
I work neat and tidy, reliable and like to crack on with a job and am personable, so hopefully those traits will earn me repeat custom/recommendations.

I live in the SE, but a comfortable bit rather than a posh bit, although there's plenty of older money around. I'm hoping the type that need their houses decorated!

I could start the business alongside my current job for a couple of years if needed to build up my experience & client base etc. I have been self-employed most of my adult life so keeping books, HMRC etc isn't an issue.

I will need an income of £25k min or £30K to be comfortable, and preferably be able to do some/most school pick-ups and some/most holidays.

I am thinking £150 - £200 pd could be achievable, with very little initial outlay or running costs.
Anyone got any thoughts on how realistic this is, and how difficult it might be to get started?

No qualification, no experience, why stop at painting and decorating? Why not try your hand at a bit of brain surgery - I'm just waiting for the thread when op gets savaged on her local Facebook group for leaving a botched job at 2.30pm to do the school run 😂

A couple of you have given me a bit of a giggle comparing brain surgery to decorating! Come on guys!

Of course people would be pissed off with a poor finish/someone who doesn't know what they are doing....I have been burnt by 'experienced' shit plumbers/decorators/builders etc (I feel like its the majority to be honest) just like most people.

I would be aiming to be at the top of what I do, and yes I don't expect to be better than someone who is excellent and has years of experience, but they aren't as common as you might think.
I feel the competition isn't that competitive, yes there are wonderful PD people out, and there are a load of rubbish PD out there, still making a living.
I'm not aiming to be crap, I'm aiming to be very good and combined with my other skills/attributes feel I could give it a good crack at the whip.
There's actually been a lot of good advice and tips on this thread, but I am a bit confused as to why someone people do seem to equate brain surgery with P&D......but then, maybe they are in need of a brain surgeon more than they are in need of a PD, a few chips on shoulders me thinks!

Its the Englsih disease Sunday Opening..

Start a business in say the USA, everyone you know will want shares in it and will do what they can to make it a sucess.

Start a business in Asia and all the family will want to join in and make money.

Start a Business in th Britain and everyone will tell you it can't be done and won't happen and you'll fail at it.

And when you are sucessfull they'll scratch your brand new car out of spite as you proved them wrong:-(!

Sorry for delay replying Sunday - I'm actually in Essex but Disclosure Scotland are the people who do CRB checks for all without a silly Admin fee.

I charge £150 a day, when I started I charged £100 a day for the first 6 months to build up a portfolio, I then upped to £125 and after a year £150. I can now only realistically earn more by upscaling and employing people.

Kitchen spraying is definitely in demand. I'm off to a free decorating seminar this week in Coventry and attending a demo on paint spray techniques with a view to booking myself on a course to offer this to clients in the future.

Thanks woo that's really useful to know.
Would you not be able to charge more if you can do kitchen spraying?
I guess people might want the same technique on their front doors too?

Yes, that's my cunning plan . Some p&d's use the spraying technique on all woodwork and the end result is very impressive so it's definitely something I'm going to fully investigated to see if the course and equipment outlay all balances out.

I always use the same decorator who is female (plus works with her male partner)

I chose her on purpose from one of those handyman sites

Turns out she is excellent

So go for it but do develop the right skills first

Painting a room is easy. Painting a room to a high quality finish, is not. There’s a reason why it takes 3 years of training to become time served.

You can’t just “become” a painter and decorator without really knowing what you’re doing.

As PP have pointed out, why on earth would anyone pay you £150-200 a day when they could hire someone for the same price (or less) who has qualifications and years of experience?

Decorating your own house, in your time and budget. Is not the same as running a business to paying customers. However, you could give it a go and see how it goes !

I wouldn’t be happy paying a professional rate for an amateur job. And you CAN tell the difference.

Start a business in say the USA, everyone you know will want shares in it and will do what they can to make it a sucess. where ever you are in the world people want their trades people to be good.

I don't think anyone thinks the op is deliberately ripping people off or is doing anything with ill intentions, it seems rather unrealistic and slightly denigrates skilled manual work as if it is something the middle class can shift down into without doing any training.

It is also a bit unfair on your early clients if you use then as your learning ground and expect to be paid as a fully time served painter and decorator. Nor can i see cluents being delighted if you rock up at 9:30 after the morning drop off and then slope off at three to do the school run leaving their home half done and in uproar and nearly doubling the length of time the job takes.

who has qualifications and years of experience?

Umm what would this qualification be then as I don't know of one?.

Furhermore none of the adverts for local decorataters say anything re qualifications all they do say is they'll do a good job and some have testimonials from previous customers

funky I would imagine I would quote for the job rather than the day rate and won't expect only work 3/4 of the day, it would be nice to do pick-up, and as I know of someone who does this, its not an unachievable ambition.

As you have brought up the class question, I did wonder if in-between the lines some of the more sneering people on this thread might be responding that way because they were being territorial.

People do work hard and achieve things, I have managed quite well in life through working hard and well, I don't think its a crazy idea to have a change of career into a trade - which by definition can be learnt.

I'm not suggesting I want to be a film star, or an astronaut....I am genuinely surprised that so many people on this thread seem to think that even the idea of me becoming a PD who could do a reasonable job (ok the rate of pay/hours etc might not be realistic, which is why I asked AIBU) was impossible, I have stated that I would not expect to launch straight into it....but I might as well have suggested I want to win the London Marathon with some of the replies.

Am genuinely be-mused....but maybe I have got way more self-belief than I thought I did!

Hi OP x My best friends oh is a painter and decorator and all the climbing and plank work does seem dangerous, he sometimes has to hire scaffolding or one of those cherry picking(?) machines for when he's painting outside of houses. It really is hard work as as someone said most people do there own easy painting and decorating and get the professionals in for the more difficult stuff.

all they do say is they'll do a good job and some have testimonials from previous customers

It would have to be a pretty stupid one to put on his adverts that he'll do a crap job and to put on comments from dissatisfied customers! It's easy to talk the talk - a lot harder to walk the walk.

Unless you have previously used a tradesperson or have a referral/recommendation from someone you trust, it's a lottery, so whilst selecting someone with qualifications is not always a guarantee, it increases your chances of picking someone who's competent.

People do work hard and achieve things, I have managed quite well in life through working hard and well, I don't think its a crazy idea to have a change of career into a trade - which by definition can be learnt. - obviously it can be learnt, by a traditional apprenticeship or one of those fast track college courses. What you're proposing Is going out there and practicing on your customers and chsrging them top whack for the privilege. Also, you're under estimating the skill of the trade and devaluing it. That's what's annoying people.

Because of doing the school run, I think you should form a casual partnership with 1-2 other female decorators in your area. A realistic turnaround on a home can often require a small team. You could leave them working while you do the school run and they take a bigger cut. Or the partner takes over from you at 3pm and you split the fee proportionally.
I also think you should go to college classes in technique, but aim for the advanced/masterclass.
Lead with the interior design angle - a decorator with interior design flair.

I think it’s a great aspiration to work towards. And would give you great flexibility

I use a female painter and she is booked up for months in advance.

I like using her because she is good, she is happy to chat to me about paint colours and offers her opinion (which most will not do), and she is respectful and trustworthy around my possessions.

My ex is a painter and decorator. its a ball ache. Dealing with the general public, getting the price right, and you need experience, real experience, you can't just go on a course to learn these skills. it's one thing thinking you can do it, hell, I wallpapered a wall in my bedroom but no way could I do it for a living, and I'm not arrogant enough to think I could.

The market is difficult at the moment for these guys. You have the companies such as Bodgit & Leggit coming in, undercutting the pro's, don't be one of those. If you want to do it that bad, go to college, do the proper course and learn the trade properly.

Plus, if you want to work round school hours this is not the job for you. Can you imagine, you're half way through decorating someones lounge or kitchen and you sod off to do the school run. Your client will not be happy, thats a half day to some of these guys and you certainly cannot charge the money you are after if you are not doing a full day.

agree Betty, my DH is an experienced 20+ years and it is tough to out there. He has NVQ 3 and a CSCS card (gold) which reflects his skills. He gets frustrated by people with no experience undercutting.The number of times he has been called in to put a bodge job right is astounding. You are not allowed on sites without a CSCS card so you are limited to domestic work only. Believe me there are also some very awkward customers for whom nothing is right and will try to squirm their way out of paying the agreed price

Agree a price for the job and not per day. So if you need to leave early for school run it won’t be an issue.

Most tradespeople I have had come and go as they please. As long as they finish the job for the price agreed then that is fine with me.

Just make sure you quote clearly in writing so there are no misunderstandings.

Round here you'd get booked through reccomendations. We have not once asked the qualifications of any of our decorators. However if you've done a good job in my friends house then I would happily book you. I think that's how most p+d get their work. School hours would be fine for us also as long as you were transparent about it. And if you were also female that would help a lot too!

if you want to work round school hours this is not the job for you

Have to agree with that. We've got a couple of trusted decorators we use. Both work very long days. The last time we had one of them, he was doing a 8am start and finishing between 5-7. Things have to be done in the right order and there's a lot of waiting around time whilst filler/undercoat/first coat dry. You can't be sanding down in the same room where you've just put on a coat of paint! That's the kind of thing that experience brings to the party. Ours would come straight after lunch to do a half day of preparation so he'd be ready to do a full day (8 hours plus) of papering the next day. He can do a full room in 2 days, that's stripping old paper, sanding down, filling, undercoat, re-papering and finally top coat. Also a large hall, staircase and landing in 4 days with lots of full double height drops of paper. If he was only working 4-6 hours per day, the room would have taken a week and the hall/landing a couple of weeks - I want decorators in and out to minimise disruption, not be faffing around for a few hours per day.