GTA for 15 year old??

[RedSkyLastNight]

I thought this had been done to death, but actually couldn't find anything recent.

DS (almost 15) says that GTA V is the only thing he wants for Christmas. He has already played the game (2 of his friends have it). He followed up asking for it by telling me all the things he thought I would object to and his counter arguments against them. We had an interesting discussion about misogyny. He promised me that if he could have the game he was happy to continue to discuss the themes in the game with me.

Confession - I've never played or seen GTA. I only know what I've read on the internet which is very polarised. After he asked for it I spent some time googling and found mixed opinions on a suitable minimum age.

Do I get it for him (on the basis he's already played it anyway and make it a condition that we keep lines of communication open)? Or is he still too young (and in that case can anyone suggest any good games that he might accept as an alternative?)

Pretty good game, have played it so much but still there's always new things you find if you do something differently. Have moved on to Red Dead Redemption 2 for now though, which so far is another great game from Rockstar.

Whatever, Prof. The context in which people were discussing their own choices was clear from the title - a 15 yr old. If the tile had been 'AIBU for playing GTA as an adult?" I wouldn't even have clicked on it: I'm not into it but adults living in their own homes, paying their own electricity bills and supplying their own entertainment are free to act as they choose.

My children's school recommends layering levels of protection to make it harder for teens to access porn etc... I have them all enabled! So porn block on router, and on devices, and no screens in bedrooms, all phones charging in kitchen overnight etc.. etc... You'd hate my house

Wow, my 16 year old have been playing it for a couple of years!

They are nice, well behaved, hard working normal boys. They know that this is not real life.

Its nothing that they don't see in 18 films. Are you all saying you don't let your 15 year old sons watch 18 films as well?

@pebbledashed

So your statistics (a) don’t actually prove England is one of the most violent places in Europe and (b) simply highlight the fact that we report and record crime far more thoroughly than other nations.

Do you honestly believe that Sweden and Finland are more violent places than Mexico and Turkey? If you do I suggest you haven’t travelled much.

And @pebbledashed

Look at your own data. You claim the Scandinavian countries play less violent games and it supports your theory....

How come according to your “data” that I’m 5 times more likely to get assaulted in Sweden and Finland than I am in the US, where these games are prevalent?

Are you all saying you don't let your 15 year old sons watch 18 films as well?

er, no, they don't.

why?

1. because they wouldn't get into a cinema to see it
2. because we don't tend to watch them.
3. younger siblings, so don't watch in family context
4. because they are 15.

For all those people saying 'my 15 year old plays it and is a nice person' you know that isn't why those of us who say no are saying no? My ds isn't going to turn into a violent criminal because he plays it. But that isn't a reason to let him play it!

and to add to that, the plural or anecdote is not data.

gah spelling - plural OF anecdote

It's a game. As long as your son knows the difference between real and pretend he will be fine. Neither of my sons has car jacked anyone that I'm aware of.

I would hate your house, yes. When parents are so restrictive, it can cause serious problems. If you think your kids won't access porn or adult rated things just because they can't at home, you're probably going to be very wrong.

So porn block on router, and on devices, and no screens in bedrooms, all phones charging in kitchen overnight etc.. etc...

My kids would use a proxy to bypass the block and 4G if WiFi was blocked...

Have you tested your porn block? I was surprised how easy it was to access porn with mine on. (Even easier if someone sends it to you)

Pretty sure my DS played it. But pretty sure I'd have said no to a Xmas present at aged 15.

I know full well that ds could get round any block, and he has phone with data, so I am sure he is watching plenty of stuff he is underage for.

That is inevitable, as is watching/playing stuff at other people's houses. At 15/16, I choose my battles on that one.

That doesn't mean we can't say, that no, he can't watch it on family TV, and no, you can't have a game which I consider to be pure trash.
I am less concerned about it effecting him as in he becomes violent (I do think that is a concern when younger children become immune to violence, but at 15, that boat has sailed)
I am simply saying, I do not want you playing daily, in our home, on a game which treats women so badly, and where it is ok to use foul racist language.

If he used any of that language at home, we would expect an apology, so why allow in a game that is full of it?

This is not being some super restrictive parent, it is simple saying I have some standards! It is also showing him that I value women and they way people speak to each other and about it other highly.
It also shows him that you can make a stand against something popular, and the world doesn't cave in.

Funnily enough he and his friends have plenty to play on on the x-box, and funnily enough, very few of them have GTA.

I was playing games like Doom and Duke Nukem from the age of about 8 on my dad's computer, both of which had 18 certificates. Duke Nukem especially was very violent and full of prostitutes you had to kill.
I played the earlier GTAs a lot between about the ages of 14 and 17. I also played GTA 5 as an adult, about 3/4 years ago.

Considering I was allowed to play all these games, it would make me seem like a hypocrite if I didn't let my child play them at the same sort of age. Yes, they are very violent, but they are so far beyond the realms of "normal", I don't REALLY see the problem...

For a previous commenter asking, I'm female, and in my mid-30s.

No, I won’t have it in the house because of it’s awful representation of women. I don’t really care if the DSs play it elsewhere (17 & 15), they understand that I feel strongly about it and why.

All of DS’s (15) friends have it. I don’t think they play it anymore - he doesn’t ask for it now either. Think they’re mostly back to FIFA with a bit of Fortnight.

When parents are so restrictive, it can cause serious problems.

Parents restricting their children's access to pornography causes the children severe problems?! Pull the other one, love. The only person I know directly who lost access to his children did so in part because he gave his children easy access to porn; they then displayed violent sexualised behaviour as a result. That's a serious problem. Not being protected from stumbling across it!

My kids would use a proxy to bypass the block and 4G if WiFi was blocked...
ghosts Your children use a proxy/4G to watch porn?! Or have I misunderstood?

At this age they are perfectly able to understand reasons for restrictions.

I have played a fair bit of GTA but much preferred Red Dead Redemption 2. You can choose to be an honourable person in it, although there are some graphic scenes. You are required to kill and skin animals for food though so be warned.

Red Dead is not much better than GTA in regards to violence etc but is way better gaming experience.

In GTA I dont think punching, having sex with women is part of the storyline, it is an option you choose (god knows why) to do.

A 15 year old is perfectly capable of distinguishing video game violence from reality. I think it's a good idea to get him the game and carry on discussing the themes with him. It may be that he enjoys playing the game but doesn't like/agree with everything in it, and that critical awareness is important to develop.

I played the earlier GTA games from about 12, along with various first-person shooters. I spent most of my GTA time stealing cars and shooting pedestrians - I was completely aware that it was just a game and it didn't affect my behaviour in real life at all.

(b) simply highlight the fact that we report and record crime far more thoroughly than other nations.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Oh, that's so funny. Ever been sexually assaulted? Never lived in a bad area?

I pop into all these threads and say the same thing. My kids played them much younger. I have to Google the release dates and stuff to find the exact ages but can't be arsed. I bought them mainly because I played GTA when it was a top down game with shitty graphics. When I saw what it was like now (then) I regretted buying it but didn't stop them playing it. That was years ago and they are fine.

At 15 I really don't think it's an issue. You can't control the media they consume at that age anyway.

The question of which country is reporting crimes the most is a key to understanding crime figures. There is much much more public trust in the Benelux and usually Scandinavia as well, so their figures are rather more likely to be more honest than the UKs. But I have probably derailed this thread enough. Can I suggest, I hope the other op doesn't mind, that you have a look at this thread to see how the other half live in Britain? This is our normality www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3426888-To-be-frightened-of-where-I-live-do-I-need-to-toughen-up

You said you're restrictive in other ways. It can cause problems, yes. Are you a qualified educator?

Oh give it a rest, ProfessorMoody. Generally sticking by the official age-guidelines, blocking porn and having no screens in bedrooms doesn’t make me a parent who is causing damage to my children. I’m not saying I’m a perfect parent , no-one is, but despite trauma in their earlier childhood (when my first husband died) my teenagers are all doing great at school, are ambitious and hard-working and are mostly lovely, helpful and happy at home. Oh, and my 17 yr old who could have screens in her room doesn’t because when she tried it a few months ago she realised it stopped her sleeping well.

And by the way, the majority of parents are not also qualified educators and isn’t necessary to help one make sensible parenting decisions. But actually, yes, I’m an experienced university lecturer so as it happens I am a “qualified educator”.

Clearly you have selective reading. Did I say you had caused a problem? No. I said that it can cause problems.

Ah, I was wondering if you had any experience with child development or research in the field.